Bug? [Edit: Not a bug]

[Cunningcairn]

In the attached screenshot a group of 4 LF advanced 1 block forward at a diagonal. This left each with 6 AP which they used to turn so that they would be facing forward. The Levy skirmisher pictured is however unable to turn. Why is that?

Screen_00000000.jpg (469.83 KiB) Viewed 2351 times

[kronenblatt]

Because it's "unmanoeuvrable"?

The manual (12.4.2. Unmanoeuvrable Units) reads:

Some units are Unmanoeuvrable and never get a free 45 degree turn. These include ... raw or untrained units.

And the levy skirmisher is raw, thus maybe then also unmanoeuvrable.

But the unit has 6 AP left, and a 45 degree turn costs 4 AP (according to manual) so it should be possible for it to turn though.

[Lebo44]

45 degree turns costs 4 points according to manual. Diagonal moving costs 6.

So my guess is:
The unit had to turn first (-4) then move on diagonal (-6) for a total of -4-6=-10. So is left with 2 points out of 12 (not 6) and cannot turn (unmanoeuverable).

[kronenblatt]

45 degree turns costs 4 points according to manual. Diagonal moving costs 6.

So my guess is:
The unit had to turn first (-4) then move on diagonal (-6) for a total of -4-6=-10. So is left with 2 points out of 12 (not 6) and cannot turn (unmanoeuverable).

Although the attached picture in the opening post indicates that the unit has 6 AP left.

[Paul59]

In the attached screenshot a group of 4 LF advanced 1 block forward at a diagonal. This left each with 6 AP which they used to turn so that they would be facing forward. The Levy skirmisher pictured is however unable to turn. Why is that?
Screen_00000000.jpg

You could try checking the tooltip?

I recreated your situation and it says this;



So the question now is why 6 APs is not enough to allow this unit to turn?

Edit: So I think that unless we have missed something this is either a bug, or the manual is not telling the whole story about these levy skirmishers.


Paul

[Gaznak]

There is definitely something unintuitive about the movement costs. That levy skirmisher can do a "knight move" forward and over a square and finish with 2AP, and still be able to turn 360 degrees any direction it pleases, but a single diagonal has the aforementioned result.

[SnuggleBunnies]

It is because they're classed unmaneuverable.

[Paul59]

It is because they're classed unmaneuverable.

So what are we missing here?

The Manual says "45 degree turns by troops that are unmanoeuvrable or out of command range cost 4 AP."

This unmanoeuvrable Levy Skirmisher unit has 6 AP left, so according to the manual it has more than enough AP to make the 45 degree turn in my screenshot. Obviously it is not entitled to a free move, as it is unmanoeuvrable, but with 6 AP remaining it should not need a free move to make a 45 degree turn.

Is it something to do with the original facing? I don't see why it should, in my example the unit started the turn facing straight ahead, so a 45 degree turn to the right would just take it back to it's original direction.

[rbodleyscott]

It is because they're classed unmaneuverable.

So what are we missing here?

The Manual says "45 degree turns by troops that are unmanoeuvrable or out of command range cost 4 AP."

This unmanoeuvrable Levy Skirmisher unit has 6 AP left, so according to the manual it has more than enough AP to make the 45 degree turn in my screenshot. Obviously it is not entitled to a free move, as it is unmanoeuvrable, but with 6 AP remaining it should not need a free move to make a 45 degree turn.

Is it something to do with the original facing? I don't see why it should, in my example the unit started the turn facing straight ahead, so a 45 degree turn to the right would just take it back to it's original direction.

This would be its second 45 degree turn, and it can't do it because it is unmanoeuvrable.

[kronenblatt]

In the attached screenshot a group of 4 LF advanced 1 block forward at a diagonal. This left each with 6 AP which they used to turn so that they would be facing forward. The Levy skirmisher pictured is however unable to turn. Why is that?

Is it something to do with the original facing? I don't see why it should, in my example the unit started the turn facing straight ahead, so a 45 degree turn to the right would just take it back to it's original direction.

This would be its second 45 degree turn, and it can't do it because it is unmanoeuvrable.

OK, that then makes sense in Paul59's example. (EDIT: OK, maybe it doesn't necessarily make sense, since it has 6 AP left after all, and a 45 degree turn costs 4 AP.)
What was the unit's original facing in your example, Cunningcairn? (I was of the assumption, don't know why, that the unit was already facing diagonally in the direction that it then moved, but maybe that wasn't the case.)

[Paul59]

It is because they're classed unmaneuverable.

So what are we missing here?

The Manual says "45 degree turns by troops that are unmanoeuvrable or out of command range cost 4 AP."

This unmanoeuvrable Levy Skirmisher unit has 6 AP left, so according to the manual it has more than enough AP to make the 45 degree turn in my screenshot. Obviously it is not entitled to a free move, as it is unmanoeuvrable, but with 6 AP remaining it should not need a free move to make a 45 degree turn.

Is it something to do with the original facing? I don't see why it should, in my example the unit started the turn facing straight ahead, so a 45 degree turn to the right would just take it back to it's original direction.

This would be its second 45 degree turn, and it can't do it because it is unmanoeuvrable.

Is that mentioned in the manual? I can't see it. Maybe as it only affects one unit in the game there is little point.

[Cunningcairn]

In the attached screenshot a group of 4 LF advanced 1 block forward at a diagonal. This left each with 6 AP which they used to turn so that they would be facing forward. The Levy skirmisher pictured is however unable to turn. Why is that?

Is it something to do with the original facing? I don't see why it should, in my example the unit started the turn facing straight ahead, so a 45 degree turn to the right would just take it back to it's original direction.

This would be its second 45 degree turn, and it can't do it because it is unmanoeuvrable.

OK, that then makes sense in Paul59's example. (EDIT: OK, maybe it doesn't necessarily make sense, since it has 6 AP left after all, and a 45 degree turn costs 4 AP.)
What was the unit's original facing in your example, Cunningcairn? (I was of the assumption, don't know why, that the unit was already facing diagonally in the direction that it then moved, but maybe that wasn't the case.)

It was the second 45 degree turn and explains why it could not turn again but I don't understand why it was classified as such.

[kronenblatt]

Same type of situation, but with a maneuverable unit. See below. I thought that a 45 degree turn cost 4 AP and thus was possible to conduct as long as 4 AP was available for the unit. But that's not the case, as a general rule, whether maneuverable or unmaneuverable?

Screen_00000148.jpg (259.04 KiB) Viewed 2074 times

[rbodleyscott]

Same type of situation, but with a maneuverable unit. See below. I thought that a 45 degree turn cost 4 AP and thus was possible to conduct as long as 4 AP was available for the unit. But that's not the case, as a general rule, whether maneuverable or unmaneuverable?

Screen_00000148.jpg

After the first such turn, the cost goes up to 8.

[kronenblatt]

Same type of situation, but with a maneuverable unit. See below. I thought that a 45 degree turn cost 4 AP and thus was possible to conduct as long as 4 AP was available for the unit. But that's not the case, as a general rule, whether maneuverable or unmaneuverable?

Screen_00000148.jpg

After the first such turn, the cost goes up to 8.

Thanks: good to know! And that 8 AP cost for a second 45 degree turn applies to all units, whether maneuverable or unmaneuverable? (So given that an unmaneuverable unit had 8 AP left, it could then make a second 45 degree turn?)

[rbodleyscott]

Same type of situation, but with a maneuverable unit. See below. I thought that a 45 degree turn cost 4 AP and thus was possible to conduct as long as 4 AP was available for the unit. But that's not the case, as a general rule, whether maneuverable or unmaneuverable?

Screen_00000148.jpg

After the first such turn, the cost goes up to 8.

Thanks: good to know! And that 8 AP cost for a second 45 degree turn applies to all units, whether maneuverable or unmaneuverable? (So given that an unmaneuverable unit had 8 AP left, it could then make a second 45 degree turn?)

Not sure, I think probably not. Will look at the code when time permits.