Here is a little update.

After looking through the files and playing the game a bit more, I have discovered even more things that I can change, which means changing the game for the better.

In addition to squashing a few bugs (Hall of Champions, Celtfanatics, etc) I have found a few problems in ...

There is a bug in the game that allows a few factions to build Hall of Champions, but produce no squads.

This has been fixed.

Well, I have good news.

I fixed the Hall of Champions bug as well as few more I found.

In addition, after playing the game for a while I noticed things that needed to be changed, so I'll make the changes and I'll let you know what I came up with.

Quite a good little game.

I just started playing legion Gold - pretty good game.

I am also a modder and I will see if I can fix the "Hall of Champions" bug, plus a few more I found.

Just wanted to add a few things:

1) stalins_organ - enjoy playing Commander, and I hope you have nice summer :D

2) I think this topic is interesting, yet it seems to remain largely unexplored. I think it would make an interesting research paper for someone who is taking history in university ...

I am starting a new job tomorrow and will be very busy, so I doubt I will have any more time to contribute to this topic further. However, I think there is more than enough info in this thread for the reader to judge the issue for himself.

Were the Far Eastern divisions effective? All the ...

I wouldn't read too much into Yelna - the So'vs concentrated 2 tank and a motorised division in the 24th army at that time (102, 105 tank, 103 mot), which seem to ahve done most of the attacking, and the Wikipedia claim of 45,000 German casualties seems a bit far fetched, since they started with ...

The issue under discussion is not that the Siberians came all at once, because we already knew that they didn't.

nope - that was the only thing that I and others objected to, and for which we were roundly condemned by...er....some.....

The issue, I think, is whether the Siberians were effective ...

A note to modders:

In order to setup the Soviet Far Eastern units historically, I would suggest the following:

1) 3 Corps and one tank unit (to represent 16th and 24th Armies). They should be experienced and they should be placed in the Ukraine on June 22, 1941.

2) Several more units (a few ...

Um....the 24th army was sent to the Ukraine where many veterans of Khalkin gol were assembling...??

sounds to me like the veterans are different to the army!

there weer many divisions in the Soviet army - many European ones fought well too, but often their story is lost in the general disaster of ...

keep in mind if your units have 65% effectiveness and lose 35% they go to 30% effectiveness, so the drop can be that much as a % of where you begin - it is a linear drop, not a % drop.

I see - that makes sense.

I wonder if it would help having a poll of players to test how effective their units ...

Let's look at the Siberian 16th Army:

16th Army soldiers were mainly veterans and were highly trained. Not only did they fight as a cohesive army, but some of these divisions were transferred elsewhere to help stabilize threatened areas.

According to Soviet historian Erickson, "Road to Stalingrad ...

I think perhaps the winter of 1941 should be more severe for the Axis. Guderian noted that his tanks were practically immobilized for a period of time.

35% reduction is too small imo.

In the winter of 1941 it should be more like 60-70% reduction in effectiveness for the Axis; maybe 25% for the ...

Sorry for not responding sooner, just finished two exams.

OK, S_O, yes you are right about the Siberian 24th Army. Some divisions were sent to other sectors, while newly raised (rookie) units were added to it.

In addition, units from the Far East were usually sent to a variety of other armies ...

See what I mean about information being fragmentary.

Glantz, in "Stumbling Colossus" , on page 16, shows the Siberian 24th Army in reserve just to the east of Moscow in December, 1941.

Erickson, "Road to Stalingrad", p. 268, also agrees that the 24th Army was part of the reserve front behind ...

This seems a good point to ask, can the engine even do this?

Is it possible to give a player reinforcements as actual specific units, and if so can they start with experience?

I don't think so.

I hope it can.

This sort of thing gives the AI a great deal of help. This sort of thing has been ...

I did mention the idea a number of times to them and could never get them to do it!

I also wanted commonwealth units to arrive in Suez at some point - representing Indian, SAF, AUS & NZ divs

but NP Unger - its an interesting discussion - I do like Glantz, and recognize some of errors on German ...

In my readings, there were far more than 12 divisions that were transfered from the east. Easily, more than double that number.

To help the discussion, let's break down the units and trace their activities.

So let's start with the first two units that were transferred to the west.

These two units ...

I also think the discussion of the Siberians started off on the wrong foot.

It assumed an adversarial type of discussion, which I think was based, again, on certain assumptions.

Hence, I would prefer the discussion to be more cooperative in nature. Clearly, in my reading I have found a great deal ...

Yes I read it, but it wasn't footnoted and written by Glantz so I'm surprised you think an unsubstantiated remark like that should carry any weight at all.

I've done a search for Siberians in the beta forum - there is no such discussion that I can see - I do hold that opinion, but I think Possum ...