Encirclement/Siege Question

[jdarocha]

On occasion I have surrounded an enemy city with various units trapped inside, my units around the city have all of the ZOC’s held, so nothing gets in and nothing gets out. My understanding is that each turn the city is surrounded the units inside will get progressively weaker due to lack of supply. So, my question is (if I have the turns to spare) how many turns should I wait for the enemy units inside to become so weak that my assault will basically be a cake walk? Or is it more a case of when I attack them, they don’t resupply, and therefore they get weaker after each attack?
Thanks in advance
Halder

[goose_2]

You are describing I think an aspect of Order of Battle not Panzer Corps.

If you have a unit surrounded, I recommend that you suppress as much as possible with bombers and artillery and then hit with your strong soft hit units, usually other infantry, and seize once enemy unit is destroyed.

[ycloon]

This is based on my understanding of PzC mechanics (i.e., may not be entirely correct):- I don't think a besieged unit gets progressively weaker just by being surrounded. If your besieging units do nothing to the besieged, the besieged unit's strength points and supply (ammo+fuel) stay unchanged. To deplete its supply, bombard with level bombers. To solely deplete ammo, you could attack the unit, although this risks damaging your own units. Once the besieged unit's supply is depleted, its resupply rate diminishes and drops to zero if surrounded by three (?) or more of your units.

[turn4441]

Actually, a besieged unit does not lose any ammo/fuel just by being surrounded and will also continue to entrench (if not attacked or it doesn't attack you), albeit at a slower rate if fully surrounded and dependent upon the type of unit and the type of terrain in the hex. So they will only get harder to remove due to the continuing entrenchment. As 'goose' said, to make an easy 'cake walk' attack, use air/artillery to both reduce the besieged unit's entrenchment and suppress it, then attack. Ideally, reduce the entrenchment to 1 (the next attack will reduce it to the zero necessary for a surrender), fully or mostly suppress it, and then attack with a unit that inflicts minimal damage to them, therefore providing maximum prestige for you when they surrender. As they are mostly/fully suppressed there is little danger to your unit. As 'ycloon' mentioned, resupply is slower or nonexistent depending on the number of your units around it, but if they don't move, don't attack, or aren't attacked, then they don't need more supplies as they haven't used any.

[TSPC37730]

Surrounding a unit in PC does nothing to reduce an enemy unit's supply. Only attacking it directly or bombing the unit with strategic bombers will reduce its supply levels. Parking at least 3 of your units next to the enemy unit - but not necessarily surrounding it - will deny the target unit the chance to resupply during its turn. As a note, I've never seen a strategic bomber reduce an enemy unit's ammo count below 1 - so, it will get at least 1 shot at you.

IMO the best way to disable the defending unit is to attack it with artillery & strategic bombers until all strength points are suppressed. As a bonus, each attack reduces the enemy's entrenchment by 1 - even if it does no damage.

You can see the suppression level by mousing over the target unit. On the right side of the screen a colored number next to the target unit's strength number shows its suppression level. Once the suppression level equals the strength number, the unit will be unable to fire back during your first attack. Be careful with any follow on attacks, however. After your first non-artillery ground attack, any suppression is wiped away & the defenders will fire back against the next attack with their full remaining strength. The moral of the story is to make that first punch a good one.

Suppression2.jpg (41.96 KiB) Viewed 3687 times

[ycloon]

Hey TSP, thanks for sharing. I have noticed that a level bomber cannot reduce ammo below 1. I will be more attentive and bear that in mind.

[ycloon]

Oops, I meant "not noticed". My bad.

[jdarocha]

So what is the tendency of a besieged enemy unit; once surrounded will it just sit there or over time will attempt a break out? Does the besieged unit's behaviour depend on the difficulty level one is playing at?
Thanks again
Halder

[ycloon]

I am not sure PzC's AI (even at level 2) is smart enough to break out - i.e., attempt to link up with nearby friendly units, unless it is some sort of scripted event. Based on my experience with the AI, it generally prefers to attack your weakest unit. I suspect that is also the case when the AI unit is besieged.

[TSPC37730]

I don't think I've really seen a unit try to "break out". The AI's goal is to prevent you from capturing the objective. The worst I've seen is a unit attack from the targeted hex but remain in it after the attack. Usually, the AI will attack the weakest unit it can find - such as an artillery or recon unit. If the AI defending unit has a spotting range of 1, you can often bait it into an unfavorable attack by parking supporting artillery outside of its spotting range.

[jdarocha]

So, If I have an enemy unit besieged and I don't really need the city or objective that they are occupying my best option is to leave it alone.

Now, let's say that I have bypassed an enemy unit, so that it is behind my frontline with none of my units near it. Will it stay put or try to move towards the frontline? If it stays put, then I don't need to worry about it but if it will eventually move, then I should take it out or besiege it. In some scenarios you can suddenly get partisan units running around, causing issues but I don't think regular units that have been bypassed and cut off behave this way, I don't know.
Thanks much
Halder

[ycloon]

Based on my experience, I think the AI will send its units to re-take victory hexes rather than move towards the frontline. While having enemy remants attack your forces from behind is certainly bad, having an enemy unit re-take a victory hex is more problematic IMHO. In my playthroughs, I guard against enemy units re-taking victory hexes but I don't explicitly guard against enemy units attacking my frontline units from behind. Examples that I can think of are Modlin (GC39), Dijon (GC40), Kotelnikovo (GC42 East, Stalingrad Ruins path); there might be others. I've only encountered partisans in two scenarios: Vitebsk and Storming Stalingrad (both GC42 East). In either case, the partisans were not a big issue. Even in these scenarios, I suspect the partisans' objective is to take one or more of the victory hexes rather than to destroy your units. E.g., in Storming Stalingrad, the airfields to the west are victory hexes that if left unguarded could be easily captured by partisans.