overwhelmed by unit choices

[davea]

I find the huge number of unit choices, with tiny tiny differences, to be a little overwhelming. Is there really a reason to have over 75 different tank units, or 45 different infantry units? There are no two *quite* the same. Even if the unit name is the same, the red, blue and green variants are fractionally different. Like one has +1 movement but +50 cost, and another has +1 defense. I could ignore this and just ignore two of the colors. But then, there are occasional units which could be significantly different. For example, the Death Company units, Firedrakes, or Sternguards look different; but it takes advanced math to figure out if any differences are significant. I have given up trying to pick among the 20 tank variants even just considering the red ones.

Do other people *like* all this variety? How do you find the better units without getting lost in all the tiny tiny differences?

[vadersson]

Heck yes I like it!

One thing about Warhammer 40K is the customization. I think that is part of what keeps people going with the minis game. And that is one critical aspect of the universe that they got right in this game. The trick with all the units is just to understand what is best at what and not get too far into the nitty gritty (unless you like that sort of thing.) I tend to get a good mix of the different tanks and only take upgrades if it offers something I like. (For example, I always get side sponsons on my Leman Russ tanks.)

So part of it is being true to the universe and part is to give people that like to get deep into the math something to look at. For the most part, just look at the main stats and choice what you think looks cool.

Good luck!
Duncan

[Valad]

Do other people *like* all this variety?

Yes, but I don't agree with how the developers implemented some of this variety. It seems 'slap dash' to me, with extra varieties added just for the sake of it to fill out the rosters. Some of it seems very pointless and I have removed some in the mod I've been working on for about 2 months, so far. Although saying that, I've added considerably more variety elsewhere, but the differences are more pronounced and easier to understand. They make more sense. To me anyway, and since I used the various 40k codex army books, they are legit additions.


It definitely helps to have some semblance of knowledge about the 40k universe. Those who have no idea about it and are just playing another turn based sci-fi war game won't know the difference between weapon systems or units in general, and to be quite honest I don't think the developers implemented unit and weapon strengths and differences very well. But the game is moddable, so doesn't really matter, and I'm enjoying modding, testing and balancing more than actually playing.

[davea]

I don't know anything about the lore. But, based on the stats, I can see the differences between weapons. I actually like the idea of one unit with a variety of weapon ranges, including gaps (like no short range on arty). This post has all the details to figure out the weapon differences:

viewtopic.php?f=235&t=63308#p539367

But even with that, when you have 75 different tanks, most of which are mostly identical, it is hard to pick out the outliers. There might be one really good anti-infantry tank hidden there, where it has the same name as an average tank but has that one special something. When I've done unit design before (total conversions for civ iv) I've always tried to get a small number, of easily differentiable units.

I found the guides by logliu on the steam forums:

http://steamcommunity.com/app/312370/guides/

But even so, this is just a list of all the units with one or two bullet points. Probably, there is (or could be) a guide organized the other way around: if you need infantry counters, then these units are the best .... If you need light vehicle counters, then these units ... and so forth.

I see an awful lot of ork swarms, so infantry counters seem pretty critical. This points me to the crusader tank, and centurion/flamer. But I'm probably missing that one super unit somewhere lost in the huge lists.

[Razz1]

That's one of the biggest complaints. Too many units and not enough difference.

A gap in time for availability would help allot.

[FroBodine]

Does anybody know if the developers are going to do anything about this, too many units and not enough difference?

Possibly a better unit sorter, to bucket similar units into specific categories somehow. Something. I like this game, but what keeps me from loving it is the distraction of picking through way too many similar units to find the one I need. It is just overkill, and presented very poorly to boot.

I would sure love to use your mod, Valad, when it is done. If you are going to make it available to the public, of course.

[davea]

The easiest thing (as a mod) would be to remove about 50 units by editing the availability table.

[Xadie]

or add more traits and abilities to distinct those units more.... *whistle*

[davea]

Unfortunately I don't think there is any way *modders* can define new traits or abilities. The files available for modding only include the basic numeric stats like shots, damage, etc. Traits and abilities are hard coded. As a request for the game developers, I agree this would be nice. People's General had a nice set of useful traits, gained when a unit became experienced.