German WWII war strategy: coulda, shoulda, woulda

[wargovichr]

Strategy--tactical to strategic--is critical in winning any battle or war. As a couch potato General I got to thinking.
Here is my dozen errors in WWII German war strategy (of course its easy to be a Monday morning quarterback).
What are yours (limit to one dozen please)?

Expulsion of German Jewish atomic scientists
Starting the war too early
Not capturing the BEF at Dunkirk
Not developing a long range fighter
Not developing a heavy bomber
Not acquiring the Christie tank suspension when offered
Attacking Russia
Wasting capital on oversized rail artillery
Not capturing Malta
Delaying arrival of Me262 jet fighter
Building over complex heavy tanks
Declaring war on the USA

[testarossa]

Too many highly engineered/low reliability tank/tank destroyer types with no systematic vehicle recovery/repair strategy
Once decision to invade Russia, shoulda stayed the course on Moscow or Stalingrad, not both
If Moscow or Stalingrad could have been taken, then next target should have been manufacturing plants on Volga and cutting shipping lines on Volga.
Aircraft carriers to defend surface fleet in Atlantic (escort carrier approach maybe?)

[timek28]

Yes it is interesting to theorize about this, but guys you do realize that it is much better that Germans (and the ideology they forced) lost the war?

And the bottom line is that it would have been impossible to subdue half of the world long term without constant rebellions, no matter how strong or large an army one has (well unless it is not like half a billion soldiers). US is a good example with their short term excursions everywhere. Your country is where at least 80% of your nationality are. Occupations never worked long term (well Turks did occupy parts of Serbia for like 500 years or so)...

The only way the Germans could have conquered the world would be if they got the A bomb first (nobody else got it). Then maybe they could subdue world with the fear of releasing that weapon on any rebelling point, but that would be a very bad world to live in.

[wargovichr]

No one wishes any other WWII outcome and thank goodness the Germans lost.
We are talking strategy and strategy only. One can perform a similarly interesting analysis of Allied strategy. Why don't you!?
General George Patton studied Rommel's book in his quest to develop the US Army in North Africa.
The very weapons the USA uses today can be directly traced back to weapon systems first used or developed by the Germans.
Have YOU played Panzer Corps? If yes, then you have made use of strategy and weapon systems development.

[BiteNibbleChomp]

This is slightly different - but WWI errors (not 2):

- Moving armies away from the Marne (they got to the east too late anyway)
- 2nd Ypres - not following up the gas attack with an advance
- Ridiculous amounts of land taken from the Russian with the treaty of Brest-Litowsk - that could have saved 50 divisions for the west.

- BNC

[sn0wball]

You really should have a look at Military Errors of World War Two, by Kenneth Macksey
http://books.google.com.pk/books/about/ ... p7QgAACAAJ.


Let me cite from the book, as for the Germans, pre 1940:

- absence of a long-term strategic plan
- insecure radio communications
- widespread lack of grasp of mechanized operations
- exaggerated believe in air power

So it goes on until 1944:

- bad strategic deployment of mobile forces in the defense of France


You´ll find the book worth a few bucks.

[wargovichr]

Right! The Allies captured an 'Enigma' machine, broke the code and knew what the Germans were planning! The forerunner to cyberespionage (cipherespionage!) I guess...
Put this up near the top of the list.

Two books of interest I have read:

Command Failure In War. Psychology and Leadership, by Robert Pois and Philip Langer (2004), and
How Hitler Could Have Won World War II, by Bevin Alexander (2000)

[Naxor]

Not developing a long range fighter

BF110?

Not developing a heavy bomber

HE177? But yes, too little too late.

Siege of Leningrad could have different outcome if Finns were involved more strongly and not staying behind old border.

[wargovichr]

The unsuccesful 110 series was discontinued and morphed into the unstable 210 and later 410 series the latter more successful more so as ground attack (unable to match high-performance Allied fighters).
I understand that the Germans never got around to developing successful drop tanks because of Udet's technical deficit early on then a severe shortage of drop tank materiels (i.e., could not afford waste of aluminum and rubber like the Allies could)
The He-177 engines were fire prone and unreliable and once again Hitler had demanded too much forcing the incorporation of dive-bombing ability (!) in to the He-177 air frame. The "Flying Tinderbox."

[bebro]

Re errors: starting the war in the first place?

[airbornemongo101]

Re errors: starting the war in the first place?

+1000

[wargovichr]

#1 German war strategy: kill Hitler!
It boggles the imagination what a peaceful prosperous industrious Western Europe might have been without the megaginormous destruction and death of WWII.
I hope Russia and China learned their lesson....maybe not?

[Akkula]

#1 German war strategy: kill Hitler!
It boggles the imagination what a peaceful prosperous industrious Western Europe might have been without the megaginormous destruction and death of WWII.
I hope Russia and China learned their lesson....maybe not?

What do you mean with that about Russia and China?

[wargovichr]

Aggression and expansion of armies.

[Akkula]

Aggression and expansion of armies.

What are you talking about?, nowdays?. I don´t understand.

[wargovichr]

Yes, today. Ukraine. South China Sea.
Russia lost 25 million people in WWII, China around 20 million.

[Akkula]

Yes, today. Ukraine. South China Sea.
Russia lost 25 million people in WWII, China around 20 million.

Ok, I will not start the discussion here cause I don´t want to be banned or anything. But you really have a narrow view of the world.

[Scholomancer]

Back to the topic, I have a couple of highlights (besides the obvious warmongering)

Strategic:
- Mussolini's expansion of the war into Southern Europe and Africa. Hitler couldn't negotiate for peace with England after the Italian attacks into Greece and Egypt in October and November 1940. The escalation of war in the Mediterranean allowed Britain another chance to land on the Continent, as well as delayed and diverted resources away from the assault on Russia. Late September, the war with England was minimal - an air-sea war designed to inhibit Britain's commerce and an attempt to force her to the peace table by bankrupting the Empire. The rest of Europe was neutral or part of the Axis hegemony, including the benign occupation of Northern France. Besides the convoy battles, a second Phoney war was a real possibility.
- the diversion of manpower into private armies (Goering's Luftwaffe Divisions, Doenitz's Naval Divisions, and Himmler's SS). Of course, these armies were at first supported by Hitler to balance against the politically and socially powerful Wehrmacht. - The SS in particular may have been fanatical, but they suffered immense casualties at first due to being green formations deployed en masse- the others were simply private armies held deep within Germany.
- Case Blue - unnecessarily extending the front thousands of KMs for distant gains - an unfocussed strategic effort on relatively limited resources
- not opening up Germany's full industrial potential earlier (ie, they kept a lot of production on consumer goods until 43 to keep the populace content)
- diverting too many resources into experimental/fantastic projects with limited short-term return instead of more tangible projects

The war crimes:
- the genocidal policies directed against the Jewish and other conquered populations
- the creation of slave population (Jewish, Slavs and Poles in particular, but populations from all around Europe)
- the "no-prisoners" commissar and similar orders regarding retaliations against populations for partisan attacks

[wargovichr]

Another one:
During the Battle of Britain, Hitler, angered at the bombing of Berlin, switched to bombing major cities rather than continue the successful strategy of bombing British airfields, sector stations, aircraft factories and radar sites.

[BiteNibbleChomp]

Re errors: starting the war in the first place?

+1000

+12000000 and a piece of broken helmet.



- BNC