Bug - Allied Bulgaria releases 2 Corps against Russia

zechi · Post by **zechi** » Fri Oct 07, 2011 7:58 am

In my game with Schnurri the Red Army has been very succesful in eliminating the minor Axis powers and Bulgaria has surrendered in 1942. Greece has not been attacked in this game so the additional Bulgarian INF Corps did not appear yet. Of course Bulgaria changed sides and continued to fight for the Allies. In the middle of 1943 suddenly we both got the message that Bulgaria releases two Corps agains the Soviet Union. These two Corps actually appear as Allied controlled units.

Nevertheless, the message seems wrong in this situation and of course it is questionable if these two units should not be released earlier if the Red Army threatens Bulgaria, i.e. as soon as the Red Army enters Bulgaria or perhaps a hex at the border of Bulgaria.

We are playing with the latest patch.

Morris · Post by **Morris** » Fri Oct 07, 2011 9:26 am

I met the same situation before 2.01 . Is it a bug ?

Peter Stauffenberg · Post by **Peter Stauffenberg** » Fri Oct 07, 2011 12:21 pm

The game code checks for a specific turn (currently June 1943) to release the reserves in Hungary and Romania in Yugoslavia is still neutral and the reserves in Bulgaria if Greece is still neutral.

The problem with having it dependent upon e. g. Russian entry into their country is that then these units can spawn multiple times and that's not good. The way to prevent it is to create variable that must be stored that will indicate the reserves are released, but that would invalidate all save games. We can't count the number of units because when the Axis minors lose units then the reserves can be respawned. we can't check for unit name because players can rename the names to get more reserves.

So we decided to spawn the reserves at a fixed date. Maybe June 1943 is too late for some games because very good Allied players can break the Axis defense in Russia in 1942 and be in e. g. Romania in 1942.

We could move the spawn date to e. g. July 1942. I'm pretty sure the Allies won't have conquered Hungary, Romania or Bulgaria at that time. Another way to do it could be to only spawn these units in June 1943 if the minor powers are still Axis.

What do you think is best?

Morris · Post by **Morris** » Fri Oct 07, 2011 12:41 pm

july 1942 . It will be quite useful for the Axis .

zechi · Post by **zechi** » Fri Oct 07, 2011 4:23 pm

Why not as soon as the Axis DOW the Soviet Union? Then the problem will almost never occur. At all other dates i.e. July 1942 the bug will still occur, even if it is only in extreme games.

Peter Stauffenberg · Post by **Peter Stauffenberg** » Fri Oct 07, 2011 5:41 pm

The bug is only in the text and not in the behavior.

The main reason to wait with releasing the reserves is to make some consequences of not DoW'ing Yugoslavia or Greece. If you get the reserves when you need them (at the start of Barbarossa) then the incentive to DOW these countries is less.

zechi · Post by **zechi** » Fri Oct 07, 2011 6:35 pm

Stauffenberg wrote:The bug is only in the text and not in the behavior.

I don't agree. If the Red Army threatens to enter Bulgarian Terrritory or even Sofia, it would be unlikely that units guarding the Greece border would not be used to face the invaders. Most likely the Bulgarians would move as much units as possible to defend their country and only a small rearguard would be used to guard the frontier in the west.

It also seems wrong that after Bulgaria has been captured by the Soviets, these two INF corps do not immediately appear to fight for the Allies against the Axis, as these forces would not be necessary to guard the Greece border anymore. Greece would never attack Bulgaria if it would have to face the Red Army as well.

Peter Stauffenberg · Post by **Peter Stauffenberg** » Fri Oct 07, 2011 9:55 pm

If we set the date to July 1942 it's very unlikely that the Soviets will be able to enter Romania, Bulgaria or Hungary at that time. The Axis player must have made huge mistakes for that to happen.

I don't think we should release them earlier and we can't link it to a particular event like Soviet units inside the country because then the units will spawn every turn you have Soviet units inside the countries.

I also don't want to have these units released too early like when Barbarossa begins because if Yugoslavia or Greece were still neutral then the countries would have needed armies to guards their borders. It was only when USSR became a real threat that they would have released these armies. That would happen some months after Barbarossa starts.

Most players DoW Yugoslavia so it's mainly Greece we're talking about.

The alternative to moving the date is to not let the reserves spawn at all if the Axis minor power is Allied in June 1943 when the reserves spawn now.

zechi · Post by **zechi** » Sat Oct 08, 2011 6:34 am

Stauffenberg wrote:If we set the date to July 1942 it's very unlikely that the Soviets will be able to enter Romania, Bulgaria or Hungary at that time. The Axis player must have made huge mistakes for that to happen.

Just to explain the situation in my game with Schnurri. The Axis did a 1941 Sealion. However, the British were prepared and could delay the fall of Britain till 1942. Schnurri had no resources to fight it out in the east and he sacrificied the Axis minor powers to the Red Horde and prepared the German defensive line around the Ostwall.

So the Soviets managed to finish off Finland, Hungary, Romania and Bulgaria in 1942 quite easily. Of course it can be argued if such a strategy is a good one in such a situation. I think the game was already lost with the failure to quickly take Britain in 1941.

I agree with you that such a situation is very rare and unlikely to happen in most games. Nevertheless, even if the "bug" will only occur rarely, it remains a bug. Another scenario were an early capture of Bulgaria is possible would be the use of paras to airdrop into Sofia if the Axis player forgot to place a GAR there.

Of course this is not a big issue and perhaps you could find a fitting solution in a later patch.