Hunters in the Atlantic Official Thread

Kerensky · Post by **Kerensky** » Fri May 20, 2011 9:09 pm

You may have noticed there's a new map included with BETA 0.98:

Hunters in the Atlantic

This map is a first generation Panzer Corps 'Custom' map. Scenario design that goes above and beyond the abilities of previous Panzer General titles. I've hosted several challenges for people to accept, and we encourage you to host your own games and test drive this new type of map. This map is designed and balanced for multiplayer, and the current AI is not scripted to be able to play the scenario properly.
So try the map out, have some fun, and leave some feedback!

Special rules for the scenario have been set up through game trigger mechanics:

British Objective: Land at least 5 Convoy units on the British Mainland. (Hexes have been given special strings that say "British Mainland")
OR
Sink the German Battleships Bismarck and Tirpitz.

German objective:
Sink enough Convoy transports to prevent Allied Victory.
AND
The Bismarck or Tirpitz must survive.

Fleet break down:
British: 5 BB, 2 BC, 5 CA, 7 CL, 11 DD, 2 bombers, 2 fighters.
German: 2 BB, 3 BC, 2 CA, 2 CL, 3 DD, 7 ten strength submarines, 4 five strength submarines, 2 bombers, 1 fighter.

Pictures were not resized, so they have not been imbedded.
Screenshots of the map and game play:
German starting fleet. (All German ships except Destroyers have been given names. Bismarck, Tirpitz, Scharnhost, Emden, Admiral Hipper, et cetera)
http://imageshack.us/m/191/6161/hagermanfleet.jpg

British aircraft searching for the German fleet East of Iceland with aircraft:
http://imageshack.us/m/31/9216/hasearching.jpg

HMS Hood searching an area Southwest of Iceland:
http://imageshack.us/m/836/2096/hahmshood.jpg

U-boats shadowing the target convoy:
http://imageshack.us/m/16/7077/haconvoyshadow.jpg

Tirpitz and escorts engage Britsh fleet lead by King George V:
http://imageshack.us/m/845/2638/hatirpitzvskgv.jpg

While Bismarck makes an end run and prepares to devastate the convoy:
http://imageshack.us/m/33/6750/habismarckendrun.jpg

Hope you like this idea of 'custom scenarios' that go beyond the traditional game play based on victory hexes and time limits. Enjoy the map, and be sure to leave some feedback!

Win/Loss Tracking for first version:
German Wins: 4
German Losses: 4

EDIT: Add one more German victory. Tirpitz was lost, Bismarck has been knocked down to 6 strength, but the Convoy has been decimated.

EDIT: Add a first British victory, and possibly a second one soon to follow. I successfully landed my transports in Britain, and it looks like he might win the same way against me in our paired game.
Thx Pacost for the games.

EDIT: Add another German victory. Bismarck rounded Iceland, Tirpitz and escorted shattered the British Fleet near Scapa Flow, and then they both pincered the Convoy. Bismarck is on the far left, Tirpitz on the far right.
http://i.imgur.com/qJQZD.jpg

EDIT: Another Convoy safely disembarks on England.
Thanks for the game Tombomadil711. Any comments or feedback?

Also as a final note, the 'N' next unit hotkey is particularly useful in this map to make sure you don't miss any of your units before you hit end turn.

OmegaMan1 · Post by **OmegaMan1** » Fri May 20, 2011 9:20 pm

Looks great Kerensky, I am posting the challenge in multiplayer now. Thanks!

Eloyd · Post by **Eloyd** » Fri May 20, 2011 10:28 pm

I love the idea and layout, however isn't the map a little small? Afterall the atlantic is a big place for a small ship to hide in

Kerensky · Post by **Kerensky** » Fri May 20, 2011 11:12 pm

Eloyd wrote:I love the idea and layout, however isn't the map a little small? Afterall the atlantic is a big place for a small ship to hide in

Yes and no, this is where testing comes in.
If the Atlantic is too big, the map is boring to play. Turn after turn after turn of nothing but 'moving' 20 units around with no combat.
The Atlantic (on this scale) is fairly 'small' but it should be large enough to allow freedom of movement and decision while preserving a healthy and entertaining pace for combat to play out in.

Ships notably have a very small sight radius(made worse by frequent rain), so this should help ships hide in the vast expanse of the Atlantic.

Kerensky · Post by **Kerensky** » Sat May 21, 2011 6:49 am

So far it looks like the Germans are having a tough time, the British balling their fleet is a pretty strong strategy. We'll see how everyone else's games are going, but there may be a need for some Italian ships to make their presence known!

Kerensky · Post by **Kerensky** » Sat May 21, 2011 9:29 am

First game:
Tirpitz sunk, Bismarck crippled (1 strength) and surrounded by 5 cruisers and a destroyer (She sank one cruiser) but...
http://imageshack.us/m/40/5946/bismarckend.jpg
German victory.

http://imageshack.us/m/189/4613/haend.jpg
His heavy cruisers, battlecruisers, submarines, and aircraft blew up enough convoy ships to secure victory before the Bismarck sank.

Well played game by dshaw62197.

OmegaMan1 · Post by **OmegaMan1** » Sun May 22, 2011 5:22 am

Thanks Kerensky, GG to you as well. This is a very tense scenario, I think all users will enjoy it immensely... it does a fine job of showing the new scenario possibilities that exist with the PzC editor!

Kerensky · Post by **Kerensky** » Sun May 22, 2011 6:03 am

How did the other paired game end? Did I sink enough transports on my last turn, or did you find Tirpitz and sink her? I didn't get any notification either way. =/

OmegaMan1 · Post by **OmegaMan1** » Sun May 22, 2011 6:05 am

You managed to sink enough convoys, I only had 4 left. I tried to find the Tirpitz, and did, but didn't have enough firepower to sink her. You won! Looks like we need a rematch.

Kerensky · Post by **Kerensky** » Sun May 22, 2011 6:18 am

dshaw62197 wrote:You managed to sink enough convoys, I only had 4 left. I tried to find the Tirpitz, and did, but didn't have enough firepower to sink her. You won! Looks like we need a rematch.

I'll play this map all day, bring it on. I need to be sneakier fighting you, I can tell already. lol

Phew, I couldn't flee Tirpitz like you fled Bismarck, you decimated my three battlecruisers in two turns, so I had Tirpitz perched at extreme range while U-boats and my air fleet spotted for her. Interesting, that's 2 German wins. Not bad for being seriously outnumbered. I guess I won't be adding that Italian fleet after all?

Fleet break down:
British: 5 BB, 2 BC, 5 CA, 7 CL, 11 DD, 2 bombers, 2 fighters.
German: 2 BB, 3 BC, 2 CA, 2 CL, 3 DD, 7 ten strength submarines, 4 five strength submarines, 2 bombers, 1 fighter.

Judging from those numbers, I'm a little surprised German won 2 for 2 so far.
Maybe I'll throw in more American ships and even it out with Italians? I dunno, if you have any thoughts for improvement please share them.

OmegaMan1 · Post by **OmegaMan1** » Sun May 22, 2011 1:59 pm

When we first played this scenario I thought the Allies had way to much firepower, but the more we play the more I think the two sides are actually very well balanced. What is nice about this scenario is how it mixes just the right amount of luck and strategy. (And no, keep the Italians and Americans out -- this is a perfect 1941 scenario, just the Germans vs. the British.)

I can't wait to see how the PzC engine handles Pacific War scenarios of this nature, like Midway or Coral Sea... (hint, hint

)

Kerensky · Post by **Kerensky** » Tue May 24, 2011 8:31 am

Hilarious rematch with Dshaw. We both tried 'new' tactics, not knowing we were thinking nearly the same thing.

My new strategy was this. I call it the 'Atlantic Net'.

The Atlantic net catches a fish off Iceland's West coast:

With Bismarck sunk, the convoy and escorts proceed in their scenic route around Iceland.
I imagine the ship to ship communications looked something like this:

HMS Hood: Seas looks clear. Convoy HX-204 be sure to hug the cost for protection. Proceed full steam around Iceland and prepare to disembark troops in Scotland.
HMS Kent: Copy that. Confirming no enemy presence detected.
HMS Suffolk: Right-o!

*After warships have sailed full speed Southeast*

Convoy ship: TURN THE #$%^ AROUND! TIRPITZ IS HERE AND WE'RE UNDER ATTACK!

The convoy scatters as the British ships scramble to engage Tirpitz.

Tirpitz meets her inevitable end.

Currently, I've reasoned there are 2 strategies for Germany and Britain each:
Germany can ball their fleet tightly, or spread them out and Britain can do the same.
If both fleets Ball up, British have the advantage.
If both fleets fan out, British have the advantage.

But if fleets pick opposite tactics, the Germans have the advantage.
The German Ball will destroy one section of the net and roll up the rest of it in a flanking or bypassing attack.
If the German spread and the British Ball up, the British Ball will smash part of the Germans, but the remainder will be able to bypass them and wreck the convoys.
To say nothing of how the submarine war is played out, which also has its own mini strategies.

I'm very pleased with this scenario, to say the least.
Considering there are zero options for buying or repairing units.
It has a great deal of replayability and mystery.

For the record, I ended with 7 Convoy ships left, 4 full strength near Tirpitz, 1 cripple near Tirpitz, and only 2 way down south trying to dodge submarines(and failing at it pretty hard). If Tirpitz killed just 1 of those transports and survived long enough for 2 more to be hunted down, I would have lost. Even this victory wasn't assured for the British.
Mark 1 more British Victory, GG Dshaw, well played.

OmegaMan1 · Post by **OmegaMan1** » Tue May 24, 2011 1:18 pm

That really did turn out to be a humorous coincidence... great minds think alike LOL! My strategy was to take the bulk of the German fleet to the south of Iceland, while the Bismarck and Tirpitz would sneak around the northern passage. When the Bismarck was discovered and promptly sunk, I decided to "hide" the Tirpitz in that nice little Icelandic alcove to the north. You can imagine my surprise when a parade of transports when steaming by! Kerensky made good use of his air assets and quickly sent the Tirpitz to join her sister ship in Davey Jones' Locker. Once again, Kerensky plays an excellent game. I highly recommend this scenario for multiplayer play, it really highlights the strength of PzC's multiplayer engine.

apanzerfan · Post by **apanzerfan** » Tue May 24, 2011 1:22 pm

i just posted a hunters in the atlantic challenge, feel free to accept it.

ps: i am no expert of sea-fights

Kerensky · Post by **Kerensky** » Tue May 24, 2011 8:35 pm

I missed your challenge (I guess someone else snapped it up!), but there's an updated version, along with every more special MP maps, being released with the new BETA, if you want to wait for that to come out?

Changelog
Version 1.1
Fixed a few misplaced text strings.
Removed Ireland airfield.
Changed all Convoy ships to contain units unable to disembark on High Mountain terrain
Named British Light cruisers.
Added minimal amounts of prestige to repair and purchase new aircraft.
Removed all cities to prevent ground unit purchases
Reconfigured core/aux units
Added additional victory triggers
Added scenario description
Tweaked weather settings slightly to reduce aircraft effectiveness (a lot more cloudy weather)

Razz1 · Post by **Razz1** » Tue May 24, 2011 8:57 pm

I think we need some ports!

OmegaMan1 · Post by **OmegaMan1** » Wed May 25, 2011 1:33 am

Hmm, removing the Ireland airfield makes things tricky for the Allies. I know I used that one several times when I've played.

apanzerfan · Post by **apanzerfan** » Thu May 26, 2011 5:31 pm

Add a German loss.

I think this scenario is pretty much in favour of the Allies.
They have more ships than the Axis, though they are not that powerful, they badly outnumber them.

I lost in 9 turns

Kerensky · Post by **Kerensky** » Thu May 26, 2011 8:08 pm

Added, the numbers of ships definitely leans in favor of the Allies, but so far the Germans are still inexplicably ahead.

deadtorius · Post by **deadtorius** » Thu May 26, 2011 8:58 pm

Quick question regarding subs
Are they hidden until they attack, or will they always appear to the enemy. Keep getting it all mixed up with CEAW where subs are hidden from your opponent till they attack.

I was just wondering since I use mine to both attack enemy vessels and try to shadow any contacts I have spotted. Nothing like thinking your being sneaky and suddenly end up in the middle of a square dance of destroyer death