The Elephant Victory 273 BC Galatian vs Early Seleucid

[CharlesRobinson]

Hello, I am working on a Scenerio for FoG. The battle is the Elephant Victory 273 BC Galatian vs Early Seleucid. This is a troop list that I have worked up based off of a DBA version of the battle.

Early Seleucid: Galatian:
- Inspired Commander - Field Commander
- Troop Commanders x2 - Troops Commander x2
- Xystophoroi x6 - Cavalry x6 (Protected)
- Phalanx (average) x12 - Warriors x24 (Superior)
- Greek Mercenary Thuriophoroi x8 - Light Chariots x4
- Archers x6 - Scythed Chariots x2
- Elephants x2
- Light Cavalry x4 (Javelins)

Please review the unit list and let me know what you think. Also, I do not know the order of battle on how these units should be set up nor anything about the terrain. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks

[willb]

There is only a brief description of the battle. The description mentions 20,000 cavalry, 160 two horse chariots, and 80 scythed chariots on the Galatian side. The cavalry number is somewhat suspect as only 20,000 Galatians were suppossed to have migrated into Asia Minor, so it may actually be the total of the entire Galatian army or it may be the actual number of cavlary multiplied by a factor of 10. 2000 cavalry might be about right as there were 2,500 Galatian cavalry at Magnesia in 190 B.C. This would give you two four stand cavalry battlegroups, one for each wing.

On the Seleucid side there were 16 elephants and an unknown number of other troops. The elephants were hidden from the Galatians and deployed in three separate groups with four on each flank and eight in the middle. Because they had such a major effect on the outcome of the battle you may want to have three battlegroups of 2 elephants. This is the maximum number allowed in the army list though increasing the number to eight with two battlegroups in the middle might be closer to the actual course of the battle. Although the Seleucid army is described as outnumbered by the Galatians, there is the possibility that they may have had more troops than the Galatians, but of inferior quality. This would be partly due to the reputation and fear of the Galatians at that time and possibly due to including lighter levies in the army as was done later at Raphaia and Magnesia.

As for the battle, the Galatians were not aware of the elephants being there and started the battle with a charge by their chariots and cavalry. The Seleucids let the chariots pass through and the elephants attacked the Galatian cavalry on both wings and the chariots in the middle. The subsquent rout of the Galatian mounted forces took their infantry with them. The scythed chariots are described as cutting through their own infantry.

[CharlesRobinson]

I made a slightly different version of this battle for Field Of Glory PC Game. If you would like the file just send me an emnail at robinsonke@hotmail.com

Thanks

[CharlesRobinson]

In the Army book the Seleucids are only allowed 4 elephant stand during this time period. I will have to place them so that they are behind the phalanx so as to split it by thirds. 4 stand of phalanx/elephant/4 phalanx/elephant/4 phalanx.

Thanks for the hard data. I will have to modify my FoG PC version to adjust for the numbers, although I will be using warbands instead of all that cavalry, the army list does not show that much cavalry and from what I understand, they did not have enough troops to possibly fill that number. Thanks again!

[CharlesRobinson]

This is the website that I used as a bases for my scenerio:

http://www.stapells.com/wargames/battles/elephant2.php

[CharlesRobinson]

Alright - I finished with the changes for the Field Of Glory PC Game as far as this scenerio goes. Now I need to convert it back to Field Of Glory Table Top. I will post the army here when complete. Thank you.

[CharlesRobinson]

Here is the miniature list for The Elephant Victory 273 BC - Galatians vs Early Seleucids.

Galatians

Field Commander (50)
Troop Commander x2 (70/120)
Light Chariots x6 (90/210)
Protected Cavalry x4 (48/258)
Protected Cavalry x4 (48/306)
Warriors x8 (56/362)
Warriors x8 (56/418)
Warriors x8 (56/474)
Warriors x8 (56/530)
Scythed Chariots x4 (60/590)
Javelinmen x8 (32/622)

[CharlesRobinson]

Early Seleucids

Inspired Commander (80)
Troop Commanders x2 (70/150)
Xystophoroi x4 (68/218)
Thracian Heavy Cavalry x4 (64/282)
Phalangites x12 (72/354)
Greek Mercenary Thorakitai x8 (80/434)
Archers x6 (30/464)
Light Horse - Tarantine x4 (28/492)
Light Horse - Thracian x4 (28/520)
Thracian - Heavy Weapons x8 (56/576)
Elephants x2 (50/626)

[CharlesRobinson]

Setup

Galatians

10 Chariots in a line centerd with a unit of cavalry on either end. Cv/SCh/LCh/Cv
Behind this are the Javelinmen Jv
Behind this are the four units of Warriors two deep. HF/HF/HF/HF

Seleucid

Center has Archers out front then Phalangites four wide and three deep behind them and then elephants behind the pike.
Left Flank has Tarantine Light Horse with Xystophoroi behind them and Greek Mercenary Throakitai behind the cavalry.
Right Flank has Thracian Light Horse with Thracian Armoured Cavalry behind them, and Thracians with heavy weapons behind the cavalry.

Center of the battle field should be open with some limiting terrain on the far left and far right of the battle field.

[CharlesRobinson]

I also have the scenerio built for the FoG PC Game is anyone wants it. It is the same except that the Galatians have no Javelinmen. The point values for the PC version does not match exactly the table top verion. Thanks

[CharlesRobinson]

I posted a battle report for this scenario on the Field Of Glory PC Games Forum if anyone is interested.

viewtopic.php?t=14007

[dreiling]

Have you ever played it with the table top game - 15mm or 25mm?