A Modest Proposal . . .

Skullzgrinda · Post by **Skullzgrinda** » Sun Nov 15, 2009 10:13 pm

This is of course a marketing decision up to Slitherine and Osprey people, but perhaps there can be a pre-release of some generic starter list(s)?

This would allow those of us awaiting developments to get the core of some armies up and ready.

Renaissance has never enjoyed the player base that ancients has, and I think you would get more enthusiastic buzz and critical mass going if the player base is able to plunge in immediately, as opposed to wait for publication/distribution/receipt and only THEN have sufficient information to begin collecting and painting troops - or perhaps not bother.

Unlike FoG, these armies will not be laying around in closets and boxes as all the neglected ancients armies were.

2 - 5 very generic core lists would be a great benefit I think, and have people ready to plunge in right away upon release. Something on the order of: "500pts 16th C. Western Wars of Religion", "500 pts 17th C. Turkic/Islamic". Something very general, limited and abstract, but which would encompass essential core troop types.

Just my tuppence, Mi'lords, if feasibility permits.

SirGarnet · Post by **SirGarnet** » Mon Nov 16, 2009 12:33 am

There are a fair number of 14th-17th C armies lying around here, many based for DBR which is compatible basing for FOG, and quite a few end-of-period FOG armies are usable going forward for a time.

Just for historical reasons, putting together bases of the historically core troop types (in even numbers) should be usable, and given morphability of some common types in some periods, it should not be hard to get a big head start even without specific lists.

timmy1 · Post by **timmy1** » Mon Nov 16, 2009 1:58 pm

I'm with Mike here. I had many more DBR / Tercio / Gush / PoW armies than FoGAM - being part of the Beta test has really inspired me to rebase some stuff from Tercio (Early English Tudor) that has been a work in progress for 10-15 years. I will probably also rebase my WotLoA and GNW stuff from PoW once I can be sure of having opponents to use them against.

From my experience, if you look at the core components of the DBR books I don't think you will go far wrong.

Also, if you think back to FoGAM there were 4 (IIRC) starter armies in the rules themselves.

Skullzgrinda · Post by **Skullzgrinda** » Mon Nov 16, 2009 2:48 pm

I am not talking about starter army lists. Something more abbrieviated than that. Something more on the order of commonly or typically required minimums. Something very abstract, so that finishing out an army will take only a couple of weeks instead of a couple of months, or a season or a year, with the risk of project abandonment delays entail.

You say that your involvement as a Beta tester has served as an impetus to preparation and enthusiasm. This supports my point. A partial heads up will have more people prepared and motivated to plunge in immediately. Multiple tables will be in play at the next convention instead of next season's or next year's; more people will be talking about the new system; more fence sitters would be inclined to get the rules and give it a whirl.

I don't think Renaissance ever got the traction here in the US that Anc/Med have always enjoyed. If the ratio of renaissance to Anc/Med armies generally is as high as 1:10 I would be surprised. If you count WoR, Odonnance, Swiss and Samurai etc. as renaissance armies it might go as high as 1:8, but I doubt it.

This may be regional though.

Oh well, the armies I am interested in are Calvinist anyway, so a complete rejection of any evangelism and outreach may be more appropriate anyway. Faith alone will suffice.

timmy1 · Post by **timmy1** » Mon Nov 16, 2009 2:54 pm

A peak at an early release would be a sin, a temptation. It would remove from you the toil that will come when the rules arrive and that would be a bad thing. Buying the rules and using the starter armies as the core will make you a justified sinner.

As for Calvanist armies, other than a Scots Covenanter, the closest you will get in the Beta lists is Lutherans.

Skullzgrinda · Post by **Skullzgrinda** » Mon Nov 16, 2009 3:11 pm

This is no true faith if it lacks the Elect, the Huguenots.

timmy1 · Post by **timmy1** » Mon Nov 16, 2009 3:14 pm

Yep, that's what I am waiting for, Millers to the fore.

Skullzgrinda · Post by **Skullzgrinda** » Mon Nov 16, 2009 3:43 pm

timmy1 wrote:Yep, that's what I am waiting for, Millers to the fore.

1:41 - 1:43
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=17CL22j1qOU

First you will have get through the touching wedding vows, and St. Bartholomew's Day.

SirGarnet · Post by **SirGarnet** » Mon Nov 16, 2009 3:50 pm

Skullzgrinda wrote:
timmy1 wrote:Yep, that's what I am waiting for, Millers to the fore.

1:41 - 1:43
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=17CL22j1qOU

First you will have get through the touching wedding vows, and St. Bartholomew's Day.

That's a lot of intrigue, treachery and romance to endure for a brief trooptease.

timmy1 · Post by **timmy1** » Mon Nov 16, 2009 4:19 pm

Mike, I have to say I agree, glad I missed that film when it was released...

Skull, I think that Katrina has left dust deposits on your specs, those troops are not Millers to my eyes. I do not mean to make light of what occurred as a result of Katrina. Recent TV footage of the area shown in the UK makes it clear that New Orleans is still badly impacted physically (to say nothing of the psychological impact).

Skullzgrinda · Post by **Skullzgrinda** » Mon Nov 16, 2009 8:15 pm

timmy1 wrote:Mike, I have to say I agree, glad I missed that film when it was released...

Skull, I think that Katrina has left dust deposits on your specs, those troops are not Millers to my eyes. I do not mean to make light of what occurred as a result of Katrina. Recent TV footage of the area shown in the UK makes it clear that New Orleans is still badly impacted physically (to say nothing of the psychological impact).

Artistic license. All of the Huguenots are all in black. No miller's smocks. It was a well done, horrible movie.

Elizabeth was more to my liking. For this period, one had to be content with what one can get.