Underused/rated units

[Grondel]

Multi-turret and multi-gun tanks should all get Rapid Fire 1.5x but have the status reduced, including T-28, Char B1, Char 2C and the M3 Grant/Lee to line up with the Neubaufahrzeug.

could u provide a list of all multi turret tanks that are in the game atm?

sers,
Thomas

[VirgilInTheSKY]

Multi-turret and multi-gun tanks should all get Rapid Fire 1.5x but have the status reduced, including T-28, Char B1, Char 2C and the M3 Grant/Lee to line up with the Neubaufahrzeug.

could u provide a list of all multi turret tanks that are in the game atm?

sers,
Thomas

T-28, Char B1, Char 2C, Neubaufahrzeug and Maus. Polish 7TPdwz also has 2 turrets but it already got Rapid Fire 1.5x as an MG tank. Interesting that we don't have T-35 for USSR.

[Grondel]

Multi-turret and multi-gun tanks should all get Rapid Fire 1.5x but have the status reduced, including T-28, Char B1, Char 2C and the M3 Grant/Lee to line up with the Neubaufahrzeug.

could u provide a list of all multi turret tanks that are in the game atm?

sers,
Thomas

T-28, Char B1, Char 2C, Neubaufahrzeug and Maus. Polish 7TPdwz also has 2 turrets but it already got Rapid Fire 1.5x as an MG tank. Interesting that we don't have T-35 for USSR.

Maus?^^ it "had"(since it was only planned and never really build) 3 guns yes but afaik only 1 turret.

sers,
Thomas

[Sequester Grundleplith, MD]

Fighterplanes have highaltitude mode. They cannot attack ground targets and have low altitude trait removed.

Is this a selectable mode? Otherwise, I don't favor this change at all. Fighters routinely did strafing irl. I use fighters for ground attack all the time. Even just doing 1hp damage or removing 1 entrenchment is often very helpful

[Grondel]

Is this a selectable mode? Otherwise, I don't favor this change at all. Fighters routinely did strafing irl. I use fighters for ground attack all the time. Even just doing 1hp damage or removing 1 entrenchment is often very helpful

of course. fighters have a switch button that can remove low-altitude trait which will remove the ability to strike ground units. the other mode enables ground attacks at the cost of receiving low-altitude trait.

both modes have fightersupport.

sers,
Thomas

[Sequester Grundleplith, MD]

Is this a selectable mode? Otherwise, I don't favor this change at all. Fighters routinely did strafing irl. I use fighters for ground attack all the time. Even just doing 1hp damage or removing 1 entrenchment is often very helpful

of course. fighters have a switch button that can remove low-altitude trait which will remove the ability to strike ground units. the other mode enables ground attacks at the cost of receiving low-altitude trait.

both modes have fightersupport.

sers,
Thomas

Cool, will look forward to trying it out. Congrats on the work; you're really expanding what is possible in the game

[VirgilInTheSKY]

could u provide a list of all multi turret tanks that are in the game atm?

sers,
Thomas

T-28, Char B1, Char 2C, Neubaufahrzeug and Maus. Polish 7TPdwz also has 2 turrets but it already got Rapid Fire 1.5x as an MG tank. Interesting that we don't have T-35 for USSR.

Maus?^^ it "had"(since it was only planned and never really build) 3 guns yes but afaik only 1 turret.

sers,
Thomas

That's why I said "multi-turret and multi-gun" in the first post, because Char B1 and M3 Grant/Lee also has only one turret, but more than one guns. Ah I forgot to put the M3 there.

[Grondel]

That's why I said "multi-turret and multi-gun" in the first post, because Char B1 and M3 Grant/Lee also has only one turret, but more than one guns. Ah I forgot to put the M3 there.

thx for the list will take a look at it.

sers,
Thomas

[Wolfenguard]

mhh i think there are a lot of units i dont really use. (AO Play)
Infantery: i only use the azul and the pioneer units. Sometimes 1 heavy infantery to get to my 4 units
standart infantery only in scw as italian units for conquering citys
airborne and mountain inf, only when the scenario needs them, like crete or some missions where the briefing says, you should use them. The heavy infantery needs a support fire trait.

Transport: i only use the free Version of the transports for inf/arty/AT. 1 less coreslot and a little push for the stats or 1 more core slot, fast transportation and more units?

Trains: Armored Train i think i only used it one ore two times, to less mobility and easy to capture, maybe the train will get a more use if you can upgrade it later into a AA/Arty/AT Variant and or when it gives you some Prestige per round

Arty: all of the first armored Artys, to less range and the 15cm are good enough especially with the support traits, rocket

close support Fighters: at the beginning i use a lot of the ju´s but later changed my gameplay to the bf´s. The ju´s need the same ability to attack aircrafts like the bf´s or they need the AT/INf support trait like some of enemy aircrafts in the AO 44, then maybe i will give them a chance again. in the later aos, you need to takt out the aircrafts and with the bfs, you can destroy some of the low live units in the same round.

Strat Bombers: dont really know what to do with them, the main use for them are only to sink Ships in the small amount of missions where i have to destroy them. artys are more effektive than the bombers, they make more kills and without get shotet back, like the bombers, where you have the enemy aircrafts and or the AA

[RVallant]

mhh i think there are a lot of units i dont really use. (AO Play)
Infantery: i only use the azul and the pioneer units. Sometimes 1 heavy infantery to get to my 4 units
standart infantery only in scw as italian units for conquering citys
airborne and mountain inf, only when the scenario needs them, like crete or some missions where the briefing says, you should use them. The heavy infantery needs a support fire trait.

Transport: i only use the free Version of the transports for inf/arty/AT. 1 less coreslot and a little push for the stats or 1 more core slot, fast transportation and more units?

Trains: Armored Train i think i only used it one ore two times, to less mobility and easy to capture, maybe the train will get a more use if you can upgrade it later into a AA/Arty/AT Variant and or when it gives you some Prestige per round

Arty: all of the first armored Artys, to less range and the 15cm are good enough especially with the support traits, rocket

close support Fighters: at the beginning i use a lot of the ju´s but later changed my gameplay to the bf´s. The ju´s need the same ability to attack aircrafts like the bf´s or they need the AT/INf support trait like some of enemy aircrafts in the AO 44, then maybe i will give them a chance again. in the later aos, you need to takt out the aircrafts and with the bfs, you can destroy some of the low live units in the same round.

Strat Bombers: dont really know what to do with them, the main use for them are only to sink Ships in the small amount of missions where i have to destroy them. artys are more effektive than the bombers, they make more kills and without get shotet back, like the bombers, where you have the enemy aircrafts and or the AA

Infantry - I agree, I raised it ages back when the game first came out. The issue is the lack of Close Defence for them. I do use Heavy Weapons teams though, I just give them special heroes like Aggressive counter attack, never lose entrenchment and strikes first on defence. I also think, they're like the best unit to have a 'vigilant' (I think it's that?) hero on, as any attacking infantry has to attack their ground defence and not close defence rating.

Transport - The 1 core ones become important if you need movement in my experience, especially in Russia on the bigger maps. Wheeled = dead outside of roads and in bad weather.

Trains - Armoured train, I agree, I seldom use it.

Strategic bombers - They're brilliant, they have two uses. 1. Artillery with ammo denial, like you said.

2. They reduce movement AND ammo count, which means, if you aim them at anything with 3-4 movement, like infantry, heavy tanks like the Matilda or whatever, and suppress the unit further, you can force a surrender because they can't retreat. This is an alternative to tank-busting them with the Tactical bombers, and is handy if you like building huge supplies of say, IS-2 tanks or whatever.

The lower ammo also nullifies any unit with low ammo count (rocket artillery for example), making it so any land attack will have fewer ammo to deal with, and helping to trigger retreats from favourable combat results (0-5 is better than 2-3 for example) and again = surrenders.

[DefiantXYX]

Transport - The 1 core ones become important if you need movement in my experience, especially in Russia on the bigger maps. Wheeled = dead outside of roads and in bad weather.

I only use it when I got a zero slot hero in the infantry. If your infantry is as mobile as your tanks or even more I always go to far with them and they get attacked and badly damaged.

[RVallant]

Transport - The 1 core ones become important if you need movement in my experience, especially in Russia on the bigger maps. Wheeled = dead outside of roads and in bad weather.

I only use it when I got a zero slot hero in the infantry. If your infantry is as mobile as your tanks or even more I always go to far with them and they get attacked and badly damaged.

Fair point, but I pair it with aggressive deployment for rapid attacks on city hexes. Usually my tanks are long gone from those areas at that point.

[VektorT]

My opinion about some points here:

88: I think giving them arty mode is very irealistic and maybe unbalanced. Other than that, I always have one. Pretty powerful early on.

Stugs: yeah I think they may need AT mode. I find them very underwhelming otherwise. I play them just because I like real life Stugs...

BF110: I quite enjoy their long range and being able to finish off damaged aircrafts

Armored Train: I use them. For only 2 slots they are quite good and most main objectives have railroads in or around. Still I think they miss arty suport and maybe that trait from ships where the unit don't lose strength at lower health

Towed ATs: to me they are just garbage. They may be light on slots but lacks punch, better save this slot to improve somewhere else. Anything to improve them are welcome

Infantry: Pioneer are good. Azul are great. Patatroopers are awesome. Alpines and Cavalry are ok in some situations or to have one around if you took Infantry General. Everything else is pointless or lacks use compares to those

Inf Halftracks: never used them. Maybe in Rússia eventually but so far is 1 core slot for very little use

[robman]

Inf Halftracks: never used them. Maybe in Rússia eventually but so far is 1 core slot for very little use

I use halftracks as soon as I can afford the slots, for three reasons:
(1) Infantry units with halftracks receive a significant (4 point) soft attack bonus when dismounted. This is not indicated in the manual or user interface, but it shows up in the combat log.
(2) Once you get to mud in Russia, trucks are too slow. Being able to crawl forward even one additional hex can be crucial.
(3) Especially with the faster halftracks, you can often move and dismount significantly farther than with trucks, especially when roads are not available. This helps infantry keep up with (or even outpace) armor, without the risk that they will be caught in their transports during the enemy's turn.

It is also possible to attack when infantry is mounted in the halftrack, but this is dangerous if there is enemy armor or AT around--it's a good way to lose an entire unit. It's usually safer to wait to dismount and attack on the next turn.

[VektorT]

(1) Infantry units with halftracks receive a significant (4 point) soft attack bonus when dismounted. This is not indicated in the manual or user interface, but it shows up in the combat log.
(2) Once you get to mud in Russia, trucks are too slow. Being able to crawl forward even one additional hex can be crucial.
(3) Especially with the faster halftracks, you can often move and dismount significantly farther than with trucks, especially when roads are not available. This helps infantry keep up with (or even outpace) armor, without the risk that they will be caught in their transports during the enemy's turn.

Wait... I didn't knew about (1)! That's pretty relevant! Does it work only on open terrain or close combat too? I will test it out!

About (2) and (3), even with tracks I rarely am in a situation where I where I REALLY need my infantry to keep up like that. I just keep my tanks out of close combat or flanking until.my infantry arrives. I'm finishing of 1940 still after 1936 and 1939, so no Russia yet and maybe there, like you said, I will need better offroad mobility, but anyway (1) still is good enough at least to The Great CC Deleter, Azur Infantry.

[Sequester Grundleplith, MD]

Half tracks also grant +1 close defense, which is pretty significant for all non-engineer infantry.

Additionally their ground defense is higher than the dismounted infantry's, so I've actually had some situations where they can survive in open terrain mounted, when they would get totally annihilated dismounted
A further advantage is that half tracks can drive into close terrain like forests and still allow the infantry to dismount, which is not possible for trucks

[VirgilInTheSKY]

Wait... I didn't knew about (1)! That's pretty relevant! Does it work only on open terrain or close combat too? I will test it out!

About (2) and (3), even with tracks I rarely am in a situation where I where I REALLY need my infantry to keep up like that. I just keep my tanks out of close combat or flanking until.my infantry arrives. I'm finishing of 1940 still after 1936 and 1939, so no Russia yet and maybe there, like you said, I will need better offroad mobility, but anyway (1) still is good enough at least to The Great CC Deleter, Azur Infantry.

The bonus is applied for all battles the attached unit fights, iirc. And yes, until 1940 there hasn't been much need in that when your panzers can sweep across most of the enemies without infantry units accompany (and no halftracks are available until 1940 anyway), but from 1941 there will be more and more needs to do that. Bad infrastructure, more snowy and rainy operations will make your wheeled transports stuck very soon.

[Korvessa]

Kind of late to this party and must confess I haven't read entire thread, but I like using the T-28 in a support role with artillery & AT support. Even better if you can add tank killer.
Enemy infantry won't ever attack whatever it is supporting.

[Grondel]

update:
all 75mm towed arty pieces received forced march
all 37mm towed AT pieces received forced march and camouflage
StuGIIIB recieved an AT mode
all jet planes have low altitude trait removed
some planes have enhanced move range(this is due to reworked maps in 39, the maps are 4x bigger than before. I will do this for all campaigns 1 at a time)
BF110 planes received fighter mode and hit and run. (BF110 have init 2 and all strategics have init 1 while fighters all have way higher initiative. Thus HitandRun will only work against strategics, representing the "schräge Musik"(a special way of fitting the gun to the plane) used by the nightfighters.)
8.8 recieved a artillerie mode, unit will switch from AA to AT to Arty and back to AA, known issue: in arty mode the 8.8 will not be able to use its attached transport(it will be shown as possible move but won't work. fixing this is beyond what can be modded. If u want to move the 8.8 after firing in artillerie mode more than 1 hex u need to manually switch to transport(left side of the screen) and deployment into artillerie mode is not possible.)
Fighterplanes received highaltitude mode. In this mode they cannot attack ground targets and have low altitude trait removed.

I'm happy whith the above changes so far and feedback was overall positive.

all heavy Weapon/Grenadier units received MachineGun and Arty Support, core slots equal to engineers
changed to with next update:
all heavy Weapon/Grenadier units received MachineGun and Ferocious Defense.

I think about restricting the SdKfz 250/251 to Grenadier units.

please let me know if u have ideas concerning the units.

sers,
Thomas

[VirgilInTheSKY]

I think about restricting the SdKfz 250/251 to Grenadier units.

And Pioneers. From what I can remember, there are also assault engineer units with halftrack support, some of the vehicles' variants are basically there for them.