Historicon- all three rounds

Hepius · Post by **Hepius** » Mon Jul 20, 2009 9:58 pm

Took my Medieval Burgundians to Historicon last weekend.

You read that right: Medieval Burgundians

The way I looked at the list was as a 100YW English on discount. Loads of cheap knights and longbow without swords. I had 22 stands of undrilled average knights and 20 stands of longbow. There were also six stands of crossbow and four stands of handgunners.

I primarily built the list to deal with shooty cavalry armies. I'd put out a massive wall of heavily armored knights with longbow and crossbow covering the flanks. Against a longbow or pike army I would dismount my knights as undrilled superior heavy weapon heavy armor close foot.

I hadn't played any FoG for two months and only have around 16 games under my belt. I thought the Medieval Burgundians would be simple to operate and would provide an unusual opponent for my opponents.

I had a very enjoyable time and managed to win two out of my three games. This breaks my streak of coming in second to last in both of my previous tournaments.

All three battles are in one report. It is not as in-depth or entertaining as some of my previous reports. However, there are pictures, brief reports, and lessons learned.

The report:
http://sites.google.com/site/mattheppe/historicon-2009

jlopez · Post by **jlopez** » Tue Jul 21, 2009 7:28 am

With regards to your first game against Ilkhanids:

The problem with knights is that you are very unlikely to catch anything on a horse that can evade but you are extremely likely to be drawn into very embarrassing situations through being shock troops. They would be far more useful dismounted to absord enemy shooting (need a 6 to hit) and provide a secure anchor for your own shooters. I would definitely have dismounted the 4 stand BG of knights and probably another BG too. One of those on each vulnerable flank makes life very difficult for shooty armies.

The army consists of two troop types: knights and shooters. In most games one of these types will be the decisive arm and the other the supporting arm. Against shooty cavalry I would suggest that the shooters are the decisive arm as they are the only ones likely to inflict any damage. Therefore the knights are the supporting arm and carry out that role much better as HF. Against other armies, the knights are more likely to be decisive so should stay mounted with the shooters providing support to get them where they need to be. The tricky bit is deciding how many to dismount, if any.

Julian

Fulgrim · Post by **Fulgrim** » Tue Jul 21, 2009 9:31 am

Thanks for charing!

MARVIN_THE_ARVN · Post by **MARVIN_THE_ARVN** » Wed Jul 22, 2009 4:52 pm

Nice report!!!

Interesting army choice and good to see it did well!!!

BlackPrince · Post by **BlackPrince** » Thu Jul 23, 2009 10:00 pm

nice AAR -thanks but I have two questions about your first game.
How did the Ilkhanid get steppe territory as the army list only gives the Ilkhanid agricultural?
Do you know make up of the Ilkhanid army?

Keith

iversonjm · Post by **iversonjm** » Thu Jul 23, 2009 11:20 pm

To answer the first question, that was because the Ilkhanid player (me) assumed without looking that the Mongols would have steppes.

Oops.

In my defense, I'd swear that I've played against other Ilkhanids that used steppes, but that's probably because I never bothered to check...

To answer the second, the list is posted on the NA FOG forum.

Hepius · Post by **Hepius** » Fri Jul 24, 2009 1:41 am

Ahhh.... the price of assuming your very experienced opponent knows what terrain his army can choose. I never looked it up because I used to play Ilkhanids in DBM and felt no need to look up his army composition.

You're still ok in my book, Matt.

I'll just have to watch you like a hawk for now on.

Warchariot · Post by **Warchariot** » Wed Jul 29, 2009 3:39 pm

Can someone tell me where on the forum Matt's list is??? I don't know where the

"posted on the NA FOG forum"

is...

daleivan · Post by **daleivan** » Wed Jul 29, 2009 4:03 pm

Thanks for the AAR

Dale

Delbruck · Post by **Delbruck** » Wed Jul 29, 2009 4:47 pm

That's NorthAmerican FoG Yahoo Group.

I hope Matt doesn't mind, this is his open list:

IC - - - - - - CinC 1
FC - - - - - - - 1
TC - - - - - - - 1
1 Kurdish Archers LF Unprotected Average Undrilled Bow - - - 4
2 Horse Archers LH Unprotected Average Drilled Bow - Swordmen - 4
3 Horse Archers LH Unprotected Average Drilled Bow - Swordmen - 4
4 Horse Archers LH Unprotected Average Drilled Bow - Swordmen - 4
5 Horse Archers LH Unprotected Average Drilled Bow - Swordmen - 4
6 Horse Archers LH Unprotected Average Drilled Bow - Swordmen - 4
7 Horse Archers LH Unprotected Average Drilled Bow - Swordmen - 4
8 Horse Archers LH Unprotected Average Drilled Bow - Swordmen - 4
9 Horse Archers LH Unprotected Superior Drilled Bow - Swordmen - 4
10 Turcomen Cv Protected Average Undrilled Bow - Swordmen - 4
11 Mongol Cavalry Cv Protected Superior Drilled Bow - Swordmen - 4
12 Best Equipped Cv Armoured Superior Drilled Bow - Swordmen - 4
13 Hospitallers Kn Heavily armoured Superior Drilled - Lancers Swordmen - 4

I think Matt's tactical skills might put Genghis Khan to shame

Legionbuilder · Post by **Legionbuilder** » Sat Aug 29, 2009 5:23 pm

Burgundians are an interesting choice
I have some unpainted MiniFigs around here somewhere
I think I need a Knight Army!!!!

Great report

Hepius · Post by **Hepius** » Fri Sep 04, 2009 11:20 pm

I love the wall-of-steel. The nice thing about Medieval Burgundians is that the average knights dismount as superior. This paid off big when I went up against a successor army with a ton of pike.

I partially took the army because I figured nobody had ever used it in a tournament before. I also viewed it as a 100YW English(cheap). I had fun, but probably won't try it again.

gozerius · Post by **gozerius** » Sat Sep 05, 2009 3:37 am

There are hundreds of pretty good armies out there that don't get played because they don't fit into the official "killer tournament army" template. So when they appear, people don't know what to do about them. Well done. I hope that you do play the army again. It sounds like a lot of fun.