Expert and Double Support not realistically obtainable in AO

[Tassadar]

Food for thought topic. In AO conditions, Skilled Support requires 20 support fire rounds provided. That's fine, doable even within SCW conditions for a unit or two. However, then comes Expert Support with 150 support rounds required. I'm on 1943 with my third core now and none of my units is even remotely close tho that - the best is maybe about half way there. If I'm really, really luckly there might be units that get Expert Support by 1945. Maybe. I do not even know they amount needed for Double Support since it's probably so crazy high it it snot obtainable.

I feel like this really should be changed. 20 for Skilled Support is fine (maybe bump it to 25 as for Steamroller), but then maybe 75 for Expert and 150 for Double? I really fail to see conditions in which 150 round are realistic by 1943 or even 1944, aside from maybe the Slow Reaction trait.

[DefiantXYX]

Same goes for my cores, 150 will never be reached.
If you start in SCW 150 seams realistic, but the game style changes a lot.
In SCW artillery support fire most of the time is essential, in 1942/1943 it is no longer needed.

[dalfrede]

It is a simple text file change.
The rules file for AO DLCs, I don't recall the exact name, but it is clear if you see it.

[Bee1976]

Well in my last playthrough 5 of my units got 300 supports.

1 neubaufahrzeug ( )
1 anti air
1 Anti-Tank
2 artillery

All you need is camouflage hero. With that you can build "traps" and baits. for example: tank in a city tile near to infatry and the camouflaged artillery behind. or a a real weak unit like bridge engineers to fortifications and that camouflaged support behind.
if you are lucky and get camouflage + double support hero it becomes quite fast. there are some maps with fortifications so placed that you can cover 2 baits on 2 diffrent baits with 1 artillery.

without camou it seems really impossible because the ai wont attack protected units

[adiekmann]

Yeah, I just checked and three of my artillery units have Lvl 2 "Expert Support" at the end of AO43. But my favorite hero combo of Double Support and Camouflage is probably responsible for that. It also racks up the kills quickly when used intelligently. Similar strategy can be applied to AT and a good tank. Add AT Support to the tank and it's a monster. Valuable in harder levels.

On a side note, if you find you core from Spain too OP now, but beginning with a new core too challenging, I suggest a good starting point is AO41 without importing a core. The preset core comes with some very good heroes, and you can still build a pretty good, though smaller, core by 43.

[adiekmann]

Oh, I have always wondered what level 3's reward is...I guess from your post that it's Double Support? That's cool!

[VirgilInTheSKY]

Oh, I have always wondered what level 3's reward is...I guess from your post that it's Double Support? That's cool!

It is. But you lose the accurancy bonus from Skilled and Expert Support, plus it costs you more ammo, so sometimes it can actually be a downgrade.

[Tassadar]

It is a simple text file change.
The rules file for AO DLCs, I don't recall the exact name, but it is clear if you see it.

Agreed, but it would be good to see it changed in the game by default, as not many players will know of this. Being such a simple fix it might be worth a go in the next patch.

if you are lucky and get camouflage + double support hero it becomes quite fast. there are some maps with fortifications so placed that you can cover 2 baits on 2 diffrent baits with 1 artillery.

My best Camouflage guys are at about 70-90 support right now in any of the runs, but indeed with Double Support hero added it would be much better. One of the only few ways this can be done it seems, but still short of the goals I'd need to meet.

Oh, I have always wondered what level 3's reward is...I guess from your post that it's Double Support? That's cool!

It is. But you lose the accurancy bonus from Skilled and Expert Support, plus it costs you more ammo, so sometimes it can actually be a downgrade.

Do you? I recall Edmon mentioning in the heroes video that it stacks, but perhaps just if Double Support is added separately by a hero?

[adiekmann]

Oh, I have always wondered what level 3's reward is...I guess from your post that it's Double Support? That's cool!

It is. But you lose the accurancy bonus from Skilled and Expert Support, plus it costs you more ammo, so sometimes it can actually be a downgrade.

Even if that's true, by this point your unit has probably 5 stars of experience and the experience bonus to accuracy minimizes the impact. You can't have over 100% accuracy, anyways, correct?

[adiekmann]

A favorite unit to use this on is the StuG IIIB. Camouflage, lethal, double support, OS to 15, low slot cost, and an ammo count of 6 =

[VirgilInTheSKY]

Oh, I have always wondered what level 3's reward is...I guess from your post that it's Double Support? That's cool!

It is. But you lose the accurancy bonus from Skilled and Expert Support, plus it costs you more ammo, so sometimes it can actually be a downgrade.

Do you? I recall Edmon mentioning in the heroes video that it stacks, but perhaps just if Double Support is added separately by a hero?

He did, but it's that Skilled Support, Expert Support and Double Support stacks with each other, all three has hero available. Problem here is that when you reach another rank, you have to stack the other two yourself, and you have to have them first. If you earned Double Support medal, you'll have to stick Skilled and Expert to benefit from what used to be yours.