I am not a fan of the terrain art

[Mord]

I am really disappointed in the direction the terrain art has taken for Medieval. It's a huge let down after waiting all this time. It's not progressive and it's definitely the wrong place to inject some kind of Medieval art aesthetic (the UI and menus are the place for that and they do look awesome and add much to the atmosphere). The more I see of the new terrain the more I dislike it. It does not fit.


I want to fight battles on battlefields that look like battlefields not some artsy interpretation of a battlefield. FoG II has the best texture set out of all the titles (Sengoku Jidai, Pike and Shot), and now you guys choose to erase that and take us back 5 years. Nothing I have seen in pics or videos makes me think this is a good choice and it's actually pissing me off after waiting 19 months. Granted the units look excellent, the new castle and village houses look good, and the Winter textures seem decent, but the rest I just can't stand. The newer (at least summer terrain) is flat, has no depth to it, no texture, and is cartoony in the worst way.

Now, if I can just replace Medieval's texture palette with FoG II's, no worries, but from what I can tell there's been some significant changes and it's not gonna be 100% doable. The farmland for instance, is just flat terrain with different colors; there's no tall grasses (as shown in the pics below), no layers.

Take a look at these comparison pics. I just don't get why this "new" look was considered a good idea.

New terrain




Old





New Rough





Old Rough













New Hills and Marsh





Old Hills









Old Marsh





New Farmland







Old Farmland











On all fronts, aesthetically, eye candy, and artistic wise, I am gonna go as far as to say that the older terrain art is objectively better. The grass is lush and textured, there's depth and height with various farmland, rough and marsh look suitably natural and formidable, and everything it's just overall more "layered" looking. Where as the new stuff is as I stated above, flat, devoid of any real textures, and cartoony.

So, if you guys are gonna force this "new" look on us, I BEG of you, that you either allow us to be able to mod everything back to the way it was 100%, or add a toggle (like in SJ) to turn the textures from Cartoony to the old look. Other than my disdain for the terrain, I think you guys are doing a great job.


Mord.

[lapdog666]

i cant disagree more, and i m probably the biggest complainer around here. i just Love the new look. That said this is subjective to a degree. my liking of the new look is probably tied to my preferance for "clean,easy to draw a line" preffernce in graphics, enviroments. Old fog looked kinda washed out and rough. for example i always thought that green grass (not high grass or farmlands,just plain flat green ground) was hideous . this new one looks refreshing and inviting

[Mord]

Yuck! Looks like 1994 to me.



Mord.

[Mord]

my liking of the new look is probably tied to my preferance for "clean,easy to draw a line" preffernce in graphics, enviroments.

I can agree with that for certain games, just not this one. It just looks awful to me.



Mord.

[Athos1660]

This is 100% a matter of personal taste.
And I for one really do like the terrain in FoGII: Medieval.
(I even prefer it compared to that of FoGII: Ancients)
Terrain was definitely the right place "to inject (...) Medieval art aesthetic".
And the 3D/Texture Artists did a wonderful job.

Just my opinion of course

[Mord]

Terrain was definitely the right place "to inject (...) Medieval art aesthetic".

NOPE! UI, menu, unit cards etc. but completely changing the terrain destroys the look and it doesn't fit with the units. It looks worse than Pike & Shot because of this. Bad decision. BAD. BAD. BAD. If I can change it I won't care (no harm done), but if I can't, I won't buy the game. I HATE it that much.

Mord.

[Mord]

And the 3D/Texture Artists did a wonderful job.

Just my opinion of course

For the record, I don't think the art is bad. I think it's a bad choice for this game. If all the units were done in the same style (which I wouldn't want) it would all fit together cohesively, like P&S and SJ.


Mord.

[lapdog666]

i wish the UI was richer tho. yes its good but its barebones. Best example is when you select a unit, it shows it in 3d on a black background (same idea in Endless legend,gladius and other games ). A richer experience imo is to have a separate unique 2d picture of each unit (think of battle for middle earth pictures near the mini map , but more cartoney perhaps and Bigger for sure)

[Athos1660]

For the record, I don't think the art is bad. I think it's a bad choice for this game.

And I do think the art is good and is a good choice for this game.
(after 100 hours of playing the beta)
Still a matter of taste though...

If all the units were done in the same style (which I wouldn't want) it would all fit together cohesively, like P&S and SJ.

The units are done quite in the same style as the terrain (ie both based on Medieval manuscript illustrations).
Put another way, the 3D soldiers in FoG2: Medieval are quite similar to tabletop miniatures and to the soldiers painted on Medieval manuscript illustrations.

[Athos1660]

(double post)

[Mord]

i wish the UI was richer tho. yes its good but its barebones. Best example is when you select a unit, it shows it in 3d on a black background (same idea in Endless legend,gladius and other games ). A richer experience imo is to have a separate unique 2d picture of each unit (think of battle for middle earth pictures near the mini map , but more cartoney perhaps and Bigger for sure)

Yep. I am a big fan of unit pics over 3D models.

A UI can be just as immersive and engaging as the actual combat if done right.


Mord.

[Mord]

The units are done quite in the same style as the terrain (ie both based on Medieval manuscript illustrations).
Put another way, the 3D soldiers in FoG2: Medieval are quite similar to tabletop miniatures and to the soldiers painted on Medieval manuscript illustrations.

OK.



Mord.

[Adraeth]

Indeed i love it, considering the engine from Pike and Shot, Sengoku jidai and FOG 2 i love the attention from the developers to "portrait", or well maybe better "to paint" the game to let the player jump inside that age of the game.

So in pike and shot i played on a page book from the "the art of war" (ou l'art de la guerre) aged around 1700 (i have some original part from that book); in sengoku jidai i played on a japanese painting .... so, for the same reason, i love the FOG2 Medieval terrain

[76mm]

While it's clearly purely a matter of personal taste, I also much prefer the look of the original FOG2 terrain; in fact I think that the FOG2 maps are some of the best wargame maps I've ever used (and the map generator is probably the best). Rather sorry that we'll be taking what is (in my view) a step backwards with FOG2M.

[Karvon]

Based only on the screenshots, I would have to agree with those who prefer the current ancient look to the new medieval one. The latter look too groomed park like for my tastes.

Something I wish FOG2 supported was an override folder where users could put alternative graphics files to replace the standard game ones. This would only change appearances on your own machine and folks could thus play with the look they like regardless of what others might be using.

Karvon

[Paul59]

Based only on the screenshots, I would have to agree with those who prefer the current ancient look to the new medieval one. The latter look too groomed park like for my tastes.

Something I wish FOG2 supported was an override folder where users could put alternative graphics files to replace the standard game ones. This would only change appearances on your own machine and folks could thus play with the look they like regardless of what others might be using.

Karvon

You can do that already with the Global mods system, by putting alternative textures in the Mods folder.

[Karvon]

Based only on the screenshots, I would have to agree with those who prefer the current ancient look to the new medieval one. The latter look too groomed park like for my tastes.

Something I wish FOG2 supported was an override folder where users could put alternative graphics files to replace the standard game ones. This would only change appearances on your own machine and folks could thus play with the look they like regardless of what others might be using.

Karvon

You can do that already with the Global mods system, by putting alternative textures in the Mods folder.

I wasn't aware of that, not that I'm a modder by an means

So the community could then create an alternative set of terrain graphics, pasting the ancient set in place of the medieval?

Can such global mods be used MP?

Thanks

Karvon

[Athos1660]

I strongly encourage anybody to try the Vanilla game first before thinking of modding its art style. Its sound effects, music and Medieval art aesthetic, including the terrain textures, provide all together a very nice medieval atmosphere.

(...)
i love the attention from the developers to "portrait", or well maybe better "to paint" the game to let the player jump inside that age of the game.

So in pike and shot i played on a page book from the "the art of war" (ou l'art de la guerre) aged around 1700 (i have some original part from that book); in sengoku jidai i played on a japanese painting ....
(...)

Indeed. I hope it'll continue in this way

[melm]

I guess the disalike comes from the low contrast of the terrain type, which makes the whole map look more tidy. The FOG2 Ancients' terrain has high contrast. For example, the slope and the rough ground, while the upcoming Medieval' s terrain looks having low shade effect. I think the dev could make terrain contrast higher to make them look more distinctive.

[76mm]

Indeed i love it, considering the engine from Pike and Shot, Sengoku jidai and FOG 2 i love the attention from the developers to "portrait", or well maybe better "to paint" the game to let the player jump inside that age of the game.

So in pike and shot i played on a page book from the "the art of war" (ou l'art de la guerre) aged around 1700 (i have some original part from that book); in sengoku jidai i played on a japanese painting .... so, for the same reason, i love the FOG2 Medieval terrain

Speaking for myself, this is the main reason I didn't buy Pike & Shot or Sengoku Jidai--I don't like how they look at all. FOG2M doesn't turn me off as much as they do, but it is not nearly as good as FOG2.

And one question: if you liked Pike & Shot and SJ because of their "atmospheric" graphics, did you like FOG2 despite the fact that it has conventional graphics?