On heroes..

[voxr]

Hi all, just a brief question;

I was about to start my second playthrough and in the interests of doing something different, would like to play the entire campaign with a large part of my core ideally consisting of beautepanzers. I did use captured equipment in my first (completed) playthrough but some of the rarer stuff (ie. SU-100Y on Moscow) only appears once and I would need to play on Manstein, take Trophies of War, or roll Scavenger before France (not that interested in the 7TP. I'm going Sedan this time and the first critical piece of equipment I want is the B1 which I can't field as the only instance is in Paris).

Not a fan of Manstein mode from the first game and I would prefer not to take Trophies since it makes even Generalissimus trivial.

I've been scumming Killer Team for an hour now but have never gotten Scavenger. I have also never gotten some other heroes like Rapid Fire 2x, On the Roll etc. which I don't care about but it does raise suspicions as to why I haven't seen even one. In fact the only reason I'm picking Killer Team is because of Scavenger and the other two are just incidental bonuses.

I suspect Killer Team has a defined list of heroes you can roll from and Scavenger is simply not on the list. I tried looking in the game files and the editor but no luck there.

Scavenger can simply be obtained through console but I would prefer to do this run in the Ironman spirit (I'm saying this even as I reroll).

Can any devs or more knowledgeable people comment on this? I know it's a small sample size but even my patience has limits with regards to rerolling v. actually playing the game.

P.S. my question turned out to be not so brief after all.

[fluffybunnyuk]

The best way seems to me to be to roll your killer team, and dismiss the worst hero , and just console add scavenger in.
Its just not worth the time scumming for a combo you want especially with rare heroes. Some turn up often like provocateur,consolidator, reduced/zero slots, rapid fire 1.5x, a few like scavenger have turned up once for me.
I'd like overrun hero, combat luck, rapid fire 2x from the start... its never going to happen for me sadly.

[voxr]

Was Scavenger from Killer Team or a natural roll over the course of the campaign?

Also curious as to why Combat Luck seems to be a priority for you. I ended up with 3 on my completed campaign and though useful it doesn't seem a game changer like Vigilant etc.

I stuck 1 on a Pioniere, the other 2 on fighters and mostly just forgot they even had Combat Luck.

Edit: Forgot to mention dismissing a hero gives prestige now. I suppose I could console the amount out again though.

[SineMora]

Why on earth would you spend an hour startscumming when you can just use the console to give yourself whatever heroes you want? Reminds me of an old friend who spent over two hours rerolling stats for his protagonist in Baldur's Gate 2. When I asked him why he didn't just use a save editor to set them to whatever he wanted he gave me a horrified look and exclaimed, "But that'd be cheating!" As if rerolling stats for two hours was somehow a legitimate element of AD&D... I've always assumed that the game just handed you the first three heroes on the list generated when you start the campaign, but perhaps it does have limitations.

[voxr]

Why on earth would you spend an hour startscumming when you can just use the console to give yourself whatever heroes you want? Reminds me of an old friend who spent over two hours rerolling stats for his protagonist in Baldur's Gate 2. When I asked him why he didn't just use a save editor to set them to whatever he wanted he gave me a horrified look and exclaimed, "But that'd be cheating!" As if rerolling stats for two hours was somehow a legitimate element of AD&D... I've always assumed that the game just handed you the first three heroes on the list generated when you start the campaign, but perhaps it does have limitations.

I'm perfectly aware of the irony behind this but like your friend I consider using the console to be cheating so would only use it as a last resort. I suppose if I had to justify this (admittedly irrational) behaviour it would be that the investment of time (on my part) somewhat legitimises it.

I actually hadn't considered that Killer Team would simply give the first 3 heroes pre-generated which seems obvious in hindsight.

When I finally start this belated run tomorrow I'll probably just bite the bullet and take Trophies. I don't intend to capture en masse anyway as a self-imposed limitation so the prestige gain shouldn't be too skewed.

[adiekmann]

I have rolled "Scavenger" with Killer Team before. It is possible, but when you are aware of the full list of different possible heroes, you then realize that the odds are pretty small and not just for that one, but any one in particular. It once even rolled 2 zero slots heroes for me to start the game, so it is indeed random and therefore anything is possible, good or bad.

I echo what others said above: just type in "cheat NewHero Scavenger" and be done.

[fluffybunnyuk]

Was Scavenger from Killer Team or a natural roll over the course of the campaign?

Also curious as to why Combat Luck seems to be a priority for you. I ended up with 3 on my completed campaign and though useful it doesn't seem a game changer like Vigilant etc.

I stuck 1 on a Pionere, the other 2 on fighters and mostly just forgot they even had Combat Luck.

Scavenger dropped for me at one of the belgium missions early on. Just the once...

I play on 100% randomness... i go crazy seeing a predicted result of 0,-3 , only to end up with -2,0 sometimes. That gets very expensive when your using an 88 flak as an anti-tank unit early game.
Also 1 attack/turn units need steamroller(something i spam onto all my ground units except infantry) and thus an overrun to attack again. So combat luck is essential on anything that needs a good roll(equal to or better than average) to oneshot it. I had an infantry unit(with steamroller) yesterday or the day before that, that ran out of ammo for 2 turns (destroying 8 units). It made capturing Reims at the start of the Dijon map much easier...

No other hero is going to guarantee me the result of an overrun for sure by meeting the prediction and ensuring I avoid chip damage. Turning an average unit, into a monster.

[voxr]

Thanks all.

Just started a new campaign with heroes off and Trophies taken instead. Will limit myself to only capturing equipment I want to field to prevent prestige becoming irrelevant.

[Catacol]

Just started my first campaign - I only really want to play mp but thought I'd give it a go - and got scavenger as my first hero. Is that unusual?!

Anyway - I'm more interested in getting heroes into mp scenarios. Please can they be activated in the next patch!

[voxr]

Just started my first campaign - I only really want to play mp but thought I'd give it a go - and got scavenger as my first hero. Is that unusual?!

Anyway - I'm more interested in getting heroes into mp scenarios. Please can they be activated in the next patch!

Congrats; that was the only one I wanted but I just gave in and picked Trophies and turned heroes off entirely instead as my patience ran out.

Just a warning though; heroes are interesting for a bit (I played with them in my first run), but they make things a bit too easy even on Generalissimus.

[scorehouse]

where is the console to dismiss heroes? i know how to disband units but Heroes? when you dismiss a hero, do you immediately get another selection of your choice or what happens? what unit do you put first strike on? how do you capture Russian Tanks, AT's, AAF, etc. without weakening them to the point they can't be utilized? same note if i have an enemy unit totally surrounded at the end of a game/scenario, and i capture the last objective for a victory, will the surrounded unit be captured by the game engine and available at full strength for the next scenario within the current campaign? little off topic, but if you choose the New Purchase 25% Tank Discount, when you get further into the Campaign and you buy 20 units worth of Tanks, will u actually use only 15 units? thanks a struggling latrine tender /KP.

[SineMora]

Not sure you can, but you can just dismiss them so it's not really a problem. You do get 1000 prestige when doing so (no new hero), but prestige can be changed with the console so by removing 1000 from your pool you end up with no net difference. Outside of using certain heroes capturing is done by suppression a unit and then forcing it to retreat when it can't, thus prompting a surrender.

In practice this means that the best you can do without Scavenger/Trophies is 9 points from a tank, by suppressing at least 8/10 and then inflicing 1 point of damage. No, units have to be captured by you -- any units still on the map when the scenario ends will live to see another day, surrounded or not. Infantry/Panzer General just lowers the core slots needed to field the relevant units (rounded down), e.g., a Tiger I would normally require 7 core slots to field but only requires 5 with Panzer General -- the cost works out as 7*0.75 = 5.25, rounded down to 5.

[scorehouse]

thanks but where is console to dismiss? and you just play with fewer heros? so do elect to use either 25% option

[SineMora]

Check under unit details for any given core unit and select the heroes tab, then click assign hero to access the hero list and click to X to dismiss any of them.

[scorehouse]

ill try it thanks

[scorehouse]

found it! thanks what Hero traits work best with fighters and bombers? also, double attack and lethal attack?

[adiekmann]

For fighters I like First Strike, rebase

strategic Bombers: fav is Lethal Attack as it turns your normally only suppressing strat bombers into killing machines more powerful than even tactical bombers

Some heroes work well in general with most units, so it's not suited to any one particular type of unit only, like double attack and 2x rapid fire

There are more that can be useful, though not as consistently as others. For instance, camouflage, can be useful in certain circumstances like when escorting bombers and ground units, but not consistently every turn

The fact that you can reassign your heroes means you can experiment from mission to mission!

[scorehouse]

i've found Double Move to very successful with Stuka's . it allows them to attack then get out of the way so another Plane can attack even if it just an escorting fighter but a couple of overstrengthened Stukas back to back ....

[scorehouse]

does the AT Support Hero only work with Anti Tank Weapons or will it work with Tanks and AA in the Anti Tank mode also? if i have an Anti Tank unit in the middle of 3/4 tanks that r attacked will the Anti Tank weapon fire at all attackers or just the first? thanks

[dalfrede]

does the AT Support Hero only work with Anti Tank Weapons or will it work with Tanks and AA in the Anti Tank mode also? if i have an Anti Tank unit in the middle of 3/4 tanks that r attacked will the Anti Tank weapon fire at all attackers or just the first? thanks

The AT Support Hero does not work with AT, only non AT like tanks or Art.

An AT unit will fire in support until it runs out of ammo.