KV-1 1941 and 1942 versions

[Blade0]

I have noticed that - based on game statistics - Kv-1 1942 is a serious downgrade compared to the famous (or feared) KV-1 1941. I started researching if this was indeed a blunder of the Soviet design bureaus, or there is some mistake here.
What happens in the game files is that 1942 KV-1 gains a simple point of armor, while speed drops 1 point from 5 to 4 (along with the fuel it carries).
What I have found so far is that Soviets added extra armor, and maybe changed the construction of the turret, increased carried ammo slightly, thus increasing the tank's weight by 2 tons, from 45 to 47 tons, and retaining the same 600HP V-12 engine called "V2". While the sustained speed of the vehicle dropped, the armor increase should have been considerable, at least on paper.
The KV-1(and -2) is really going obsolete in 1942-43, but not because they're getting considerably worse. The Wermacht is introducing a new chassis "Tiger", and upgrades PzIII-PzIV turrets so even the KV-1 armor, which was virtually impenetrable in 1941 by tanks, starts to be inadequate. They're trying to make it faster by removing armor (KV1S), or retrofit the chassis with the new IS turret (KV-85), but the chassis is outdated, so it will be retired and playing a secondary role beside the more successful T-34 and IS series.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lgm3i34ess8

So, what do you think? Was is really worth 1 point of ground defense what they did to the armor? Was the speed drop for the extra 2 tons so great that it reduced the vehicle's speed considerably?
Actually the stats look like they were taken directly from Wikipedia, and the source is an 1984 book:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IS-1_tank#Comparisons

[Horseman]

I have noticed that - based on game statistics - Kv-1 1942 is a serious downgrade compared to the famous (or feared) KV-1 1941. I started researching if this was indeed a blunder of the Soviet design bureaus, or there is some mistake here.
What happens in the game files is that 1942 KV-1 gains a simple point of armor, while speed drops 1 point from 5 to 4 (along with the fuel it carries).
What I have found so far is that Soviets added extra armor, and maybe changed the construction of the turret, increased carried ammo slightly, thus increasing the tank's weight by 2 tons, from 45 to 47 tons, and retaining the same 600HP V-12 engine called "V2". While the sustained speed of the vehicle dropped, the armor increase should have been considerable, at least on paper.
The KV-1(and -2) is really going obsolete in 1942-43, but not because they're getting considerably worse. The Wermacht is introducing a new chassis "Tiger", and upgrades PzIII-PzIV turrets so even the KV-1 armor, which was virtually impenetrable in 1941 by tanks, starts to be inadequate. They're trying to make it faster by removing armor (KV1S), or retrofit the chassis with the new IS turret (KV-85), but the chassis is outdated, so it will be retired and playing a secondary role beside the more successful T-34 and IS series.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lgm3i34ess8

So, what do you think? Was is really worth 1 point of ground defense what they did to the armor? Was the speed drop for the extra 2 tons so great that it reduced the vehicle's speed considerably?
Actually the stats look like they were taken directly from Wikipedia, and the source is an 1984 book:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IS-1_tank#Comparisons

Based on the articles the speed actually drops quite considerably so a reduction to 4 from 5 move seems correct.

Also when you look at the armour figures whilst it did increase at the thickest it also decreased at the thinnest - this balances out a bit to only result in a moderate increase in GD.

As an example of how you need to balance out all four facings of armour when working out GD look at the Panther and Tiger. They have the same GD. From the front the Panther was a better protected target (in part due to the sloped armour) however the Panthers side armour was vastly inferior.

[Akkula]

Stats are not that bad.
What it bothers me is the game is using the same model for both versions . They had clearly different base of the turret.

[Blade0]

Well, as I see, no one got past Wikipedia.
Whatever, seems I am the only one interested.
Let's just say that we have no evidence the game data is incorrect - we just don't have sufficient data, as very few KV-1 tanks survived the war, and those are either early models, or very late models custom modified.

[Horseman]

Well, as I see, no one got past Wikipedia.
Whatever, seems I am the only one interested.
Let's just say that we have no evidence the game data is incorrect - we just don't have sufficient data, as very few KV-1 tanks survived the war, and those are either early models, or very late models custom modified.

Are you serious?

Based on what you posted then yes +1 GD and -1 move is entirely correct.

But no. You were not the only one interested.

[Retributarr]

Stats are not that bad.
What it bothers me is the game is using the same model for both versions . They had clearly different base of the turret.

Kliment Voroshilov tank
https://wiki2.org/en/Kliment_Voroshilov_tank
KV-1

VKV-1 vehicle 'Statistics' at above Web-Link:


KV-2

VKV-2 vehicle 'Statistics' at above Web-Link:

World of Tanks KV-2 - 12 Kills 4,9K Damage (1 VS 5)
https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=KV ... &FORM=VIRE

[Akkula]

Stats are not that bad.
What it bothers me is the game is using the same model for both versions . They had clearly different base of the turret.

Man, I was talking about the KV-1 variants.....

[Retributarr]

Stats are not that bad.
What it bothers me is the game is using the same model for both versions . They had clearly different base of the turret.

Man, I was talking about the KV-1 variants.....

I just briefly checked the 'Web-Link' from my previous post and this is what I saw, its not exactly what you requested... but it is something to look at!.

Comparison of selected KV tank chassis variants:

[Akkula]

KV-1940, 1941 and 1942 had different geometry at the lower parts of their turrets:
KV-1 Model 1940


KV-1 Model 1941

There was even a different variant of the Model 1941 turret:


KV-1 Model 1942


Best regards,
Akkula.