Ammo

[janscas]

In PC1 ammo was an important feature.
I feel It's no longer important in PC2.

You can totally forget about ammo in PC2.
I've play a lot of scenarios now and I can tell I've just have to consider ammo on the game 1 or 2 times.

The ammo owned by units should be lowered to have some effect on units. A tank with 6 ammo it's never ever having problems with ammo (unless you create a godzilla with stacked heroe superpowers).

[Horseman]

In PC1 ammo was an important feature.
I feel It's no longer important in PC2.

You can totally forget about ammo in PC2.
I've play a lot of scenarios now and I can tell I've just have to consider ammo on the game 1 or 2 times.

The ammo owned by units should be lowered to have some effect on units. A tank with 6 ammo it's never ever having problems with ammo (unless you create a godzilla with stacked heroe superpowers).

Whilst I agree that you do not have to think about ammo the same way as you did in PC1, I do think there are times ammo becomes important in PC2

1) If a unit is encircled it doesn't get resupplied, So you go ham with your Godzilla tank....use up all bar 1 of its ammo then the unit gets encircled so doesn't get resupplied. Your one attack breaks the encirclement but now you have no ammo......in your opponents turn now Godzilla is more Godzooky and vulnerable.

2) Artillery/AT/AD can't shoot in support if they have no ammo

Now most of the time unless you play MP it'll be you using this against the AI because you're smarter and the AI isn't great at exploiting things like this.....in example 1, if the situation was reversed you might use a sacrificial unit to use up Godzilla's last shot then swarm him so he had no chance of escape. The AI is not likely to make such a poor odds attack to do so in my experience.

TLDR: You can't totally forget about ammo (or fuel) but you do need to do some work to use the feature to your advantage to see the effect.

[Nalikill]

Suppression and Ammo are actually two of the more interesting aspects of the game -

Defensively-inflicted suppression is far more valuable than offensively inflicted suppression.
Suppression lasts till the start of the player's turn.
So if you inflict suppression with your defensive response fire, you can "double up" on the suppression by firing again at that same unit on your own turn with the same artillery that fired defensively, typically allowing you to destroy the unit outright with almost no losses.

Similarly, Ammo is replenished at the start of a player's turn.
#1 - if you're encircled, you're going to need that ammo to escape the encirclement.
#2 - if they can keep establishing an encirclement, even if you escape it before the end of each turn, your tanks will eventually surrender.

It also gives Overrun more of a cost/consequence consideration: If I keep overrunning, I'm going to run out of ammo, and I'm going to out-pace my supporting vehicles.

If I run out of ammo, I can't defensively fire at attackers, so they can get free hits on my tanks.

It gives those Overstrength godzilla units a downside: if they go on a rampage, they can't defend themselves from the response. Conversely, a swarm of normal strength tanks are going to take a lot more losses doing the same job - but they will always have the ammo to fire defensively too.

This means you can't just overstrength one or two godlike tank units and have that be your army. They'll never have the ammo to match a swarm of smaller tanks.

Some cases Ammo might be a little too high, but at the same time, you're relying heavily on your tanks to do a lot of work. Not inconcievable to go through 6 ammo on a superheavy overstrengthed tank in a turn.

Fuel is probably a bit too high though... I only once forced a unit to surrender because it lacked fuel. I think it was a KV-1 that I just couldn't surround completely so I had to play ping-pong with it until it ran out of fuel. I might be missing something but fuel never seems to come into relevance. Maybe if you're in a giant encirclement for a very long period of time? But that never happens in campaign.

[janscas]

I don't know your play style but count how many times any of your own units has depleted it's ammo reserves.

For me in 3/4 of the poland campaign it's about 1 or 2 times on all the scenarios.

That's pretty insignificant from the tactical standpoint.

[eskuche]

I’m currently futzing around in Moscow in the snow (50% penalty) with limited supplies (50% penalty) and chaotic fire (double ammo shot). Let me tell you I’m definitely worrying about ammo.

[SineMora]

I’m currently futzing around in Moscow in the snow (50% penalty) with limited supplies (50% penalty) and chaotic fire (double ammo shot). Let me tell you I’m definitely worrying about ammo.

Now that is a masochistic combination. I only tried limited supplies for three scenarios before I ditched it, because it effectively made recons garbage (too little fuel to be able to move properly). CHaotic fire is easier to deal with, but combined? Ugh.

[nexusno2000]

I’m currently futzing around in Moscow in the snow (50% penalty) with limited supplies (50% penalty) and chaotic fire (double ammo shot). Let me tell you I’m definitely worrying about ammo.

Combining limited supplies and chaotic fire is a very bad idea to begin with

[Kerensky]

I’m currently futzing around in Moscow in the snow (50% penalty) with limited supplies (50% penalty) and chaotic fire (double ammo shot). Let me tell you I’m definitely worrying about ammo.

Combining limited supplies and chaotic fire is a very bad idea to begin with

Maybe... but then perhaps that is why they put the options in there? If players find ammo too plentiful for their taste, fine tuning the experience to fit what they prefer is awesome. I luved tweaking values and difficulty settings in Xcom2, and I adore it here in Panzer Corps 2.

[Nalikill]

Maybe... but then perhaps that is why they put the options in there? If players find ammo too plentiful for their taste, fine tuning the experience to fit what they prefer is awesome. I luved tweaking values and difficulty settings in Xcom2, and I adore it here in Panzer Corps 2.

I do kinda wish positives and negatives were tied together though rather than being pick-and-choose. In X-Com, most of the advanced difficulty / second wave settings were double-edged swords.

Right now it's too easy for people just to optimize the benefits and costs, and the choices would be more interesting if the most powerful benefits and deadliest costs were tied together.

Something like -

Flexible Command - Your command structure is flexible but that makes it difficult to integrate new units. -10% core slots, splits are free and a unit can split and merge any number of times.
Chaotic Fire - Your fire drills focus on volume over accuracy. All of your units fire 25% faster but use 2 ammo per shot.
No Artillery - The age of concentrated fire being able to bring down any target is over. Achtung Panzer! -1 core slot on each Tank unit; cannot purchase Artillery.
No Aircraft - An airplane can do many things, but it cannot take or hold ground. Infantry is still the Queen of Battle. -1 core slot on each infantry unit; cannot purchase Aircraft.
Deadly Grasp - Your command focuses on lightning strikes to achieve defeat in detail. 2x penalties from encirclement, for both you and your enemy.

Maybe something for modding to look at?

[janscas]

I’m currently futzing around in Moscow in the snow (50% penalty) with limited supplies (50% penalty) and chaotic fire (double ammo shot). Let me tell you I’m definitely worrying about ammo.

That's a corner case.. don't you think?