Sandstorm - Tobruk: No attacking from top of cliffs?

[KarisFraMauro]

I figured it would be unfair for me to complain if I wasn't willing to revisit Sandstorm. It's actually fun now that I know what I'm doing If a future update makes the escarpment thing a bit more explicit that would definitely be appreciated.

[bru888]

I figured it would be unfair for me to complain if I wasn't willing to revisit Sandstorm. It's actually fun now that I know what I'm doing If a future update makes the escarpment thing a bit more explicit that would definitely be appreciated.

That's the spirit! I just wanted to let you know that what you are seeing are not bugs but the two issues that Erik covered: 1) a manual that dearly needs updating, and 2) also needed is a graphic tweak to rough desert hexes to make them more apparent. What I showed you as to travel restrictions on this type of terrain do make sense.

[timberwolf15]

What was interesting about Sandstorm was in a way the terrain that one could not do certain things in that one assumed they could this provided the mysteries of a desert and after the initial frustration it was fun to yell at the monitor and say I got you now as you put infantry next to hexes that needed taking where you then annihilated the unit that was jeering at you earlier cause your tanks couldn't mess with it these hexes placed near choke points with a VP town hex though were also to much "fog of war" or whatever but they are not bugs.

[KarisFraMauro]

Ha by some miracle I managed to beat Sandstorm! Yes it was on easy difficulty obviously, but that never made a difference on Blitzkreig. Just had to sort out some misunderstandings at my end.

Now the question is whether to revisit previous other campaigns I gave up on, or buy those pacific ones I never tried. Actually one thing I remember being a dealbreaker in Winter War was having to destroy some Russian supply trucks that would flee off map as soon as I spotted them with an aircraft. Given the swarm of armour, infantry and anti-aircraft between them and my forces it felt slightly unfair.

[timberwolf15]

Ha by some miracle I managed to beat Sandstorm! Yes it was on easy difficulty obviously, but that never made a difference on Blitzkreig. Just had to sort out some misunderstandings at my end.

Now the question is whether to revisit previous other campaigns I gave up on, or buy those pacific ones I never tried. Actually one thing I remember being a dealbreaker in Winter War was having to destroy some Russian supply trucks that would flee off map as soon as I spotted them with an aircraft. Given the swarm of armour, infantry and anti-aircraft between them and my forces it felt slightly unfair.

Have you played a Custom Campaign yet - made by a person using the Editor here is a great on that is about the Winter War entitled "Winter War 1939" you will have to download it, unzip it, and copy the entire folder into your Campaigns directory specific instructions for this being in a sticky .... here is the link to the campaign file ...
viewtopic.php?f=374&t=94345

[KarisFraMauro]

Thanks, I may give it a go. I'm a bit of a luddite / technophobe with respect to things like mods (in fact I still don't even have any contacts on steam after more than a year) but seem to remember some really cool custom single-stage maps. Currently having some fun with endsieg.

It's weird, I was initally pretty ambiguous about Order of Battle in comparison to Panzer Corps. Bit too fiddly. Now I prefer it though. It's very chess-like, where when things go wrong you can adopt different approaches. In Panzer Corps by comparison it feels like you're never more than one bad dice roll from all your efforts getting undone.

[bru888]

It's weird, I was initally pretty ambiguous about Order of Battle in comparison to Panzer Corps. Bit too fiddly. Now I prefer it though. It's very chess-like, where when things go wrong you can adopt different approaches. In Panzer Corps by comparison it feels like you're never more than one bad dice roll from all your efforts getting undone.

This is an interesting comparison.

[timberwolf15]

Thanks, I may give it a go. I'm a bit of a luddite / technophobe with respect to things like mods (in fact I still don't even have any contacts on steam after more than a year) but seem to remember some really cool custom single-stage maps. Currently having some fun with endsieg.

It's weird, I was initally pretty ambiguous about Order of Battle in comparison to Panzer Corps. Bit too fiddly. Now I prefer it though. It's very chess-like, where when things go wrong you can adopt different approaches. In Panzer Corps by comparison it feels like you're never more than one bad dice roll from all your efforts getting undone.

I think you hit the nail on the head !!!!
It did or does seem there was for the most part a narrow way to complete the scenario a linear way especially if you did not choose the extra turns option when playing Panzer Corps. I think Panzer Corps but I may be wrong allows ones arty to fire if it is next to a hex that gets attacked OOB does not but then OOB I think allows the AT gun to fire but anyway point is OOB filled in all the gaps of Panzer Corps - with the supply concept and a bunch of other things including you do not have to have a degree in calculus to figure out if over strength of a unit is beneficial cost effective or not in OOB there is no over strength you rather decide what type of reinforcements to give in order to maintain experience similar to Panzer Corps but you do not have to factor in overstrength yes or no and then it varies how much it cost depending on which unit and how much what a headache. There currently is a video of a guy playing Panzer Corps 2 and he just got the game but he is spending a long time restarting a scenario trying to figure out if it is beneficial to overstrength a unit which costs slots to do or to rather have an additional unit and or if he does overstregth a unit should he have just one of those with massive oversrenght and the rest of his units regular and he keeps restarting and figuring the attack kill vs units lost ratio they poor guy can't even just play the game because it can be completely wasteful to have an overstrenght unit even depending up what other unit it attacks and where

[KarisFraMauro]

So in other words, Order of Battle 2 when I do like the ammunition / fuel aspect in Panzer Corps, although in a sense efficiency (which I initially had a hard time getting my head around) fills the same role. Likewise the penchant units have for retreating. At first it was annoying to never be able to finish off a foe in one attack, but now it's kind of amusing to "ping pong" the enemy back and forth until they're zilch. Plus if I make a mistake or am unlucky, it's not the end of the world.

Actually one important improvement I hope Panzer Corps 2 makes (although the ONE computer store where I live is now closed so I can forget about upgrading, sigh...) is being more generous with turn limits. Constantly being forced to make borderline suicidal charges right into the fortifications left me pulling my hair out. Definitely less of a worry in Order of Battle. Like by all means make it challenging of course, but maybe have different objectives than just rush rush rush.

[timberwolf15]

So in other words, Order of Battle 2 when I do like the ammunition / fuel aspect in Panzer Corps, although in a sense efficiency (which I initially had a hard time getting my head around) fills the same role. Likewise the penchant units have for retreating. At first it was annoying to never be able to finish off a foe in one attack, but now it's kind of amusing to "ping pong" the enemy back and forth until they're zilch. Plus if I make a mistake or am unlucky, it's not the end of the world.

Actually one important improvement I hope Panzer Corps 2 makes (although the ONE computer store where I live is now closed so I can forget about upgrading, sigh...) is being more generous with turn limits. Constantly being forced to make borderline suicidal charges right into the fortifications left me pulling my hair out. Definitely less of a worry in Order of Battle. Like by all means make it challenging of course, but maybe have different objectives than just rush rush rush.

The turn limits aspect of Panzer Corps can be a headache because your actually doing things tactically that most commanders would probably not due actually it is also similar to this concept Patton perhaps would Charge Forward but perhaps Monty would need more turns or maybe even Bradley. So then a person's play style should be able to be reflected in the game as Generals in the real war conducted themselves such as a more cautious General vs one that is more daring ... but what can happen is this is not possible in the game which .... is a headache; however, I think Panzer Corps 2 DOES allow extra turn limits BUT they screwed up whereas OOB folks do not - what happens in Pzc2 is the turn limit option is set and etched in stone one cannot change it at the BEGINNING of a Campaign [ so some moron coded it this way thinking ok we will let the player set up the campaign ok great did that done that now on to the next thing] however this cannot be changed so it you want extra turns you have to use a cheat which to me takes away from the overall experience or you have to restart the campaign and do the add turns option which of course may make the player feel like that on many scenarios they have way to many turns so what needs to happen is that during a campaign a player can change this ..

[KarisFraMauro]

Huh. How would you say Fantasy General 2 fares in comparison, if anybody knows? I vaguely remember playing the first one and liking it ages ago. Although I'm starting to think Order of Battle will be keeping me busy for a good long time...