Fraggy troops

[Scrumpy]

The following occured in a game tonight, and it seemed rather odd to say the least.

A bg of elephants and ghazi managed to rout a bg of hoplites. The ghazi fragged after losing their share of the combat, but still pursue the routing Greeks and slam into a fresh unit of hoplites.

I assume this was the correct procedure, but it seems a little odd to say the least that a unit as morale beaten as they were could attack another unit.

[SirGarnet]

Ghazis? I seriously doubt their morale was beaten after a victory - they were just seriously battered and disorganized, and therefore vulnerable to solid troops in good order. They could take a CMT to stop pursuit 1 MU short of the fresh hoplites (p108), but this would dampen their enthusiasm (i.e., they can no longer charge, and have to take a test for being charged while fragmented when the hoplites charge at their next opportunity). If the next turn belongs to the enemy, then charging in is the best option. Even if the next turn is friendly, unless you have a commander able to bolster them I think charging in is still the best option since you are pinned and unable to get away safely. Half the dice but a + POA and tying up the hoplites in combat and pursuit seems worth a shot vs simply being charged and routed.

[rogerg]

Fragmented troops cannot charge. A pursuit reaching fresh enemy is taken as a charge. Should the correct ruling then be that the fragmented pursuers may not contact fresh enemy? I do not have the rules here to check this.

[SirGarnet]

Fragmented troops cannot charge. A pursuit reaching fresh enemy is taken as a charge. Should the correct ruling then be that the fragmented pursuers may not contact fresh enemy? I do not have the rules here to check this.

I don't have a problem with the idea but I don't think that's how it works. Pursuers contact enemy - that they can and must do except as specified for skirmishers choosing to stop vs. non-skirmishers or other troops testing to stop - this includes troops contacting enemy types they would not normally be allowed to charge.

The contact is then treated as a charge for evasion and for cohesion testing the contacted BG if fragmented, and then, if the enemy is still there, resolution as an Impact.

[hammy]

Fragmented troops cannot charge. A pursuit reaching fresh enemy is taken as a charge. Should the correct ruling then be that the fragmented pursuers may not contact fresh enemy? I do not have the rules here to check this.

There is no exception in the pursuit rules for fragmented troops.

P108

"Pursuers normally contact any fresh enemy in their path. However skirmishers ...."

"If pursuers contact fresh enemy in any phase, this is treated as a charge..."

[grahambriggs]

p108 bullets 8 and 9 are the relevant rules. The first says that pursuers contact any fresh enemy in their path (unless skirmishers or they pass a CMT not to). The second says this is treated as a charge on the contacted enemy.

I'd say then that the fraggies go in and fight - the eigth bullet seems to insist - the ninth bullet seems to speak more about the effect on the enemy than on the fraggies.

It could do with a bit of clarification from the authors I think

[rogerg]

Now I've seen the rule quote I am agreed about the contact. It is treated as a charge after the fresh enemy are contacted. This would seem to indicate that there is no problem with the fragged troops making contact.

[grahambriggs]

Oh, and the FAQ covers this specific situation - the fraggies do make contact.

[hazelbark]

Oh, and the FAQ covers this specific situation - the fraggies do make contact.

YEs have to get in the habit of consulting the FAQ more often.