Protecting flanks and the 1 MU bit

gozerius · Post by **gozerius** » Fri Feb 27, 2009 8:47 pm

There was a practice during the late medieval, early renaissance for the Germans and Swiss to deploy a "Forlorn Hope". Essentially, a throwaway BG of troops made up of volunteers and/or soldiers subject to disciplinary measures, they were sent in ahead of the main pike phalanx to disrupt the enemy line. Survivors would then rejoin the main phalanx. It fell out of use after a while when the soldiers realized just how forlorn their odds of success really were.

lawrenceg · Post by **lawrenceg** » Fri Feb 27, 2009 10:36 pm

hazelbark wrote:
pbrandon wrote:Taking part in a battle at all is moderately suicidal.
"A zulu can run, run 40 miles and then fight a battle!"

"Well that's daft now isn't it. Who would run to fight a battle!"

A Zulu warrior, obviously.

philqw78 · Post by **philqw78** » Fri Feb 27, 2009 10:38 pm

So troops have never been sent into a battle the commander knew he couldn't win to salvage a situation where he knew he COULD win?

I think we must read different history books.

We may well.

I didn't say life has never been lost needlessly, nor thrown away for 'The greater good', just that most people are averse to doing it. (Though some do it with relish.)

Therefore attrition points are the same for Mob and Knights.

DaiSho · Post by **DaiSho** » Fri Feb 27, 2009 10:49 pm

philqw78 wrote:
So troops have never been sent into a battle the commander knew he couldn't win to salvage a situation where he knew he COULD win?

I think we must read different history books.
We may well.

I didn't say life has never been lost needlessly, nor thrown away for 'The greater good', just that most people are averse to doing it. (Though some do it with relish.)

Therefore attrition points are the same for Mob and Knights.

Ahh, you were talking about the attrition points, not the practice of using LH to save the flank of their friends. My apologies.

Ian

philqw78 · Post by **philqw78** » Fri Feb 27, 2009 10:55 pm

you were talking about the attrition points

I was talking about both, but the probability that the lights don't want to be there means: to make people play them more realistically they are worth the same Attrition Points though a lot less Army Points.

Otherwise LF would be used to soak up enemy charges, whilst those with less skirmishers sat and waited for the enemy to hit them in their most vulnerable point with their worst nightmare. In this game skirmishers are not a throw away sacrifice and did not normally/do not normally stand and fight.

MkV · Post by **MkV** » Sat Feb 28, 2009 11:08 am

I think the equal attrition points for all units is one of the (many) finer points in this game. There are no "Throw Away" units.

petedalby · Post by **petedalby** » Sat Feb 28, 2009 12:17 pm

It's great to see a discussion string with everyone violently agreeing!

Pete

madcam2us · Post by **madcam2us** » Sat Feb 28, 2009 2:57 pm

No its not!

Madcam

kal5056 · Post by **kal5056** » Sat Feb 28, 2009 4:59 pm

Yes it is!!!
Gino
SMAC

fatismo · Post by **fatismo** » Mon Mar 02, 2009 12:46 am

MkV wrote:I think the equal attrition points for all units is one of the (many) finer points in this game. There are no "Throw Away" units.

They might have equal attrition points but saving a unit of knights to fight later in the battle at the cost of a LH could turn the battle. Kn cost about 96 pts, LH as little as 28pts, and you might be able to stop them routing with a commander.

Lycanthropic · Post by **Lycanthropic** » Mon Mar 02, 2009 6:23 am

rally knights? what game are you playing? knights win every fight, always, they never lose...ever.

hammy · Post by **hammy** » Mon Mar 02, 2009 10:05 am

Lycanthropic wrote:rally knights? what game are you playing? knights win every fight, always, they never lose...ever.

I think the comment meant that if you can save a BG of knights from a nasty flank charge at the cost of one of your LH BGs then that may indeed be a win for you. Much like the LH BG that hit my lancers in the rear, immediately broke (well impact and melee) but still did a useful job in that it took my lancers out of the game for several turns while the prusued, stopped, turned round and then moved back.

shall · Post by **shall** » Mon Mar 02, 2009 12:43 pm

A good use of brave LH if they can pull it off.

I believe the Byzantines often called their LH "flanks protectors" with exactly this in mind. Tough job sometimes..

Si

philqw78 · Post by **philqw78** » Mon Mar 02, 2009 1:22 pm

It seems, by your army lists, and complaints against such lists, Si, that they called their cavalry flankers

shall · Post by **shall** » Mon Mar 02, 2009 2:18 pm

I stand corrected Phil

Still I guess they had the same unpleasant job at times.

Si

philqw78 · Post by **philqw78** » Mon Mar 02, 2009 2:21 pm

But didn't have to CMT to carry it out

shall · Post by **shall** » Tue Mar 03, 2009 2:44 pm

Lucky them!

Si