Opportunity Fire

[AlexDetrojan]

Will the developers consider in the future to add opportunity fire(like Pike & Shot)to FOG2? Or do you feel this will fundamentally change the dynamic of this game. I find it works quite well in P&S, and thought it might be interesting here. Thoughts?
Cheers
Alex

[TheGrayMouser]

Will the developers consider in the future to add opportunity fire(like Pike & Shot)to FOG2? Or do you feel this will fundamentally change the dynamic of this game. I find it works quite well in P&S, and thought it might be interesting here. Thoughts?
Cheers
Alex

The big difference is Ammo. And then tactics would change to using units to trigger op fire. Which doenst feel vey Ancient and medieval... I wouldnt be adverse to a missle unit that's charged getting a shot in right before impact, perhaps with a penalty... But even that could change the dymanics too much IMHO

[rbodleyscott]

Will the developers consider in the future to add opportunity fire(like Pike & Shot)to FOG2? Or do you feel this will fundamentally change the dynamic of this game. I find it works quite well in P&S, and thought it might be interesting here. Thoughts?
Cheers
Alex

It was removed deliberately during the development process because it is incompatible with an effective Undo command.

[AlexDetrojan]

Will the developers consider in the future to add opportunity fire(like Pike & Shot)to FOG2? Or do you feel this will fundamentally change the dynamic of this game. I find it works quite well in P&S, and thought it might be interesting here. Thoughts?
Cheers
Alex

It was removed deliberately during the development process because it is incompatible with an effective Undo command.

So Richard, I assume that is why there is no undo command in P&S then.
Cheers
Alex

[rbodleyscott]

Will the developers consider in the future to add opportunity fire(like Pike & Shot)to FOG2? Or do you feel this will fundamentally change the dynamic of this game. I find it works quite well in P&S, and thought it might be interesting here. Thoughts?
Cheers
Alex

It was removed deliberately during the development process because it is incompatible with an effective Undo command.

So Richard, I assume that is why there is no undo command in P&S then.
Cheers
Alex

It is why we can't usefully add one, yes.

[julianbarker]

I understand why the feature is missing - the reasons above, but it does mean that missile units moving into range against other missile units get a free shot. Several units can gang up against another who will not get to fire back whilst taking shots from two, three or more units leaving the target unit severely at a disadvantage when it gets to fire back in its turn. The moving unit(s) should be the ones at a disadvantage for moving and firing, when that disadvantage is often offset by the first fire advantage.

[MVP7]

Sometimes a well positioned unit can get the damage bonus from remaining stationary on the next salvo against unit that has just moved into range. There area some annoying situations like cavalry being able to advance into range without being shot at in the full damage range but in general reaction fire would be wasteful and probably not that effective.

There could be some kind of "Overwatch"-style command that would allow massed archers to use their attack as a reaction to movement or taking fire. It would also make sense if massed archers fired a single salvo before impact if enemy charges them from front. Especially the latter would be a pretty significant change to the massed archers balance though.

[TheGrayMouser]

Well, individual units are at a disadvantage individually due to the move and shoot penalty, but yes, they can gang up on one unit. That is more of a problem imho: the central radar directed fire of multiple batteries until target destroyed, move onto the next. . I doubt many would want this but I think a priority target shoot rule would be nice ( ie can’t shoot at fragged enemy 3 grids away when one is one grid away and going to charge you next turn! Or simply only allow any one enemy to only be shot at twice per turn max.

[MVP7]

Well, individual units are at a disadvantage individually due to the move and shoot penalty, but yes, they can gang up on one unit. That is more of a problem imho: the central radar directed fire of multiple batteries until target destroyed, move onto the next. . I doubt many would want this but I think a priority target shoot rule would be nice ( ie can’t shoot at fragged enemy 3 grids away when one is one grid away and going to charge you next turn! Or simply only allow any one enemy to only be shot at twice per turn max.

That would make ranged units virtually useless. The actual damage isn't that important and concentrating fire is the only way they can cause cohesion tests. Limiting the number of ranged attacks on one enemy wouldn't make sense realistically or for balance. The ranged cohesion drops area already capped so that you can't cause more than one during one turn anyway.

[rbodleyscott]

Well, individual units are at a disadvantage individually due to the move and shoot penalty, but yes, they can gang up on one unit. That is more of a problem imho: the central radar directed fire of multiple batteries until target destroyed, move onto the next. . I doubt many would want this but I think a priority target shoot rule would be nice ( ie can’t shoot at fragged enemy 3 grids away when one is one grid away and going to charge you next turn! Or simply only allow any one enemy to only be shot at twice per turn max.

That would make ranged units virtually useless. The actual damage isn't that important and concentrating fire is the only way they can cause cohesion tests. Limiting the number of ranged attacks on one enemy wouldn't make sense realistically or for balance. The ranged cohesion drops area already capped so that you can't cause more than one during one turn anyway.

It would certainly mean that the whole shooting system would need to be rebalanced. It is currently balanced on the assumption that concentrating fire is not restricted - other than that shooting at half-arc is 50% less effective, and turning to face counts as movement which also carries a 33% shooting penalty (compared with not moving).

Not having defined shooting priorities, though not particularly realistic, was a deliberate game design decision. Many players do not like what they consider arbitrary restrictions, however logical they may be once explained. Like it or not, if we want to remain in business we have to cater to those players as well as those who want realism at any cost.

(Pike and Shot did not restrict shooting priorities either, but there was a lot of criticism of their more restrictive charge target priority system, which seemed counter-intuitive to some players. Their logic had to be repeatedly explained on the boards. Hence we simplified the charge target priority system for FOG2, and would be disinclined to add new restrictions on other aspects of play).

[TheGrayMouser]

Well, individual units are at a disadvantage individually due to the move and shoot penalty, but yes, they can gang up on one unit. That is more of a problem imho: the central radar directed fire of multiple batteries until target destroyed, move onto the next. . I doubt many would want this but I think a priority target shoot rule would be nice ( ie can’t shoot at fragged enemy 3 grids away when one is one grid away and going to charge you next turn! Or simply only allow any one enemy to only be shot at twice per turn max.

That would make ranged units virtually useless. The actual damage isn't that important and concentrating fire is the only way they can cause cohesion tests. Limiting the number of ranged attacks on one enemy wouldn't make sense realistically or for balance. The ranged cohesion drops area already capped so that you can't cause more than one during one turn anyway.

It would certainly mean that the whole shooting system would need to be rebalanced. It is currently balanced on the assumption that concentrating fire is not restricted - other than that shooting at half-arc is 50% less effective, and turning to face counts as movement which also carries a 33% shooting penalty (compared with not moving).

Not having defined shooting priorities, though not particularly realistic, was a deliberate game design decision. Many players do not like what they consider arbitrary restrictions, however logical they may be once explained. Like it or not, if we want to remain in business we have to cater to those players as well as those who want realism at any cost.

(Pike and Shot did not restrict shooting priorities either, but there was a lot of criticism of their more restrictive charge target priority system, which seemed counter-intuitive to some players. Their logic had to be repeatedly explained on the boards. Hence we simplified the charge target priority system for FOG2, and would be disinclined to add new restrictions on other aspects of play).

So you are saying there is a chance?

All kidding aside, I’ll be more careful with posting whimsical rules changes ideas, the potential for angry fruitless and polarizing debates is ever present on the inter webs.