Unit Profiles for beginners: Offensive Spearman and Impact Foot

[Lebo44]

Hi,

I'm new to this forum and to this fantastic game. I love FoG2 so far. However I felt (and still feel) a little bit overwhelmed by such a vast selection of various units. There are 180 in core game and over 350 in latest version of TT Mod. It really confused me at beginning because there are not only hundreds of them with different capabilities but their strength is also influenced by a couple of modifiers during the game. Fortunately, by looking at Squad.txt files I was able to identify few main groups of them what helped me to grasp the basics of army composition. These groups are as follows:

• Offensive Spearman

• Impact Foot (Swordsmen)

• Sword + Light Spear (foot)

• Sword + Light Spear (mounted)

• Lancer + Swordsmen (these are only mounted, at least in Core)

• Bow + Swordsmen (only mounted as well)

• Javelin + Light Spear (mounted)

• Javelin + Light Spear (foot)

• Elephants (only two units in Core game)

According to my caclulations done on Squad.txt from core version of the game, units from these groups consituties 85% of all units available.

Then I started analysing these units vs each other in default battle conditions:

• Open Terrain

• same armour, same quality, same morale

• no general

In order to asses and simplify pros and cons unique to each group (so without influence of any modifiers which are situational during a battle).

Yes, I'm aware there is a great series of Beginners' Guides on Youtube where Michael Chung compares units capabilities pair by pair. However for my (total beginner) purposes I tried simplify it even further and just focus on most common groups of units. Maybe it will be of some help for people confused by number of variations of units and modifiers - hope so.

OFFENSIVE SPEARMEN



Combat (POA advantages):


Edit: Negative numbers mean the opponent has a POA advantage

Strengths:

• Offensive Spearmen look very strong in melee against any type of units except Pikes and able to stop elephants.

• Good at stopping Lancer (impact) charges.

Weaknesses:

• Not so good (if not weak) at Impact. They have moderate advantage only against light spear mounted units.

• Slow and hard to maneuver (many Offensive Spearmen are also undrilled). Only 10 Action Points don't allow to move and turn in most cases what probably make them vulnerable at flanks.

• Usually of heavy type (medium foot spearmen are very rare) makes them severely disadvantaged in rough terrain.

• Severely disadvantaged against Pikes

Best Offensive Spearmen variations (in terms of armour and quality):


Edit: Triarii unit size is only 240 what make them disadvantaged against full strength units in melee combat.

IMPACT FOOT



Combat (POA advantages):


Edit: Negative numbers mean the opponent has a POA advantage

Strengths:

• As the name suggests very strong in Impact against any type of units except Elephants. But they need to avoid attacking Lancers.

• Can stop full strength Pikes and Lancers (when defending) during Impact

• They have significant advantage against Light Spear units in both Impact and Melee

Weaknesses:

• During Melee against other swordsmen it all depends on units and opponent's troop quality and armour

• Disadvantaged against Elephants, Pikes and Offensive Spearman in Melee

• Slow and hard to maneuver, often undrilled (Warbands). Only 10 Action Points don't allow to move and turn in most cases what probably make them vulnerable at flanks.

• Most of the best armoured and experienced variations are of Heavy type what makes them severely disadvantaged in rough terrain.

Some thoughts on possible strategy:
Option 1) Select units of higher quality as a main force to charge and melee. Lower quality units tring to flank or attack weaker, disordered opponents.
Option 2) Try to exploit Impact strength of Impact Foot. First use missile units, artillery or threaten enemy flank with cavalry to get more negative Cohesion Test modifiers for the enemy then charge him. If his cohesion drops after initial attack the melee advantage should be secured.


Best Impact Foot variations (in terms of armour and quality):

[Nijis]

This is quite helpful. I've played a fair number of games by now, but I've rarely stopped to consider the units one by one.

[sIg3b]

I very much like analytical articles like this one.

Small mistake in the tables: There is probably no Javelin & Light Spear Foot (Moumted).

[nyczar]

Please share the rest of your tables. I like how you are showing the synthesized Net POA relationship as a table.

[Lebo44]

I very much like analytical articles like this one.

Small mistake in the tables: There is probably no Javelin & Light Spear Foot (Moumted).

Good spot! corrected

[Lebo44]

Please share the rest of your tables. I like how you are showing the synthesized Net POA relationship as a table.

Thanks, I will

[rbodleyscott]

You really need to consider Pikes in your "enemy" matchups. There may be less pike units in the squads file, but that is because they all looked basically the same. They are very common in the Hellenistic period.

In particular they are a very nasty foe for Offensive Spearmen because they are advantaged against them in both Impact and Melee.

[MVP7]

I wish something like this was also available in-game.

Couple things though: Heavy and medium does not refer to the armour level of the unit but organization and capabilities (and together with terrain those capabilities are often even more important factor than the weapon types). Also the Greek unit is called Armoured Veteran Hoplites, not armed

[Lebo44]

Thanks for pointing out mistakes, corrections in progress. Added Impact Foot.

[sIg3b]

You really need to consider Pikes in your "enemy" matchups. There may be less pike units in the squads file, but that is because they all looked basically the same. They are very common in the Hellenistic period.

In particular they are a very nasty foe for Offensive Spearmen because they are advantaged against them in both Impact and Melee.

Pikes are a nasty lot.

Theoretically, the Romans should have had it difficult with Pike armies, let alone Pike&Horse or Pike&Elephant. I believe their secret was the Roman Wave strategy: Sending in army after army, until they got lucky.

[Ludendorf]

Thanks a lot for making this. It's really interesting to see the different match ups paired up like this.

Impact foot, surprisingly, can make a dicey but, in a pinch, effective counter to pike lines if massed up. Across the breadth of the line, the pikes will have the advantage. However, impact foot of equivalent quality tend to be slightly cheaper than their pike counterparts, offering the chance to outflank the pike line and end the battle that way. The impact foot's main advantage however is that if the impact foot can score a single disruption along the length of the line, and then break part of the pike line quickly as a result, they may win their part of the battle and turn before the pikes can finish the rest of the impact foot off. One or two breaks in the pike line followed up by flank attacks upon the rest can result in a surprise victory for the impact against the pikes.

Superior warbands are particularly good at executing this strategy thanks to their superior depth; once the pikes lose their 4 rows deep status, the superior warbands may actually start to grind them down. That said, remember that superior warbands cost about as much as a unit of pikes (3 points more, in fact), so they lose their cost-effectiveness.

Essentially, you want to avoid pikes or, if possible, tie them down with ZOC from a unit of cheap lancers or a unit on rough ground while the rest of the enemy army is finished off. The pikes can then be surrounded and killed. If this isn't possible though and you have to take the pikes on head on, impact foot are probably your single best chance of winning that engagement. (I can't think of any unit type that would have a better chance from the front, except, of course, another pike phalanx.)

[Lebo44]

Impact foot, surprisingly, can make a dicey but, in a pinch, effective counter to pike lines if massed up. Across the breadth of the line, the pikes will have the advantage. However, impact foot of equivalent quality tend to be slightly cheaper than their pike counterparts, offering the chance to outflank the pike line and end the battle that way. The impact foot's main advantage however is that if the impact foot can score a single disruption along the length of the line, and then break part of the pike line quickly as a result, they may win their part of the battle and turn before the pikes can finish the rest of the impact foot off. One or two breaks in the pike line followed up by flank attacks upon the rest can result in a surprise victory for the impact against the pikes.

Superior warbands are particularly good at executing this strategy thanks to their superior depth; once the pikes lose their 4 rows deep status, the superior warbands may actually start to grind them down. That said, remember that superior warbands cost about as much as a unit of pikes (3 points more, in fact), so they lose their cost-effectiveness.

Essentially, you want to avoid pikes or, if possible, tie them down with ZOC from a unit of cheap lancers or a unit on rough ground while the rest of the enemy army is finished off. The pikes can then be surrounded and killed. If this isn't possible though and you have to take the pikes on head on, impact foot are probably your single best chance of winning that engagement. (I can't think of any unit type that would have a better chance from the front, except, of course, another pike phalanx.)

Great! I really hoped that my post would invite others to make thought provoking comments on strategy like this.

[sIg3b]

There is a zero loss method to kill Pikes, but it´s not always feasible:

1. Threaten them from opposite directions to make them form square.
2. Fire at them until they break.

A Horse&Missile Army could, in principle, be very effective against Pikes.

[Barrold713]

You really need to consider Pikes in your "enemy" matchups. There may be less pike units in the squads file, but that is because they all looked basically the same. They are very common in the Hellenistic period.

In particular they are a very nasty foe for Offensive Spearmen because they are advantaged against them in both Impact and Melee.

Pikes are a nasty lot.

Theoretically, the Romans should have had it difficult with Pike armies, let alone Pike&Horse or Pike&Elephant. I believe their secret was the Roman Wave strategy: Sending in army after army, until they got lucky.

I have had to face several pike armies in the digital league this season with a Roman list. When charged, the units seem to give a bit more than they get and I have seen pike phalanxes disrupt and fall back after a charge. They also manage to hold the line well and provide an opportunity to get the nice variety of medium foot units to hit a flank...or the very handy elephant that makes a general look way better than natural skills would otherwise be displayed.

BDH

[Lebo44]

It is worth mentioning that despite Warbands are Impact Foot Swordsmen they seem to be weaker than for example Legionaires due to their unit type.

Compared to Heavy or Mixed Type Impact Foot Warriors (and Medium Foot) do not get +1 Cohesion Test multiplier after loosing combat. Additionally they get -1 Cohesion Test multiplier if they lose combat against non-impact Heavy/Mixed troops like Pikes or Spearman or Mounted Units.

It means that Warriors or Medium Impact Foot have probability of cohesion drop (after lost combat) 50% or more higher than Heavy Impact Foot. So in their case it would be good to secure even slight POA advantage against an enemy: hill advantage, better armour/quality, general or numbers.

[rbodleyscott]

Irregular Heavy Foot warbands are also excluded from the +1 cohesion test modifier for heavy foot. This isn't in the manual as it was a change introduced in the v1.0.2 patch - see Patch Notes.

[Lebo44]

Irregular Heavy Foot warbands are also excluded from the +1 cohesion test modifier for heavy foot. This isn't in the manual as it was a change introduced in the v1.0.2 patch - see Patch Notes.

By Irregular you mean Undrilled, right?

[rbodleyscott]

Irregular Heavy Foot warbands are also excluded from the +1 cohesion test modifier for heavy foot. This isn't in the manual as it was a change introduced in the v1.0.2 patch - see Patch Notes.

By Irregular you mean Undrilled, right?

Yes, sorry.

[Lebo44]

Can somebody explain this?

There are Hastati/Principes (Impact/Sword) in melee against two Offensive Spearmen. According to manual Hastati should have only +50 POA from Swordsmen but they have +100. I checked other similar cases in this battle and the tooltip shows value of +50.

The only explanation could be Distrupted cohesion of the Spearmen but this should be reflected in Morale/Disorder Modifier, not POA. What am I missing?

[TheGrayMouser]

Well, you could refer to the POA chart in the manual But , swords count 100 poa versus non steady off spear, def spear and pike ( the manual does omit pike). Being disrupted is deemed non steady.