Churchill AVRE&Crocodile

[kondi754]

My suggestions for Hobart's Funnies new statistics.
Terminator, thanks a lot for your help ...

If anyone likes it, I've attached the modified csv file below
I used the unit.csv file from Terminator's Forgotten Units Mod (I hope its creator doesn't mind it)
Just run Terminator's Mod, then Burma Road DLC and you can play with enginnering and assault tanks...
I strongly recommended to modify Specs file, too. (main game folder -> oob ww2 -> content -> data)
Move Hobart Funnies Spec since March 1944 (default is May 1944 but you can activate this specialization only before Rangoon last scn) and you can use modified Churchills while crossing Irrawady (Meikhtila scn) as well as during the raid on Rangoon.

Not working correctly Hobart Funnies bothered me for a long time, so I decided to take care of himself in the end.
It's not a big deal, but I'm just taking my first steps...

[GabeKnight]

Kondi, I didn't check this theory myself, but you said:

I used the unit.csv file from Terminator's Forgotten Units Mod (I hope its creator doesn't mind it)

If you've taken the units.csv from Terminator's mod and just changed the Churchill values, you'll have to make sure there's no problem with all the remaining new units Terminator's added. There could be a conflict with missing data if used outside his mod

BTW, I've "fixed" the Churchill's in my mod already.

[kondi754]

Kondi, I didn't check this theory myself, but you said:

I used the unit.csv file from Terminator's Forgotten Units Mod (I hope its creator doesn't mind it)

If you've taken the units.csv from Terminator's mod and just changed the Churchill values, you'll have to make sure there's no problem with all the remaining new units Terminator's added. There could be a conflict with missing data if used outside his mod

BTW, I've "fixed" the Churchill's in my mod already.

I've played Burma Road with modified Churchills through Terminators Mod and everything was ok.
I've also tried other DLC (mainly Blitzkrieg and Panzerkrieg) and all units were in their places.

Players may use your Mod (just in case..)

[kondi754]

@Gabe
BTW, what coefficients have you established for both tanks? Have you accepted mine?

[GabeKnight]

I've played Burma Road with modified Churchills through Terminators Mod and everything was ok.

That's what I meant: if you use your units.csv together with Terminator's mod, everything should work just fine.

I've misunderstood your statement from the other thread, sorry:

I tried to modify units.csv file in the game directory

I was under the impression you swapped the units.csv file within your main game installation - because that may not work well.

[GabeKnight]

@Gabe
BTW, what coefficients have you established for both tanks? Have you accepted mine?

I've used these, but honestly haven't playtested them yet in the campaign setting. Right now I'm beginning the "Chindits" mission in Burma Road.

Churchill_AVRE (290mm mortar): similar to the Karl-Gerät's attack stats basically, so I'm keeping the low inf. and veh. attack values. Change: shock=10, Assault=7. And Wikipedia says it was also able to remove mines, so I've added the "minesweeper" trait. I'm also giving this unit a range=2 setting instead of a "mortar barage" switch, despite the quite low firing range IRL. So it's rather an artillery unit now. But without the range increase, the AVRE would basically be demoted to an expensive heavily armoured mechanised engineer unit.

Churchill_Crocodile: Flamethrower and main gun, so I'm keeping the other stats and changing to the "usual" other flamethrower tank's values of Shock=20, Assault=5

Some were Horsts suggestions here and here and some from another thread here.
Yours seem a bit low for such expensive units TBH. And I've never seen a "15" assault before.

[kondi754]

Yours seem a bit low for such expensive units TBH. And I've never seen a "15" assault before.

Mine stats too low?
I think it will be too high.

This stats should be so high because there haven't been such tanks so far.
Churchill Crocodile was certainly much better than Mathilda Frog (20 shock, 5 assault), so 25 shock and 10 assault is right in my opinion.
Churchill AVRE helped British army to get out of the beaches in Normandy into the operational space, it was a very effective vehicle.

[GabeKnight]

Mine stats too low?
I think it will be too high.

This stats should be so high because there haven't been such tanks so far.
Churchill Crocodile was certainly much better than Mathilda Frog (20 shock, 5 assault), so 25 shock and 10 assault is right in my opinion.
Churchill AVRE helped British army to get out of the beaches in Normandy into the operational space, it was a very effective vehicle.

Right, I was a bit confused, it seems, because of the "15" assault (as the shock value ranges from 1-100 and the assault usually from 1-10) which made no sense to me. Isn't 10 the highest possible entrenchment level...?
So your stats are actually even deadlier than my more "conservative" estimations. How did it play?

[kondi754]

Mine stats too low?
I think it will be too high.

This stats should be so high because there haven't been such tanks so far.
Churchill Crocodile was certainly much better than Mathilda Frog (20 shock, 5 assault), so 25 shock and 10 assault is right in my opinion.
Churchill AVRE helped British army to get out of the beaches in Normandy into the operational space, it was a very effective vehicle.

Right, I was a bit confused, it seems, because of the "15" assault (as the shock value ranges from 1-100 and the assault usually from 1-10) which made no sense to me. Isn't 10 the highest possible entrenchment level...?
So your stats are actually even deadlier than my more "conservative" estimations. How did it play?

You're right, I have to lower the assault factors.
I apologize to everyone who downloaded this file.
I'll fix it soon.

[kondi754]

The final statistics below.
I have also changed units.csv file.

Crocodile (25 shock, 5 assault)> Wasp, Frog, Satan, Zippo (all: 20 shock, 5 assault)
AVRE (20 shock, 7 assault) = Sherman with 105mm howitzer

[GabeKnight]

Crocodile (25 shock, 5 assault)> Wasp, Frog, Satan, Zippo (all: 20 shock, 5 assault)
AVRE (20 shock, 7 assault) = Sherman with 105mm howitzer

Kondi, I hope you don't mind, but I've adapted your stats into my mod. They look good. I didn't want to add too much shock myself, but if you're okay with it, so am I. Thanks.
But I'm still keeping the 2-hex range and minesweeper ability. The heavy mortar animation kinda looks good.

[kondi754]

Gabe, I agree with you about minesweeping but range +2 it's too much in my opinion.
I have to think about it... maybe it would be good for game

[kondi754]

@Gabe,All
Devs are preparing another large patch for OOB with the release of a new DLC. There will be finally corrected Hobart Funnies stats.
Unfortunately, Artistocrats were not as generous as me ...
Churchill Crocodile -> shock 20 assault 2 (don't understand this second factor, if American tanks with flamethrower have 5)
Churchill Avre -> shock 10 assault 6 (this second factor is probably the highest when it comes to self-propelled artillery); no minesweeping trait and range +1 only.

EDIT.FALSE INFO DELETED

[terminator]

@Gabe,All
Devs are preparing another large patch for OOB with the release of a new DLC. There will be finally corrected Hobart Funnies stats.
Unfortunately, Artistocrats were not as generous as me ...
Churchill Crocodile -> shock 20 assault 2 (don't understand this second factor, if American tanks with flamethrower have 5)
Churchill Avre -> shock 10 assault 6 (this second factor is probably the highest when it comes to self-propelled artillery); no minesweeping trait and range +1 only.

When it comes to British tanks with flamethrowers, Mathilda Frog has been removed. Only Wasp Carrier and Crocodile stay at the list.

The Frog called Matilda is always in the Beta :

MatildaFrog.JPG (14.47 KiB) Viewed 4289 times

[kondi754]

Ok, you're right.
I've searched between British units but this vehicle is placed in Australian section.

[terminator]

There was more scared than hurt.

frog.jpg (15.93 KiB) Viewed 4285 times

[GabeKnight]

Gabe, I agree with you about minesweeping but range +2 it's too much in my opinion.
I have to think about it... maybe it would be good for game

Thanks for the info about the patch, Kondi.

My settings with the 2-range were indeed way too much and I was already thinking about how to balance this out. Probably with more RP or CP cost, or less movement points or changing it to the artillery-class (something like the Karl-Gerät). On the other hand, it was just for the last scenario(s(?)) of Burma Road after all. I still like the cool mortar animation, and it looks better with larger distances, so I really wanted to keep the range...

But it seems it's out of my hands now...

[terminator]

Thanks for the info about the patch, Kondi.

@GabeKnight : Did you sign for the beta test ?

[GabeKnight]

@GabeKnight : Did you sign for the beta test ?

I did, but wasn't picked. Probably because I'm complaining too much

On the other hand I'm quite new to this forum... and I couldn't help with any of the historic events or units discussions going on, anyways...

[terminator]

@GabeKnight : Did you sign for the beta test ?

I did, but wasn't picked. Probably because I'm complaining too much

On the other hand I'm quite new to this forum... and I couldn't help with any of the historic events or units discussions going on, anyways...

Maybe in the second tour if there is the second tour, otherwise certainly the next time.