Things we learned the hard way.

[Yogi the Great]

How about a thread for us to post things we learned the hard way?

1) Taking the Persians in a multiplayer battle will probably lead to a loss.

2) English chariots are very difficult to deal with if you haven't seen them before with normal tactics and will require a new game plan.

3) Don't expect horses to be faster than men on foot and don't expect that units will be able to make turns and/or move logically.

4) Don't expect game mechanics and or units abilities to be realistic. It's a game not reality after all.

5) Fighting in forest is very difficult and you can be greatly surprised what some units are able to do in them.

6) Random battle results can do you in. Yes if it wasn't for bad luck, I would have no luck at all.

7) It is unbelievable how long some enemy units can hold out under extreme odds.

Anyway thread is for fun. The game is fun and very addicting but I have found the hard way that play will not always turn out like you think.

[Yogi the Great]

One more I forgot to post,

When you look at posted challenges you can expect a better than 50% chance that the game will not be balanced. Gee I wonder who will have the advantage of side?

[Ludendorf]

1: Sending your skirmishers out against the AI unsupported is a great way to lure half their army away. Sending your skirmishers out against a human player unsupported is a great way to kill all your skirmishers.

2: If confident your cavalry will refrain from chasing routers along the entire front of the enemy battle line because 'my men will never be that stupid', think again.

3: If any of your orders are based around the idea that 'my men will never be that stupid', think again.

4: Attacking a weaker enemy with central reserves is like holding up a sign saying 'I want to be flanked'. It'll certainly happen soon enough once your soldiers start pushing through, presenting their juicy ribs to that unit of irregulars you snorted at in the process.

5: Fate is a cruel mistress, and the random number generator an even crueller one.

6: Your elephants are ticking morale bombs that will go off in the middle of your line at the worst possible moment. Prepare for this.

7: Numbers DO matter in war. Or to be more precise, frontage does.

8: Forests help make your flanks more difficult to access. They do not make you immune to flank attacks. The AI may be allergic to them. Cunning humans aren't.

9: If you're counting on the enemy driving your infantry back so you can flank them, remember your men have to hold out that long first.

10: Thou shalt not try to flank an enemy in a town.

EDIT: And one more for luck...

11: Nothing is ever decided until it is decided.

[Yogi the Great]

Rate and number of successful rallies is not equal and even when you think you are doing well the enemy may rally many and come back to beat you.

[rbodleyscott]

Rate and number of successful rallies is not equal.

It may not seems so, and obviously random chance has an effect on individual games, but both sides use exactly the same algorithms and AI units get no favours in regard to rallying or anything else.

[mst007]

Great thread!

I`ll add

1) "I thought I understood Zones of control, I did NOT understand Zones of control"
2) Firing up a PBEM turn before work is not always a great idea, it can make you late for work

[Barrold713]

Never pick an army to play based on thinking they have a cool name.

[Ludendorf]

12: NEVER underestimate the impact foot! They are to ordered battle plans what an extremely hungry cat is to fish ravioli.
13: Bruttians/Lucanians vs Samnites swiftly degenerates into an all-out, ugly and practically unpredictable brawl. This is mostly due to the aforementioned impact foot.

[ggarynorman]

Enemy pike always rally from routed to full capability when your back is turned

[Ludendorf]

14: Make sure you know what is attached to that command before you move an entire command.

[rbodleyscott]

14: Make sure you know what is attached to that command before you move an entire command.

15: Make sure you know what is attached to what command before ending Deployment.

[Ludendorf]

16: Some units are so tough that a flank attack won't do them in. They'll absorb it, rally, and proceed to beat the living daylights out of both flanking units until they run and cry for mummy. If you are going to try to flank and destroy a powerful unit, make sure you bring enough firepower for the job. Otherwise, you'll just lose two units, not one.
17: Waiting for a unit to push through your line so you can flank it depends on your holding unit's ability to not break until that happens.
18: Be careful with your facing when trying to attack a unit pushing through your lines. It may push onwards past your flankers and into safety again.
19: Don't forget your objectives during 'Remove the Head'.

[MikeC_81]

Rate and number of successful rallies is not equal.

It may not seems so, and obviously random chance has an effect on individual games, but both sides use exactly the same algorithms and AI units get no favours in regard to rallying or anything else.

Can you explain the algorithm for these tests? I understand that generals always test for their unit but what about the rest of the army? Units seem to rally en masse on the same turn. Is there a check at the beginning of each turn that sees non-general units get to test army wide? In the past 5 games I have witnessed some staggering reversals. Like 4 or 5 units rally on the same turn or back to back. I am in the middle of a game where 4 units rallied, including one in combat after a flank for a massive 25 point swing.

Trying to understand if my opponents are doing something I am not? Maybe I am just on the wrong end of a super bad run these past few games.

16: Some units are so tough that a flank attack won't do them in. They'll absorb it, rally, and proceed to beat the living daylights out of both flanking units until they run and cry for mummy. If you are going to try to flank and destroy a powerful unit, make sure you bring enough firepower for the job. Otherwise, you'll just lose two units, not one.

I am kind of on the fence with this one. One one hand, since you can't rally immediately after a dropping a cohesion level so you get to beat up on them for a bit first so its pretty likely they will continue to drop cohesion levels from subsequent melee phases so you are committing a unit which might be better used elsewhere. On the other hand I have seen some pretty absurd and game changing things happen.

I guess this applies for units with generals in superior quality or better units especially heavy foot, they get to test every turn to recover morale though I don't think they get to test the first turn they get disrupted. You get 2 combat phases to beat them up a bit but if they get lucky and don't crack further, its a piece of cake for them to rally even at a -1 modifier and better than a coin flip at -2.

[rbodleyscott]

Can you explain the algorithm for these tests?

Testing to rally occurs at the start of the player's turn.

Units cannot test to rally if they dropped morale in the previous pair of turns (player and enemy).

Non-routing units without a general have a 40% chance of taking a Cohesion Test to rally each subsequent turn.

Routing units without a general have a 20% chance of taking a Cohesion Test to rally each subsequent turn. However, they cannot test if they are still being pursued or if they suffered enough shooting in the previous turn that would normally have triggered a cohesion test.

Units with a general will always test unless the above exceptions apply.

If the Cohesion Test is passed the unit rallies one Cohesion step.

Units seem to rally en masse on the same turn.

The nature of randommness is that scores tend to clump. If they were evenly spread they would not be random.

[ahuyton]

20. When you get a bad combat result or your units stubbornly refuse to rally, you put this down to 'bad luck'. When this happens in reverse, it seems only fair.
21. Medium foot charging heavy foot in the open, up a hill, only ends in tears.

[Benedict151]

A good thread, both informative and entertaining

[jomni]

22. Unexpectedly Finding out a body of water is more than a harmless stream is not good. Don’t assume just based on graphics. Check the tooltip.

[Spectre195]

23. Dont put cavalry sandwiched between an impassable stream and your line. You will not be able to work them around the flank and will end up in a traffic jam.

[Ludendorf]

24. In relation to point 16, flanking with a disrupted unit while free enemy cav are sniffing around nearby is a very, very risky decision. Chances are the flank won't do the full job due to the reduced impact and your flanking unit will itself be flanked.

[Lysimachos]

25. Be aware that light foot in woods are the only units not suffering disruption and when armed with light spears may become a nightmare for your medium and heavy troops!