old Potzblitz thread (discontinued)

[Zombo]

Stronger right wing when going Schlieffen: added one extra infantry at hex coordinates: 90,24

The left wing should be correspondingly weakened. I don't have the set up in mind, but removing a garrison or converting an inf into a Gar comes to mind.

Attaque a outrance will be playable by CP before their attack in France stalls.

wait... are you saying that Attaque à Outrance is played by... Germany?

Send Goeben/Breslau to reinforce SouthEastAsia Squadron

there could also be an option to regroup the Kriegsmarine ( costly of course) and start with the Goeben and maybe even von Spee's squadron in Kiel

and Austria will gain some free subs by event.

I wouldn't do that. Austria started the war with 9 subs, so receive a sub unit at start is already extremely generous. They didn't build any more but received a few from Germany when Italy entered the war. Not enough to justify a second sub at all
(so, no weaker italians in Serbia? )

Not sure what you mean. Do you want a second Bruchmuller event besides the one already present? If so at which point in the game?

Silly me. There is a Bruchmuller event already

[Robotron]

wait... are you saying that Attaque à Outrance is played by... Germany?

Yep, it's played as a bad event by CP vs Entente.

I wouldn't do that. Austria started the war with 9 subs, so receive a sub unit at start is already extremely generous. They didn't build any more but received a few from Germany when Italy entered the war. Not enough to justify a second sub at all

Austria will start with no subs and will receive up to two subs via choice event once Italy has joined Entente . Maybe reduce Italy's starting transport capability to 0 as well?

[TripleCP]

Stronger right wing when going Schlieffen: added one extra infantry at hex coordinates: 90,24. Schlieffen himself won't be included though since by that time he was a strategist/planner not an actual field commander and quite old.

FYI, Schlieffen died on 4 January 1913 and had been retired since 1906. Allegedly, his last words were "Keep the right wing strong."

[Robotron]

Stronger right wing when going Schlieffen: added one extra infantry at hex coordinates: 90,24. Schlieffen himself won't be included though since by that time he was a strategist/planner not an actual field commander and quite old.

FYI, Schlieffen died on 4 January 1913 and had been retired since 1906. Allegedly, his last words were "Keep the right wing strong."

Thanks, I was fully aware of that fact and even if he had been still alive and had not left active service by that time, he would most likely not have been given a field command because of his age. Regarding the last words: according to German historian Sebastian Haffner, a protocol taken during a meeting shortly before the Battle of the Marne (when Colonel Hentsch was visiting the army commanders) mentions German General Karl von Bulow recalling that Schlieffen's actual last words were "I fear our commanders' lack of operational experience will lead to a mad dash for the Pour Le Merite."

[TripleCP]

Haha. Based on some of the screenshots I've seen, I think his actual last words were, "Build more Zeppelins."

[Robotron]

Haha. Based on some of the screenshots I've seen, I think his actual last words were, "Build more Zeppelins."

LOL, made my day!
Good thing that zeppelin spam is nonexistent in my mod.

[nehi]

Haha. Based on some of the screenshots I've seen, I think his actual last words were, "Build more Zeppelins."

LOL, made my day!
Good thing that zeppelin spam is nonexistent in my mod.

im still wondering what are zombo and his friend doing without aircrafts in multiplayer, playing soccer i guess

(actually waiting for technology boost, it has to be great fun to play as cp, no chance for blitz and no chance later cause of ententes overproduction)

[Robotron]

im still wondering what are zombo and his friend doing without aircrafts in multiplayer, playing soccer i guess
(actually waiting for technology boost, it has to be great fun to play as cp, no chance for blitz and no chance later cause of ententes overproduction)

@nehi: Please refrain from judging this mod if you have not tried it in multiplayer yourself. Also please don't compare it to the vanilla game.

If you enjoy your "play 15-30 turns then win-or-quit" style, then fine but then stick to the vanilla game with overpowered Blitzkrieg-Stuka-ZepArmadas and whatnot and boast around with your expertise elsewhere, but spare this thread from your smug know-it-all-attitude. My deep respect goes to people like the user "operating" who had the nerves to play the totally unbalanced vanilla game for 60 turns as CP and post epic an AAR on Matrix-Forums. It's sad to see he seemingly left the community for good after much frustration with the unbalanced vanilla game and a harddrive-crash to boot for his efforts. THIS in my opinion is more true to the spirit of wargaming than to quit as soon as one player has lost the chance to rush the enemy.

I've spent hundreds of hours of my spare time to get this game to another level for nothing but the approval of a few die-hard fans and maybe I've failed in your eyes but the last thing I want in this thread is some wise-guy telling people they're wasting their time. Thank you very much!

[nehi]

im still wondering what are zombo and his friend doing without aircrafts in multiplayer, playing soccer i guess
(actually waiting for technology boost, it has to be great fun to play as cp, no chance for blitz and no chance later cause of ententes overproduction)

@nehi: Please refrain from judging this mod if you have not tried it in multiplayer yourself. Also please don't compare it to the vanilla game.

If you enjoy your "play 15-30 turns then win-or-quit" style, then fine but then stick to the vanilla game with overpowered Blitzkrieg-Stuka-ZepArmadas and whatnot and boast around with your expertise elsewhere, but spare this thread from your smug know-it-all-attitude. My deep respect goes to people like the user "operating" who had the nerves to play the totally unbalanced vanilla game for 60 turns as CP and post epic an AAR on Matrix-Forums. It's sad to see he seemingly left the community for good after much frustration with the unbalanced vanilla game and a harddrive-crash to boot for his efforts. THIS in my opinion is more true to the spirit of wargaming than to quit as soon as one player has lost the chance to rush the enemy.

I've spent hundreds of hours of my spare time to get this game to another level for nothing but the approval of a few die-hard fans and maybe I've failed in your eyes but the last thing I want in this thread is some wise-guy telling people they're wasting their time. Thank you very much!

almost any of your statement is wrong, especially that one about me and quiting, so far i remember i quit once when i started with serbs, they had just 40 manpower and -12 production (joined some crazy moded game)

but i understand when someone ask me if he can leave, when we both know, its technically over

mp is quite well balanced in vanilla, as u can win it even as cp, know-it-all-attitude comes from i won many games for both sides in long uninterrupted consecutive row, i wanted to make aars, but there are too many leavers and operating rejected to participate

u r right, i havent played your mod in mp, but like 10 games vs ai and zombos reports is enough to imagine how it works
(trenched infantry is almost unbreakable, humans wont let u to destroy it, u need great favor of dices to make it in one turn, there is no other way than boost tech to make some decisive advance, so again stuka aircraft, just few years/months later)

I only play multiplayer

game ended in end 1916 with the Allies smashing through the Western front and unstoppable. Too much artillery, ammo, high tech planes, French infantry on steroids due to super high infantry tech

There is also one play-optimization that helps the Allies but is quite unrealistic: the division of tech research. French focus on infantry and air (they provide the majority of land troops) and neglect arty (don't build any) , British focus on Arty and Tanks and neglect air (the French build the air force). So they end up with very large technological disparities in every field. Which is a little strange.

sounds very similar to vanilla mp game, once cp lose initiativity, only way to balance it, is to make both alliances even in production, which is not historical

vanilla is the closest game to your mod, so why not to compare them? your mod is great vs ai, but mp is really different kind of game

i never said u failed, because u stated u aim at ai games, but im saying, improvements vs ai wont make better mp game, which (at least for me) is another story

when there is no chance to win fast as cp, how they should achieve it? if they have less production?

[Zombo]

Yep, it's played as a bad event by CP vs Entente.

With all due (and immense) respect for your mod, doesn't that kinda defeat the idea of the game being a simulation? I mean, whether the French use or refrain from using the Attaque à Outrance tactic is completely out of Germany's hands. While I understand the validity of the idea as a game mechanism, it conflicts severely with all your previous and successful efforts to bring the game closer to historical plausibility, therefore conveying to the player this precious sense of realism (so extraordinarily absent from vanilla) .

I was imagining events being divided into those one side can manipulate (through options) because you could plausibly argue they had some form of potential control over their occurrence (or not), for example the Allies having the option to cancel Attaque à Outrance earlier than historically, the CP "choosing" to trigger the Fokker event, or regrouping the Kriegsmarine and those no-one can control, a good example being the Spanish Flu.

But to actually have the option to trigger negative events for the opponent feels "unnatural" to say the least. And while "diplomatic" points can represent a pool of multi-purpose resources, an aggregate of strategic and economic focus, financial investment, intellectual resources, political initiatives and what not, you can justify the fact that by "investing" in some of "your" options, you forfeit some others of "your" options - resources are not limitless - it's hard to imagine what sort of "magical" resource would at the same time allow you to trigger, like in our example, a change of doctrine for your enemy while simultaneously preventing you from investing in something that is completely within your field of decision-making.

this is only meant to be positive and constructive criticism, and it's only my opinion of course, don't take this in any way as a rejection of your design choices

[nehi]

you can justify the fact that by "investing" in some of "your" options, you forfeit some others of "your" options - resources are not limitless - it's hard to imagine what sort of "magical" resource would at the same time allow you to trigger, like in our example, a change of doctrine for your enemy while simultaneously preventing you from investing in something that is completely within your field of decision-making

sounds reasonable

maybe this event should be just for france, invest some points to reject this doctrine

else it would happen (maybe this could be general mechanism, historical choise for free/alternative for points)

[Moreau]

@Robotron
coastal batteries,mind sharing details?
@nehi thats how it should be,Entente has overproduction wich is a bit op atm. but germany should have a higher advantage in their troops. Just like in real life their soil never got touched and the entente took more casualties most battles
,and how is the game fun when you blitzkrieg in 1914 with 15 zeppelins that the ai cant handle. Basically an exploit wich removes most strategies and tactics
Aircraft shouldnt be Jet bombers,they where mostly used for recon afterall

[tyro]

Their is also the massive problem of how expensive artillery shots are making them utterly useless.how the hell are you supposed to breakthrough without planes. Since manpower is so ridiculously high it's not like you can bleed out France. So annoying sometimes

[Moreau]

yea arty should be cheaper and manpower should play a way bigger role

[Robotron]

Regarding arty & ammo: I lowerd the PP cost for arty from 40 to 30 and the cost of ammo factories to from 2 to 1 per step, so for example you will pay 6 points to go from 5 ammo factories to 6. Original value in vanilla was 5!
I also raised Germany's ammo factory limit until Fritz Haber event from 9 to 10.

Regarding

manpower should play a way bigger role

How exactly should MP play a greater role? Don't forget that the Entente, has more combined manpower, so giving it a greater role is favouring the Entente even more. I could raise manpower cost for units or change the thresholds for dropping troop quality if that is desired. Please be more specific here.

@Robotron
coastal batteries,mind sharing details?

Cities will be able to return fire to naval bombardment if a unit is present, the chance being calculated by:
- the cities production value (5% per point)
- +50% if it's a fortress
- if an experienced unit is present the percentage will be multiplied by 1 + (unit experience level * 0.25)
- the chance is divided by 3 if no commander is present or by 2 if the unit has a commander or the battery has already returned fire
- the chance is divided by 3 if the defending faction is out of ammo

Coastal batteries will hit with the strength of a pre-dreadnought and use up 1 point of ammo if they hit.

Finally here are the production levels without maintenance for all factions as of V4.0, if you want anything changed give me some numbers.

france PRODUCTION IS:110 (100% war effort reached turn 6)
britain PRODUCTION IS:117 (100% war effort reached turn 14)
russia PRODUCTION IS:193 (100% war effort reached turn 17 (March 1915))
serbia PRODUCTION IS:33
belgium PRODUCTION IS:22
----------------------------------
= 475

austria PRODUCTION IS:110 (100% war effort reached turn 8 )
germany PRODUCTION IS:174 (100% war effort reached turn 4)
turkey PRODUCTION IS:83 (100% war effort reached turn 14)
-------------------------------
= 367

italy PRODUCTION IS:73
bulgaria PRODUCTION IS:37
romania PRODUCTION IS:39
usa PRODUCTION IS:90

greece PRODUCTION IS:35
netherlands PRODUCTION IS:15
sweden PRODUCTION IS:23
denmark PRODUCTION IS:15
spain PRODUCTION IS:41
portugal PRODUCTION IS:15
switzerland PRODUCTION IS:11
norway PRODUCTION IS:13
persia PRODUCTION IS:24

[tyro]

I want there to be much less manpower. Nations in my opinions should be able to run out in the course of the game

[Zombo]

I want there to be much less manpower. Nations in my opinions should be able to run out in the course of the game

No country in WW1 ran out of manpower. Neither Germany nor France, in spite of the grievous losses, lost more men than they could recuperate through the enlisting of the new mobilisable age class.
I actually think that there should be no manpower exhaustion threshold. What should exist (and exists already to a certain point) is a gradual impact on national morale, and unit effectiveness ( reflecting poorer training)

[Moreau]

it should affect everything from troop quality to economy since more men need to be drafted and that means less workes in factories agiculture etc so basically less pp

[Robotron]

it should affect everything from troop quality to economy since more men need to be drafted and that means less workes in factories agiculture etc so basically less pp

And again this would affect Central Powers more than Entente because of the disparity in production. CP are already struggling to keep up with unit production etc., if we were to reduce everybody's production even more by let's just say 5% PP per 10% loss of morale, we'd end up with a 25% penalty on production at morale level 50. I'm not sure at all this would work.

[Zombo]

One little idea (while we're at it). The PP reduction of hexes for being attacked is a little too systematic. This makes attacking such hexes,even at very low odds, a fruitful strategy. It's hard to imagine a completely unsuccessful attack against a region containing a city/fortress doing much damage. I would recommend, if it's feasible, to only apply PP reduction when the attacker deals at least as much damage as they suffered themselves, to avoid unrealistic PP-damage suicide attacks.

BTW, Robotron, no comment on that event-triggered-by-enemy-thing? What's exactly the justification?