Possible campaign BUG (unable to muster new army)

[GShock112]

Early Spring 1572, Daimyo level.
My main army is in Gifu (800+) and I just captured Osaka with my second army, the other Takeda province I captured is Ueda. My funds are 452 and I am trying to muster a new army in Okazaki (800+ manpower). When I go to the unit selection screen the funds listed are 0/0.

This is true with all the other native Oda provinces and Takeda has already raised its army so I should be able to build a new one too. Is this a bug or intended or... well what is it?

Last battle in Gifu I emerged victorious I noticed something strange about the AI and I came up with another question buzzing in my mind: how long can 2 units face each other without automatically get to an engagement? I had these Yari Ashigaru and this enemy Lancer Cavalry that squared off for 10 turns. I didn't need to attack that cavalry and the AI didn't attack my unit because it would have been at disadvantage... but isn't it better if at some point units automatically lose their coolness and attack on their own? It could also be a good solution so that you don't really get too close to the enemy unit that is fortified: this is equivalent to "pinning" that unit and you can pin it indefinitely...wrong for the same reason mentioned above. I simply don't think units should be allowed to stand 10 turns in front of one another idling. At some point one would break and attack the other.

I meant to ask: when a peasant unit routs, a check is triggered on all the friendly units nearby to see if their cohesion remains firm. Considering paesants are so easy to rout, is this cohesion check the SAME as with all other unit or is it somehow handicapped? I think a samurai seeing a paesant unit routing should be almost unaffected so perhaps a different handicap for cohesion tests should take place when paesants rout on the nearby friendly units.

It's just I don't know if this handicap exists or not... that's why I'm asking.

[rbodleyscott]

Early Spring 1572, Daimyo level.
My main army is in Gifu (800+) and I just captured Osaka with my second army, the other Takeda province I captured is Ueda. My funds are 452 and I am trying to muster a new army in Okazaki (800+ manpower). When I go to the unit selection screen the funds listed are 0/0.

This is true with all the other native Oda provinces and Takeda has already raised its army so I should be able to build a new one too. Is this a bug or intended or... well what is it?

The points quoted are the points you have to purchase units beyond the default ones, whose cost is pre-deducted from the displayed points.

As an experiment I tried raising an Oda army in Okazaki, adding no optional units. The resulting army was 530 points.

So your 452 points is only enough to buy the compulsory units, and maybe not even all of those.

I meant to ask: when a peasant unit routs, a check is triggered on all the friendly units nearby to see if their cohesion remains firm. Considering paesants are so easy to rout, is this cohesion check the SAME as with all other unit or is it somehow handicapped? I think a samurai seeing a paesant unit routing should be almost unaffected so perhaps a different handicap for cohesion tests should take place when paesants rout on the nearby friendly units.

Currently it has the same effect as other units routing. I take your point about the samurai - although in the heat of battle troops are not as logical as one might expect.

[GShock112]

Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh you're right ... didn't think about the cost of the default units, that's why.
Despite conquering Osaka, I most certainly can't pull enough taxes because my two armies are quite big. The Takeda on the other side are raising units with lots of paesants (hence the suggestion about the cohesion checks).

The point about samurai stands... if Takeda is raising paesants, this will only get worse for them because they will rout and D/F all the other units in the army.
Am I correct, I didn't dream it, a close-order unit in open terrain fighting a unit in woods gets disordered too?

[rbodleyscott]

Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh you're right ... didn't think about the cost of the default units, that's why.
Despite conquering Osaka, I most certainly can't pull enough taxes because my two armies are quite big. The Takeda on the other side are raising units with lots of paesants (hence the suggestion about the cohesion checks).

Those will be from the two Ikko Ikki provinces.

Am I correct, I didn't dream it, a close-order unit in open terrain fighting a unit in woods gets disordered too?

Yes, if the close order unit is attacking, no if the unit in the woods attacks.

[GShock112]

Yes, absolutely correct.
Thanks for clearing that out.

I'm afraid the Takeda won't be much of an opponent if their armies come with peasants... with or without a particular check as I suggested, are you sure the AI knows those units are peasants and can't be employed with normal tactics?

You guys have built a chess game that is 100 times more entertaining than chess, I can't imagine the hours spent cracking your heads to devise it and it just needs a bit of AI finetuning and some small expansions (fatigue, weather, troops not idling when touching an enemy unit). The rest is really in the campaign features (thought about doing the whole Sengoku Jidai period with multiplayer where each takes a different clan). Imagining the time spent on the P&S system (which is truly remarkable) I'd say most of the trouble is behind and I hope you'll reap the benefits of all this work.

You do know that the Gempei was won at sea, don't you?
If the genius who devised P&S wants, it CAN be ported to sea and I surely hope so.

[rbodleyscott]

are you sure the AI knows those units are peasants and can't be employed with normal tactics?

Unfortunately not.

[GShock112]

Well don't get demoralized ... you'll find a way... meanwhile those peasants have beaten me big time.
Their numbers ... overwhelming.



Every time: just that final round where you know it can go either way... this time it went their way.
My veteran army, destroyed basically... because I was down of a few koku and couldn't reinforce it.