what to do against a German defensive line strategy?

[s_Mylo]

Yoj,

I'm with you 100% on this issue, like I wrote the comments myself.

Mylo

[Pat]

However the point I'm making is more to do 'intra' balance if I can use that term. My opinion is growing that the avoid the Meuse strategy as Axis is more powerful and less risky than stretching your neck out and going for it. This may be intended or something that needs to be rebalanced or perhaps others feel differently about it.

This isn't answering anything at all but just thought I'd point it out. Attacking the Meuse and then to Antwerp was Hitlers plan. Model and v Rundstedt knew this was utterly stupid, reckless and dangerous and proferred their own, much more realistic plans, which Hitler rejected as not being ambitious enough. Now I've never found a copy of them but to my mind v Rundstedt would of gone for something like the Bastogne - Verviers turtling lines, the best option with the resourses he could depend upon.
So yes, this (possible) Modal/von Rundstedt approach is likely the most sensible option. But does it make a good game? As Nick said, we need to give the stats a good look.

[s_Mylo]

Generally speaking, I think it should be tougher for the Axis to win a game of BOtB then the Allies. I believe currently, it is tougher for the Allies particularly given the strategies available for the Germans to avoid the Meuse.

Mylo

[thedudeabidez]

>I believe currently, it is tougher for the Allies particularly given the strategies available for the Germans to avoid the Meuse.

Agreed. The Allies can play an almost error-free game against this approach and still lose unless they get lucky in the counter-attack.

[Yojimbo252]

Personally I think a game (any game) ought to be structured such that either side has an equal chance of winning and not so much based on who may have won historically. Generally speaking I think a game tends to be more enjoyable (and lends itself better to competitive play) where the odds aren't stacked against one side.

I think my main criticism at the moment (and bear in mind I appreciate how difficult it is to balance a game of this nature and still think BotB is a great game) is that the onus to take the offensive, play aggressively and time pressures rest with the Allies rather than the Axis which seems counter to what the Battle for the Ardennes was about.

[s_nkarp]

Just an update to let you all know that we are listening hard to this discussion. We're not going to make any changes until after the results of the Quarter to Three tournament are in and digested, but are actively considering fixes. Victory conditions should be structured to make the game fun!

[Yojimbo252]

I can't ask for more than that.

[Jarling]

Very nice.

The most important thing is to ensure that the germans have an incentive to (try to) move forward for most of the game, which of course was the goal, at least from the OKW point of view.