PC Grand Campaign newbie notes so far (Stalingrad)...

[ptje63]

Hi everyone,
New to the forum, but not in playing strategic pc-games - only play WW-2 related games. Am 51 years old and from The Netherlands, I have played since 1986 and seen many pc-games, but actually never joined a forum.
Until now .
Panzer Corps stole my heart, after playing the regular game I immediately bought the Grand Campaign and Afrika Korps.
Started off at Colonel level, then quickly changed to General and then returned to September 1939 and started all over at Field Marshall level (no advanced level changes yet) and now have reached Stalingrad.

Up until now it was fairly easy and Panzer Corps (PC) really surprised me, because of the occasional frightening sudden AI attacks that have caught me by surprise several times...
Stalingrad is huge as compared to all the other battles so far, both in size as well as AI strenght. So I guess its time to rethink my strategy...

Instead of different topics for each remark or question, here is a list, maybe containing ones that have been mentioned here before - but anyway...
Thanks for responding in advance... .

In general:
-In Berlin (regular game) I attacked a IS-2 while it was crossing a river, it withdrew with 2 points remaining to MY side of river, with no more possibilities for me to attack. It recovers from oppression to 10 points in next turn, although cut off from own units and totally surrounded by my troops - which should prevent AI from resupplying back to full strength. None of my units can cope with it in the remaining 3 turns...
-I missed an upgrade to the Hs.129, but assume one is included in the Grand Campaign.
-I dont understand the low hard attack value of 8 for the German 88-AAgun in its role of attacking ground units.
-Cost of upgrading from FW.190A to D9 is minor, but from D9 to Ta.152H is huge.
-Starting all German units in the Afrika Korps Campaign in 1941 with 0 experience is probably for gameplay purpose.
-How can I tell for how much a unit will sell for when I disband it?
-How two French light cavalry units can almost wipe out my core units Pz.IIIF with 13 points is still a mystery to me... Armoured plated and AT-carrying horses?
-It took me a long time to find out which I prefer, Grenadiers or Pioniers... By now I have chosen the Pioniers.
-Appreciate the low cost for upgrading within a type, for instance Mk.III's tanks, and a higher cost for upgrading to the Mk.IV.

Heroes:
-Far less heroes are given to AT, recon and bombers than to other units.
-I have not received any + range heroes so far. In Panzer General these were more generously given - most usefull for artillery.
-I have kept Rudel, because of a hint on this forum that a second Rudel would be given later on. The second one is a true killer and definately one of my favourites. But the first Rudel I never used after 1940 since it simply too vulnerable with -6 attack and -2 defense values, although by now it has 339 exp points. Waiting (in vain?) for upgrade? Sell?

Suggestions:
-Hotkey that shows spotting and attack range (the way movement is shown in hexes)
-List progress/experience etc. per battle for all units (instead of one unit only -R-click/Battle History). I made an Excell Sheet to check all the stats, comparing own strength to AI units, using colors to emphasize units that need upgrades, etc. Also included AI's units with Soft/Hard/Defense numbers to compare.
-The library does not contain all units used in the game, nor its upgrades.
-More freedom of choice for replacements: go from (say) 4 to 8, instead of only being able to go back to 10. Being able to replace from (say) 4 to 6 with regular and from 6 to 10 points with elite replacements. Historically not incorrect.
-I would welcome (even a ficticious) Battle History of the AI opponent: When I meet a 14 point strong 57th Cruiser Mk.IV it must have had some battles...
-I would welcome a broader introduction to each battle, especially using a map: where does this battle take place in comparison to the previous one and the overall campaign? Eagle's view of (say) France and then zoom in to the appropriate region?
-I upgrade unit (between battles) and then replacements: if I change the order, it loses experience points. (For instance: if a 13 exp. Infantry unit with 10 points remaining is given 3 elite replacements and THEN upgraded to (say) Pioniere, it looses these 3 elite repl. - I dont understand why...).
-The avatar for the Blenheim Mk.1 appears to be the Mk.4.
-My He.177 by now has 318 experience and 104 kills. My infantry units had far more kills around that amount of experience (600-700). But my bomber by now has sunk the Glorious, 5 cruisers and 1 destroyer. How do these numbers compare?
-Rate in which experience is gathered differs dramatically between units: AT very slow, Bomber very fast.
-Undo option for replacements.
-I cant tell at which point the Bruckenpioniere can cross a wide river. Dnieper at Vyazma scenario. There is no hint given when I hover above the hex with the cursor.
-The AT Panzerjäger was replaced for the StuG.III at an earlier time I thought. Available at earlier stage in other strategy games, but I am not sure which one is correct.
-One can swith from regular view to zooming in, press F5 for overall view or consult the small map in the lower right corner. Only this last one has a small X to indicate an Airfield, none of the other views more clearly indicate them. Would appreciate better method.

My own strategy (all amounts are for units as having reached Stalingrad):
TOP 5:
-Reconnaissance!!! (4) - intelligence is the key
-Air superiority (8 fighters): use them for cover
-Artillery (8): defense and attack
-Use unit's key strength: infantry for cities and AT before use of tanks, etc. Do it always.
-Cover your flanks: do not leave vulnerable units uncovered.

-Only replacements or upgrade (in city) during battle if needed (I hardly do this for units below 5 points). Costs too much.
-Don't get carried away, never be tempted..:
---to chase a wounded and retreating AI-unit unless really sure its safe, you may end up isolated
---to make a hasty decision - take your time to carefully balance each movement, attack or retreat
---to be too proud to not retreat
---to want only decisive victories
-Always more core units than possible to place: use less experienced units to gather experience in favor of elite units if possible.
-I only use movable AA and AT.
-Sell all captured units, except the artillery (upgrade to German) and the KV-1B (remark: I may not have found all captured units hexes).
-1 Bruckenpioniere - use for mopping up damaged opponents to gather exp. - 225 by now.
-Use regular replacements until mid 1941. Saves points, while there is still plenty of opportunity to gather more at reasonable (damage) cost.
-I upgraded infantry to Pioniere when they received a + movement hero.
-I still make plenty of use of the Me.110G (Lent), with 425 exp it can act on its own without support, still not attacked by AI fighters.
-When attacking AI airplane, place fighter in a hex where it also can (double) function as cover for ground unit if you have the choice.

I will try to concentrate on Stalingrad now. My losses will no doubt start to grow (lost 3 core units so far).

Immensly enjoying Panzer Corps... It is like reading a thriller novel: seems impossible to shut it, MUST read the next page .

Regards,
Peter

[bebro]

Welcome!

I don't answer all your points, but at least some....

-I missed an upgrade to the Hs.129, but assume one is included in the Grand Campaign.

Pls. check what version you are running, IIRC Hs 129 was added for Afrika Korps add on, which also updated the game to another version. IIRC recent patches are 1.22/1.23.

-Cost of upgrading from FW.190A to D9 is minor, but from D9 to Ta.152H is huge.

Probably a case of upgrade families. Units belonging to one "family" are cheaper to upgrade (example Bf 109 F to 109G, units outside the family cost always the full prize. Of course one could argue that the Ta152 should belong to the same family as the FW190s, but that's not how it's setup currently.

-How can I tell for how much a unit will sell for when I disband it?

Check the prize in the purchase menu before disbanding. You only get prestige back when disbanding *between* scenarios though, not when you disband in the field.

-How two French light cavalry units can almost wipe out my core units Pz.IIIF with 13 points is still a mystery to me... Armoured plated and AT-carrying horses?

Random battle results. You can change this in the settings to dice chess or full chess (meaning less random or no random results)

-The library does not contain all units used in the game, nor its upgrades.

Personally I'd get rid of the historic info on units completely, as it's mostly "filler". Most of this is way better accessible and comprehensive in Wiki articles, or even good old books...Another case would be to give the payer info on upgrades, units switches or special abilities, which IMO would be nice to have. Right now you can only check the pzdat files for this.

-I upgrade unit (between battles) and then replacements: if I change the order, it loses experience points. (For instance: if a 13 exp. Infantry unit with 10 points remaining is given 3 elite replacements and THEN upgraded to (say) Pioniere, it looses these 3 elite repl. - I dont understand why...).

That's another rule of upgrades, outside the "family" you lose overstrength - so upgrade 1st, then overstrength.

-My He.177 by now has 318 experience and 104 kills. My infantry units had far more kills around that amount of experience (600-700). But my bomber by now has sunk the Glorious, 5 cruisers and 1 destroyer. How do these numbers compare?
-Rate in which experience is gathered differs dramatically between units: AT very slow, Bomber very fast.

Both bombers and artillery get XP for suppression too, so overall they level up faster. Personally I'd like to slow down the XP gain for these two classes too.


edit: damn quote tags and spelling...

[alkafluence]

-How two French light cavalry units can almost wipe out my core units Pz.IIIF with 13 points is still a mystery to me... Armoured plated and AT-carrying horses?

Random battle results. You can change this in the settings to dice chess or full chess (meaning less random or no random results)

This can also depend on the terrain your tank is sitting in. If it is "close" terrain like forests or cities, then the "soft units" like infantry and cavalry will attack the "close" defense of a unit which is usually MUCH lower than general defense.

[Razz1]

Hi everyone,

Heroes:
-Far less heroes are given to AT, recon and bombers than to other units.
-I have not received any + range heroes so far. In Panzer General these were more generously given - most usefull for artillery.
-I have kept Rudel, because of a hint on this forum that a second Rudel would be given later on. The second one is a true killer and definately one of my favourites. But the first Rudel I never used after 1940 since it simply too vulnerable with -6 attack and -2 defense values, although by now it has 339 exp points. Waiting (in vain?) for upgrade? Sell?

You can get heroes with AT and Recon units, but you need to use them and keep them alive which is hard to do.

Bombers get experience fast but heroes real slow. I have had a bomber hero before but not very often.

[ptje63]

-How two French light cavalry units can almost wipe out my core units Pz.IIIF with 13 points is still a mystery to me... Armoured plated and AT-carrying horses?

Random battle results. You can change this in the settings to dice chess or full chess (meaning less random or no random results)

This can also depend on the terrain your tank is sitting in. If it is "close" terrain like forests or cities, then the "soft units" like infantry and cavalry will attack the "close" defense of a unit which is usually MUCH lower than general defense.

It was in open field, not close terrain - I guess similar to other remarks on this forum about surprising difficulties in dealing with cavalry units.

[ptje63]

Hi everyone,

Heroes:
-Far less heroes are given to AT, recon and bombers than to other units.
-I have not received any + range heroes so far. In Panzer General these were more generously given - most usefull for artillery.
-I have kept Rudel, because of a hint on this forum that a second Rudel would be given later on. The second one is a true killer and definately one of my favourites. But the first Rudel I never used after 1940 since it simply too vulnerable with -6 attack and -2 defense values, although by now it has 339 exp points. Waiting (in vain?) for upgrade? Sell?

You can get heroes with AT and Recon units, but you need to use them and keep them alive which is hard to do.

Bombers get experience fast but heroes real slow. I have had a bomber hero before but not very often.

I use AT and Recon units extensively in each and every battle. It's just that some units have gathered three heroes by the time they have 350 exp.points, while others with the same amount have none.

[bebro]

Heroes are given for kills, not for XP. As bombers do often more supression than kills, they usually get XP faster than heroes, like Razz wrote.

For recon/AT you can always check their kills in the unit panel.

Also there's a certain range of min/max kills in which those heroes appear, so sometimes earlier (closer to min), sometimes later (max).

[ptje63]

Welcome!

I don't answer all your points, but at least some....

-How can I tell for how much a unit will sell for when I disband it?

Check the prize in the purchase menu before disbanding. You only get prestige back when disbanding *between* scenarios though, not when you disband in the field.

It does not tell me the prestige for captured units. And I assume a unit with full strength is worth less as compared to when the amount of strength points are lower?

[ptje63]

Uhm... well... reaching Stalingrad does stop the generous amount of prestige given in the game up until that point.
Trying to "Escape from Stalingrad" now - less than 3400 points left after re-armament...
What will tomorrow bring...

[ptje63]

Another question has arisen: how can I tell if a scenario starts with me attacking (first turn) or defending (AI has first turn) - which kind of influences the initial setup of forces... .

[hs1611]

You can't, that's one of the flaws of this game.

Just deploy 1 unit, SAVE, and press "NEXT TURN" to see who goes first. Then reload the SAVE GAME, deploy your units and start playing.

[bebro]

It does not tell me the prestige for captured units. And I assume a unit with full strength is worth less as compared to when the amount of strength points are lower?

Didn't check yet, but the price of captureds should appear also on the unit panel you can bring up for each unit indivdually in the map view (via RMB)?

[hugh2711]

Hi ptje63
Once you get rudel 'light' at the beginning you dont need to deploy/give him experience as it is not transferred when you get the new strong rudel on (I think it is) minsk which of course you only get if you deploy weak strudel at that particular scenario. I usually disband weak for cash only when i have the tough one. You would be better off getting that 339 experience points inbetween the first and minsk for a normal stuka you will keep. Having said that in the first scenario weak rudel is useful for leaving over the AA defended victory hex with troops in the northeast corner. If you are attacking the bombers/fighters over the AA/airfield there BEFORE they move the AI's AA will attack weak rudel instead of your fighters saving youcash/exp.

[bebro]

Seems I was wrong about the unit price being shown on the panel...my bad.

[ptje63]

At deployment stage RMB does not give clue of value of unit. Another thing: I disbanded the first Rudel Ju.87D with 344 exp. points and got back: 320 prestige = which is exactly the amount if I buy a new Ju.87D with "0" experience...
Does the gathered experience not count when disbanding a unit? Which would be odd to me...

[alkafluence]

You are correct. Experience does not factor into the price (or redemption value) of unit being bought (or sold).

That's why, if you are going to disband a unit between scenarios to get money back. Make sure to use free reinforcements to bring it up to 10 strength first in order to get the maximum refund.