I placed a bet on their being lots of Knights at the challenge and took WOR lancastrian. Taken withotu stakes for extra excitement adn to tempt people to come and play as best i could. As it happened there weren't so many knight armies and my second choice army - Late Imperial Roman may have in fact proved more potent.
My army was
Drilled bit:
3 BG 8 Longbow Prot LBw Sw Ave
2 Bg 4 billmen Arm HW Sup
1 BG 6 billmen Arm HW Sup
1 BG 6 dismounted MAA H Arm HW Sup
Undrilled bit:
2 BG 6 Unprot LBw Ave
1 BG 6 Prot Off Sp Ave
1 BG 6 LF Unprot Jav Ave
1 BG 4 LH Prot Lnc Swd Ave
2 BG 4 HF Prot Def Sp Poor
3TCs
Reports to follow
Si
WOR at the Challenge
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WOR at the Challenge
Simon Hall
"May your dice roll 6s (unless ye be poor)"
"May your dice roll 6s (unless ye be poor)"
GAME 1 vs Medieval Crown of Aragorn Jon AkkersJon hadn't played many games so a fair bit of this was helping him get going. There was a forest on my left which John dominated with some amulghavar Imp Ft troops but who arrived a little too late to help the main battle lines out in the open. We had a fantastic time on my right- there was a large uneven field which Jon put 3 BGs of knights through into 2 BGs of longbow with generals and rear support. A monster tussle that eventually resulted in the Kn being bounced and breaking off and then suffering from some whithering longbow fire. 2 of the 3 Kn BGs were broken with the third successfully routing 1 longbow BG. On my left a BG of billmen was charged in the flank but manage to hold on long enough for another knights block to be broken - medals all round -and a lost general caused something of a viral spred for Jon. The army broke once the welsh Off Sp got into some crossbowmen in the open inthe centre. 22-3 IIRC
GAME 2 vs Robbo (finally after years) PtolemaicRobbo put down lots of difficult and rough which covered the right side of the table and advanced down the centre with a full 5BGs each of 8 Pk incluidng 1 Sup. This looked very daunting. I set up to take it on forntally but with a much wider line. My UnDr welsh were on my left sweeping around to force a flank on the left hand BG of Pk.
Robbo pressed through the rough terrain on my right and this was dealt with by the BG of LF pulling 1 MF BG away from the main battle (gradually voer the coruse of 5 bounds the jav men actually FRGed and broke it in fact). I put my H Arm billmen over that side to provide a solid wall of defence. In due course these were hit by Sup Pk and by MF Off Sp and over the course of 3 rounds broke.
In the meantime the pressure on the left was growing and 1 Pk BG was in serious trouble and had to peel away. The main pike line went in and the bowmen caused a DSR on contact with the added dice. The generals and rear support proved just enough to hold cohesion when the LBw lost and the Pks were slowly whittled down a bit. Then I got 1 BG of billmen into the flank of the left hand BG and it was a mess thereafter as they crumbled the pks from the side a bit.
Robbo made a couple of gallant charges vs the welsh but had to bring out some poor troops to do so which got hurt and a BG of El chasing the LF suffered badly from the now expert Irish Javelinmen. 22-3 IIRC
GAME 2 vs Robbo (finally after years) PtolemaicRobbo put down lots of difficult and rough which covered the right side of the table and advanced down the centre with a full 5BGs each of 8 Pk incluidng 1 Sup. This looked very daunting. I set up to take it on forntally but with a much wider line. My UnDr welsh were on my left sweeping around to force a flank on the left hand BG of Pk.
Robbo pressed through the rough terrain on my right and this was dealt with by the BG of LF pulling 1 MF BG away from the main battle (gradually voer the coruse of 5 bounds the jav men actually FRGed and broke it in fact). I put my H Arm billmen over that side to provide a solid wall of defence. In due course these were hit by Sup Pk and by MF Off Sp and over the course of 3 rounds broke.
In the meantime the pressure on the left was growing and 1 Pk BG was in serious trouble and had to peel away. The main pike line went in and the bowmen caused a DSR on contact with the added dice. The generals and rear support proved just enough to hold cohesion when the LBw lost and the Pks were slowly whittled down a bit. Then I got 1 BG of billmen into the flank of the left hand BG and it was a mess thereafter as they crumbled the pks from the side a bit.
Robbo made a couple of gallant charges vs the welsh but had to bring out some poor troops to do so which got hurt and a BG of El chasing the LF suffered badly from the now expert Irish Javelinmen. 22-3 IIRC
Last edited by shall on Thu Apr 24, 2008 12:10 am, edited 1 time in total.
Simon Hall
"May your dice roll 6s (unless ye be poor)"
"May your dice roll 6s (unless ye be poor)"
Game 3 Bruce Brown with WOR Yorkist Pretender
Ok first witty bit. This army can have 2x the normal Irish - so Bruce had none just for fun!
Very interesting terrain - a steep hill on my near right with a forrest behind. I placed my poor foot behind the forest and my Ave Welsh to defend the steep hill hoping that the hill would make it very difficult to get through it all and to take andvantage of the tempting targets. Bruce set up to attack this in strength. This combined with me not having stakes, and Bruce having paid for his, gave me quite a quantity advantage on the rest of the table as long as the hill held.
The game started with me pressing to get around the right and Bruce manouvring well to stop me getting to his camp easily. I pressed on my right, Bruce pressed on my left and we were cautiously approaching in the centre. What happened thereafter was a blood bath and it didn't really matter who had the best tactical situation as Bruce failed CT after CT, and CMT after CMT. The result of this being a collpase of his forces facing my right fairly easily.
In the middle I bought time by advancing a large LBw block to take the strain with a general. While likely to lose, they were being hit by a DISR pike block that was vulnerable in the charge 3 dice at 3s = 2 hits, vs 4 dice plus 2 shooting at 5s with rerolls = 2.33 hits. The risk paid off whent he Pk BRKed, but it was only time until my LBw BG did. However it bought time on the hill which was holding well and with a few downhill charges Bruce's army decided to capitulate without putting up much more of a fight. 21-4 IIRC
Game 4 vs Phil Powell Parthians
A very interesting game this one with Phil having organised his LH skimishers around and IC for that +2 on CTs. That meant that they only needed a 6 to pass most of those tests. Even though I had much more firepower I may not therefore have been better at forcing DISRs. My Welsh being UnPr were most vulnerable so went 3 ranks deep with LF and Off Sp support. The terrain had a gully down on Phils side on my right and he deployed 3 BGs of LH and 1 odf Cataphracts there. My last BG down was my HArm HW guys and I single ranked them across the exit from the side. This forced Phil to redeploy these LH as they were not able to do much ad getting in the way - although his cataphracts made quick work of the MAA shortly after.
In the centre was a piece of uneven which Phil was moving his other cataphracts through. My LBw closed them down and opened fire to limited effect. 1 charged and hitting 2 BGs broke off from combat leaving it facing a full 12 dice of LBw fire - 8 hits in the first go. This gradually proved the end for this BG. Phils 3rd BG of cataphracts was doing Ok, but not great, on my right but manaegd to kill my general unleashing chaos across my left flank as a Lbw BG broke and a Billmen was DSRed and hit by them. Both were swept away. However by now the shooting was telling on the lH and several were FRG and lost to charged or shooting. A Lbw BG reached the camp to get the last 2 APs for the army. 22-3 IIRC
Ok first witty bit. This army can have 2x the normal Irish - so Bruce had none just for fun!
Very interesting terrain - a steep hill on my near right with a forrest behind. I placed my poor foot behind the forest and my Ave Welsh to defend the steep hill hoping that the hill would make it very difficult to get through it all and to take andvantage of the tempting targets. Bruce set up to attack this in strength. This combined with me not having stakes, and Bruce having paid for his, gave me quite a quantity advantage on the rest of the table as long as the hill held.The game started with me pressing to get around the right and Bruce manouvring well to stop me getting to his camp easily. I pressed on my right, Bruce pressed on my left and we were cautiously approaching in the centre. What happened thereafter was a blood bath and it didn't really matter who had the best tactical situation as Bruce failed CT after CT, and CMT after CMT. The result of this being a collpase of his forces facing my right fairly easily.
In the middle I bought time by advancing a large LBw block to take the strain with a general. While likely to lose, they were being hit by a DISR pike block that was vulnerable in the charge 3 dice at 3s = 2 hits, vs 4 dice plus 2 shooting at 5s with rerolls = 2.33 hits. The risk paid off whent he Pk BRKed, but it was only time until my LBw BG did. However it bought time on the hill which was holding well and with a few downhill charges Bruce's army decided to capitulate without putting up much more of a fight. 21-4 IIRC
Game 4 vs Phil Powell Parthians
A very interesting game this one with Phil having organised his LH skimishers around and IC for that +2 on CTs. That meant that they only needed a 6 to pass most of those tests. Even though I had much more firepower I may not therefore have been better at forcing DISRs. My Welsh being UnPr were most vulnerable so went 3 ranks deep with LF and Off Sp support. The terrain had a gully down on Phils side on my right and he deployed 3 BGs of LH and 1 odf Cataphracts there. My last BG down was my HArm HW guys and I single ranked them across the exit from the side. This forced Phil to redeploy these LH as they were not able to do much ad getting in the way - although his cataphracts made quick work of the MAA shortly after.
In the centre was a piece of uneven which Phil was moving his other cataphracts through. My LBw closed them down and opened fire to limited effect. 1 charged and hitting 2 BGs broke off from combat leaving it facing a full 12 dice of LBw fire - 8 hits in the first go. This gradually proved the end for this BG. Phils 3rd BG of cataphracts was doing Ok, but not great, on my right but manaegd to kill my general unleashing chaos across my left flank as a Lbw BG broke and a Billmen was DSRed and hit by them. Both were swept away. However by now the shooting was telling on the lH and several were FRG and lost to charged or shooting. A Lbw BG reached the camp to get the last 2 APs for the army. 22-3 IIRC
Simon Hall
"May your dice roll 6s (unless ye be poor)"
"May your dice roll 6s (unless ye be poor)"
-
nikgaukroger
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Re: WOR at the Challenge
But utterly illegal as only armies from the first two books were allowedshall wrote:As it happened there weren't so many knight armies and my second choice army - Late Imperial Roman may have in fact proved more potent.
Nik Gaukroger
"Never ask a man if he comes from Yorkshire. If he does, he will tell you.
If he does not, why humiliate him?" - Canon Sydney Smith
nikgaukroger@blueyonder.co.uk
"Never ask a man if he comes from Yorkshire. If he does, he will tell you.
If he does not, why humiliate him?" - Canon Sydney Smith
nikgaukroger@blueyonder.co.uk
And thus to the massacre......
Dave's army is a great mixed arms anti longbow gadget so it was never going to be easy. Dave played the best game of FOG I have yet been up against all the way through from army design to terrain to deployment to moves. He deserved to win and take the title so well done him!
The terrain was a nightmare for me as I ended up with a big village in the middle of my half of the table on the centreline. This took away my biggest edge which was width and the ability to swamp and envelop well with masses of shooting.
On my left we had plenty of rough terrain. It was clear that wherever my welsh went Dave's tough MF troops would go as he was deploying last, so I decided to support them heavily with billmen to buy time and try to slow the decline. I then set up 3 BGs to round the right of the village as fast as possible to try to get some sweeping effect going. With hindsight I should have put my LH lancers there too but put therm on the left to try to scare away mass skirmishers.
Dave's deployment was spot on. He was geared up to crunch my welsh and supports in due course. The relative weakness of his army was his normal foot and knights in fact. I have never played for a draw and didn't intend to start then, so I figured my way to win big was to draw his weaker troops into a fight before he swamped my left - which realistically he was bound to do. I therefore made 3 bold calls:
a) On my left I chucked a BG of billmen out alone to die slowly in front of LH and Kn (which they did a fine job at on both counts)
b) I chucked my longbows and billmen up the centre to try to tempt the knights and foot into a fight and draw some clout away from the welsh
c) I timed it to get my right flank longbows into a position to charge his knights flank as long as they passed a CMT to expand and move and kept a general with them to do so
Alas it was not a plan without risk and so it proved. Dave came forward to attack the middle and I failed the CMT on a 4 with the general with them. Thus the help arrived a bound too late and that was enough to turn the corner there from likely winning to losing. Dave then killed a general and all hell broke loose in the middle. This left me battling to survive. Lots of shooting but from memory the most common sight was a 6 & 4 from Dave leading to him passing all the time - so my mass shooting did nothing.
My final chance to hold the army wason the left. the billmen had bought enough time so that my Off Sp charged his Sw and bucklermen on a + with 4 dice each but lost 4 - 1 and went DSR instead. Oh well one of those days. He then toasted another general on a 6-6 when they hadn't lost and thus die 15,000 Lancastrians. Mind you he never did manage to kill all my generals...
Despite the score the game could have unfolded either way. Certainly I was due to lose on my left given time so there is no way I could have won 25-0 but possibly 20-5 if all went well and porbably a gritty 12-8 to Dave on average n average dice as he would have done well on the left. me on the right and we would have gritted it out in the middle.
Another great game - I have never enjoyed losing so badly so much!!
Si
Dave's army is a great mixed arms anti longbow gadget so it was never going to be easy. Dave played the best game of FOG I have yet been up against all the way through from army design to terrain to deployment to moves. He deserved to win and take the title so well done him!
The terrain was a nightmare for me as I ended up with a big village in the middle of my half of the table on the centreline. This took away my biggest edge which was width and the ability to swamp and envelop well with masses of shooting.
On my left we had plenty of rough terrain. It was clear that wherever my welsh went Dave's tough MF troops would go as he was deploying last, so I decided to support them heavily with billmen to buy time and try to slow the decline. I then set up 3 BGs to round the right of the village as fast as possible to try to get some sweeping effect going. With hindsight I should have put my LH lancers there too but put therm on the left to try to scare away mass skirmishers.
Dave's deployment was spot on. He was geared up to crunch my welsh and supports in due course. The relative weakness of his army was his normal foot and knights in fact. I have never played for a draw and didn't intend to start then, so I figured my way to win big was to draw his weaker troops into a fight before he swamped my left - which realistically he was bound to do. I therefore made 3 bold calls:
a) On my left I chucked a BG of billmen out alone to die slowly in front of LH and Kn (which they did a fine job at on both counts)
b) I chucked my longbows and billmen up the centre to try to tempt the knights and foot into a fight and draw some clout away from the welsh
c) I timed it to get my right flank longbows into a position to charge his knights flank as long as they passed a CMT to expand and move and kept a general with them to do so
Alas it was not a plan without risk and so it proved. Dave came forward to attack the middle and I failed the CMT on a 4 with the general with them. Thus the help arrived a bound too late and that was enough to turn the corner there from likely winning to losing. Dave then killed a general and all hell broke loose in the middle. This left me battling to survive. Lots of shooting but from memory the most common sight was a 6 & 4 from Dave leading to him passing all the time - so my mass shooting did nothing.
My final chance to hold the army wason the left. the billmen had bought enough time so that my Off Sp charged his Sw and bucklermen on a + with 4 dice each but lost 4 - 1 and went DSR instead. Oh well one of those days. He then toasted another general on a 6-6 when they hadn't lost and thus die 15,000 Lancastrians. Mind you he never did manage to kill all my generals...
Despite the score the game could have unfolded either way. Certainly I was due to lose on my left given time so there is no way I could have won 25-0 but possibly 20-5 if all went well and porbably a gritty 12-8 to Dave on average n average dice as he would have done well on the left. me on the right and we would have gritted it out in the middle.
Another great game - I have never enjoyed losing so badly so much!!
Si
Simon Hall
"May your dice roll 6s (unless ye be poor)"
"May your dice roll 6s (unless ye be poor)"
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babyshark
- Field of Glory Moderator
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Re: WOR at the Challenge
At least he didn't say Patrician Roman with 18.5 element commands.nikgaukroger wrote:But utterly illegal as only armies from the first two books were allowedshall wrote:As it happened there weren't so many knight armies and my second choice army - Late Imperial Roman may have in fact proved more potent.
Marc