Difficult and cavalry

[deadtorius]

Last weekend Blathergut and I ran a demo game at a small local convention. We got 3 players, 1 of whom had played once before. Blathergut was the French commander and made a major blunder in reading the movement charts for difficult and thinking his Guard Cuirassier could move 4 MU through a large batch of dense woods. It took most of the game for his struggling Cuirassier to get the front of the unit out of the woods. In order to keep him out of the game and in the woods I moved up my allied Cavalry Division close enough that he could not totally move out of the woods and tried shooting at him with my arty attachments. Next turn he charged with his Cuirassier. It was not until the next day that I thought that under Bretts proposal for Cavalry in difficult that we have been using, that cavalry can not charge into difficult woods. Does that also mean they could not charge out? I am thinking the answer would be no but wanted to make sure.

First victory with an 1805 list, Kutusov is proud. The Austrians will want a victory of their own after this...

[ravenflight]

Last weekend Blathergut and I ran a demo game at a small local convention. We got 3 players, 1 of whom had played once before. Blathergut was the French commander and made a major blunder in reading the movement charts for difficult and thinking his Guard Cuirassier could move 4 MU through a large batch of dense woods. It took most of the game for his struggling Cuirassier to get the front of the unit out of the woods. In order to keep him out of the game and in the woods I moved up my allied Cavalry Division close enough that he could not totally move out of the woods and tried shooting at him with my arty attachments. Next turn he charged with his Cuirassier. It was not until the next day that I thought that under Bretts proposal for Cavalry in difficult that we have been using, that cavalry can not charge into difficult woods. Does that also mean they could not charge out? I am thinking the answer would be no but wanted to make sure.

First victory with an 1805 list, Kutusov is proud. The Austrians will want a victory of their own after this...

French Guard Cuirassiers??? What list is that in?

[Blathergut]

1805

[MDH]

1805

What! ? Not in my copy of Emperors and Eagles pages 97, 98, 99,104 So where have you got that from? I would have thought an obvious howler /proof typo of that magnitude would have been spotted by now by someone I would never have deliberately written that myself, knowing full well that to be an error.

To the best of my knowledge only the Russians - in the major powers - had Guard heavy cavalry so equipped (and that was much later) . Also titles can be misleading as to whether a regiment was issued with them and f so whether they actually took them on campaign .The Saxon Zastrow cuirassiers being an example in 1812.They left them at home.

There were no French Imperial Guard Cuirassiers in the First Empire. I read that David( I think it was him) had presented Napoleon with a uniform design for Guard Cuirassiers early on in the First Empire but it was far too gaudy even for the Emperor to stomach . (There were in the Imperial Guard of 1870.)The previous French Gendarmerie, of whom the gendarmes d'elite could be seen as the successor regiment, under the pre revolutionary Ancien regime, may have had them too.

All that said French Guard Cuirassiers would have been treated exactly the same as the Grenadiers a Cheval by us .

[ravenflight]

1805

What! ? Not in my copy of Emperors and Eagles pages 97, 98, 99,104 So where have you got that from? I would have thought an obvious howler /proof typo of that magnitude would have been spotted by now by someone I would never have deliberately written that myself, knowing full well that to be an error.

To the best of my knowledge only the Russians - in the major powers - had Guard heavy cavalry so equipped (and that was much later) . Also titles can be misleading as to whether a regiment was issued with them and f so whether they actually took them on campaign .The Saxon Zastrow cuirassiers being an example in 1812.They left them at home.

There were no French Imperial Guard Cuirassiers in the First Empire. I read that David( I think it was him) had presented Napoleon with a uniform design for Guard Cuirassiers early on in the First Empire but it was far too gaudy even for the Emperor to stomach . (There were in the Imperial Guard of 1870.)The previous French Gendarmerie, of whom the gendarmes d'elite could be seen as the successor regiment, under the pre revolutionary Ancien regime, may have had them too.

All that said French Guard Cuirassiers would have been treated exactly the same as the Grenadiers a Cheval by us .

I'm pretty sure the Russian Guard Cuirassiers didn't actually wear a cuirass either. It doesn't matter though. The Dragoons of the Napoleonic wars were far from mounted infantry of a hundred years earlier. Nomenclature means little, but I'm CERTAIN the French didn't have Guard Cuirassiers... in name -or- feature.

[Sarmaticus]

Russian Cuirassiers are armoured in the campaigns of 1812-15; unarmoured in the earlier campaigns. Prussians aren't armoured until 1815. The British don't get their cuirasses until after the peace. A pity there wasn't a general war in the next fifteen years or so when uniforms were at the peak of extravagance (from a purely sartorial point of view). Some hint of what's to come in the updated gendarmes d'elite and 1st Chasseurs-a-cheval uniforms of 1815. Maison-du-Roi would be pretty in a what-if conflict of UK, Austria and Bourbon France versus Prussia and Russia.

[Blathergut]

guys...dead. was referring to heavy cav superior vet guard shock...grenadiers and gendarmerie...

[BrettPT]

It was not until the next day that I thought that under Bretts proposal for Cavalry in difficult that we have been using, that cavalry can not charge into difficult woods. Does that also mean they could not charge out?

Haven't thought about this to be honest, however the house rule we've been using to get around the mounted in difficult issue is:

"Mounted troops cannot declare an assault against infantry in difficult"

The "in" is meant to mean the target is in difficult. So in your situation, under this house rule, no issue with mounted charging out of a forest (or indeed into a forest against enemy mounted or artillery) - also note that mounted can pursue into difficult under this house rule.

I think a clearer version of this house rule might be
"Mounted troops cannot declare an assault against infantry located wholly in difficult"

Cheers
Brett

[deadtorius]

Thanks Brett