Help building a 650 pt Dacian list

[helot2000]

I'm painting Dacians for a local FoG campaign, limited to Immortal Fire through Legions Triumphant lists. We're playing 650 point games on 5 x 3 tables. I'd appreciate help building a list before I base up my figures and then change my mind.

1. MF in 6 versus 8 bases. I'm taking Falxmen and Javelinment MF in 8s for their toughness to missile fire and 1 HP 2 bases. On the flipside, taking them in 6s raises my breakpoint.

2. 4 Generals versus 3. My undrilled armies struggle with CMTs, naturally. By having 4, I'll have less issues with "forward move of less than full move" if I have a general parked with the unit. Also, I do love to bump 8 bases up in melee with a General up front. It is expensive to field 4. Any thoughts?

3. 1 versus 2 Sarmatian Cav. ally This is a tough call. 1 unit is 10% of my list. If I took only 1, I could substitute in a Bastarnae Cav for rear support and have points to spend.

4. Bow versus javelin LF. Dacians can take lots of bow but there are a fair number of Roman armies in our group. Aganist them, my bow will be 5-6s to hit. Skip bow and use cheap Javelin to screen my unprotected Falxmen?

I love 650 point games on a smaller table but you must be ruthlessly efficient in your selections. That's where I'm struggling! In advance, thanks.

[ravenflight]

Just my 2 cents worth (worth what you paid for it):

If you have tougher troops (ie 8bases instead of 6) you don't have to worry about break points as much. Sure, you can get bad luck etc.
If you have tougher troops (ie 8bases instead of 6) you need less generals.
If you have tougher troops (ie 8bases instead of 6) your generals cover more frontage when fighting in the front rank.

Personally, I'd go an IC and 2 TC's to throw in the front rank. Use the IC to cover shooting and then throw him into the rear rank of the 'at risk' troops with a TC in the front rank. Once the impact has been absorbed your IC can mosey off to the next 'at risk' troops.

Dunno about the cav so wont comment.

[grahambriggs]

I suppose at 650 I'd look for 9 or 10 BGs as the minimum. Going for BGs of 6 to boost your size is muddled thinking. You might need, say, 24 bases of MF fighting in one area. If they are in 8s that's 3 BGs if 6s that's 4 and the army's bigger. But if you lose in that area you might lose them all so the the bigger army size does you little good.

I'd go for 8s or bigger with cheap fighting troops like these. 6s are just too small and will be far too fragile. Two 12s of warband with a 6 as rear support is also good.

Use javelins LF as they are cheaper - they aren't going to win the battle so why spend points on them? These you should have in 6s to minimise cost per BGs.

The Sarmatian ally is valuable as it is the only thing that likes to fight in the open. But go for 2 units one BG will just get swamped. On the other hand it does take up a general and it's a lot of cost. Might be better to just take your lumps in the open. A difficult call.

Generals is a difficult decision. It kind of depends what your plan is. An IC is handy as it gives you the bad going terrain options if you win the initiative. But then will you afford two Dacian TCs AND a Sarmatian TC. probably not, so just one Dacian TC then maybe. Will you have a couple of big warband units and rear support +IC to stall the legions frontally while you chew up their flanks? Or do you want more fighting genrals - 3TCs perhaps?

I think perhaps I'd go IC, TC, ally TC myself. Can you get 2 Sarmatian, 2 Lf, 3Wb, 3 falxmen for 650?

[petedalby]

Not an an army I've ever used and lots of good advice so far.

For my money I'd take 3 x TC + the Ally TC.

The Sarmatian BG is an excellent reserve fire brigade or assault unit so I'd take that. And having 2 could work but as soon as you commit the general to combat the other BG might struggle.
2 x 8 Falxmen + 1 x 6 Falxmen - to possibly act as rear support if required
2 x 12 Warriors
1 x 6 MF Archers to provide rear support for the 2 blocks of Warriors
1 x LH to delay a flank
1 x Basternae Cav - a versatile BG that can provide rear support, skirmish or combine with the lancers
1 x 6 LF Jav - because there's a few points left

646 AP - 10 BGs

2 TCs can push the Falxmen & Warriors forward. The 3rd gives flexibility to the LH or Cav. The Ally drives the Sarmatians. All can be committed to combat if so desired.

But I'm sure there are loads of other good combinations as well.

Have fun with it.

[helot2000]

THANKS!!!! You can't imagine how helpful this is. I painted a BUNCH of archers and now I know I should base them up as MF for rear support to units in 12. Brilliant!

I'll try two lists, one with a Samaritan ally and one without. I'll run MF units of at least 8 bases. I'll try 4 generals to start. Oh, and when I get photos, I'll post up my Dacians in the modelling thread. I'm quite happy with the quality of the Old Glory figures. They' take paint well and I have an interesting idea for a Dacian camp. This is so helpful I have to say THANKS twice.

[IanB3406]

Taking the Sarmation as 1x6 lancers gives this unit some good power.....not sure what you would drop for that.

[petedalby]

THANKS!!!! You can't imagine how helpful this is. I painted a BUNCH of archers and now I know I should base them up as MF for rear support to units in 12. Brilliant!

Keep your options open though. I don't think I've ever got an army list right first time. It usually takes 4 to 5 games and tweaking the list each time before I get to the right balance.

Taking the Sarmation as 1x6 lancers gives this unit some good power.....not sure what you would drop for that

I've never seen this tried - and you are tying up a lot of points. I suspect if 4 bases aren't enough, 6 won't be either. But you never know.