Loss of Dice at Impact

[bddbrown]

We had a situation the other night where a BG of MF LB were on a steep hill and were charged. At Impact they had 6 impact melee dice needing 4s and 2 overhead impact shooting dice (a base was missing) needing 5s. As a steep hill is difficult they are disordered and lose one third of the dice.

Question is how are the lost dice removed?
a) Owning player chooses and would therefore get rid of both shooting dice -> 6x4s.
b) Apportioned in ratio of the bases whilst still losing at least one and keeping at least one from each "bucket" -> 5x4s and 1x5s.
c) As the rules say lost dice apply to basing "fighting" and shooting is not technically "fighting" all the losses come from the Impact Melee dice -> 4x4s and 2x5s.

I went for b) but my opponent went for c).

Thanks.

[rbodleyscott]

b)

 Similarly, if fighting at different POAs against parts of the same enemy battle group, apportion lost dice, if possible, in proportion to the number of bases fighting each part of the enemy battle group, leaving at least 1 dice (if possible) against each part of the enemy battle group.

Note also that shooting in the impact phase does count as close combat, it just uses shooting factors.

Hits count towards the total hits inflicted in the impact phase combat, and are treated as normal close combat hits.

So (c) would be a pretty far-fetched interpretation. If shooting isn't fighting then modern armies don't fight at all.

[shall]

Excellent you ask for 1 FAQ and I think you might create 2!! Bravo

A good theoretical question (that leads to another) ... however... I don't think you can shoot from the 2nd rank on a steep hill - see terrain glossary. I think our intent would be that you cannot support shoot if you couldn't normally shoot - and I know the legal question would be is support shooting Shooting or Impact. Imagine it in a forest. Probably needto FAQ that then.

To the other question

Definitely not (a) - such wide open choice is notpart of the philosophy - mroe limited choice maybe.

The principles are on page 94 and apply to both shooting and combat (fighting being either in the way we've worded it)

So last bullet on fighting with different POAs apply. First dice comes from the 4 as the majority. That deals with 3 of their dice under the 1 per 3 rule. We are now left with 1 front rank dice and 2 rear ones so the second drops from the rear. Thus (b) and no choice about it.

Si

[bddbrown]

Thanks RBS and Simon for quick answers as ever. Much appreciated.

Excellent you ask for 1 FAQ and I think you might create 2!! Bravo

A good theoretical question (that leads to another) ... however... I don't think you can shoot from the 2nd rank on a steep hill - see terrain glossary.

Whoops. Not at all obvious. We did the right thing with a similar situation in a forest, but why would you not be able to shoot from the second rank of a steep hill? Not saying it is not in the rules, it is just not obvious why this would be the desire of the rules to effect.

[rbodleyscott]

Thanks RBS and Simon for quick answers as ever. Much appreciated.

Excellent you ask for 1 FAQ and I think you might create 2!! Bravo

A good theoretical question (that leads to another) ... however... I don't think you can shoot from the 2nd rank on a steep hill - see terrain glossary.

Whoops. Not at all obvious. We did the right thing with a similar situation in a forest, but why would you not be able to shoot from the second rank of a steep hill? Not saying it is not in the rules, it is just not obvious why this would be the desire of the rules to effect.

Is it in the rules? I don't remember it either. Don't have rules to hand atm.

[pbrandon]

Appendix 2:

Steep hill - no reference to 2nd rank not being able to shoot. In fact it says that troops on a steep hill can "shoot over troops below them".

Forest - "Troops inside can only shoot in 1 rank".

Paul

[shall]

Double whoops

Misread the line of the terrain table thank you Paul !! Doh


Ok you just get 1 FAQ for 1 Question

Si