Formations?

[spedius01]

Ave

We currently have the option of five formations, three at the basic level and two at an advanced level through promotions. The five formations are:

1. Balanced = Line (The front is wider than the depth)
2. Defensive = Line (The front is wider than the depth)
3. Offensive = Column (The front is narrower than the depth)
4. Wedge = Offensive
5. Square = Defensive

You'll notice that when you push one of the formation buttons on the deployment screen the squad's shape will alter to conform with the instruction. This is called "changing formation but not direction".
If you keep your eyes on your squads as they march across the battleground you will note that they will be forced to alter their course in order to meet what they consider to be a threat. This is called "changing direction but not formation".

Those are two of the basic drill movements. Others are left, right or about turn. Left or right turn are called "changing direction and formation" ie changing from line to column. About turn is called "changing direction but not formation" ie. moving from North to South, about turn means you reverse your course.
Left or right wheel is called "changing direction but not formation" it is normally performed whilst in column.
Form squad at the halt, is performed to change from column to line, this is called "changing formation and direction".
These are all drills used by the Brigade of Guards at the Trooping of the Colour, and are practiced by them on a daily basis.

Do I hear you ask, that's all very interesting, but what's it got to do with Legion Arena and the Romans?

The Romans were a very well organised and adaptable people. Their army reflects that attitude. It had evolved from a very basic, primitive army with simple weapons to the most professional and accomplished army of their period.
They fought in formations, they fought behind shield walls, bash your enemy with the shield and thrust your sword into his guts. These were the basic principles a legionary was taught in basic training. They fought in the shield wall for fifteen minutes, they were relieved by the rank behind with a series of drill movements to place fresh troops in the fighting line. Your vulnerable right side was covered by the shield of your comrade fighting on your right and his by his comrade etc. They, like the Guards, practiced all manner of drill movements sometimes to voice commands sometimes to the sound of a horn. I appreciate that in attempting to simulate some of the above is difficult, but not impossible.

The main points of all the above is to illustrate that, perhaps, we need some more formation choices.

I look forward to reading your thoughts on this topic.

Vale

M. Spedius Corbulo

[venividivici]

Must admit that so far with single player I have rarely needed anything other than putting my squads on Charge/Offensive. In the Roman campaign there were only two scenarios where I had to use a defensive stance due to overwhelming numbers, predominantly of enemy heavy cavalry. In the Celtic campaign on Hard I used Charge/Offensive on every single mission and never had problem. Unless playing Very Hard requires a significant alteration to my tactics I will be playing on Charge/Offensive at that level too. Given that I can win 99% of scenarios with just one formation type and tactic the single player game seems a bit lacking at the moment and I don't see the need for new formation types when we don't need to use half of those already supplied in the game. Perhaps things are different playing multiplayer opponents ??

[sum1won]

They are. The computer is non reactive- a multiplayer opponent is. As a result, lining up and chargeing may allow your opponent to control the battlefield more than you would like. However, I do think that offensive is an excellent formation if the enemy does not have many missle troops.

[venividivici]

The computer is non reactive.

Definately ! Seems like they just sit there and let me crunch into them every time. Even skirmishers/archers are no problem if you have upgraded heavy cav or heavy inf. The AI is extremely weak in this game imho compared with RTW

[sum1won]

Well, you have to remember that this was originally intended as an online game, and it is rather hard to penetrate these formations at higher difficulty levels.

[pipfromslitherine]

It was also somewhat of a conscious choice to allow people to better compare and contrast different tactics against a constant opponent. Some of you guys who are tactic genii may well find them a little too easy, but I imagine us mortals find it plenty tricky!

Cheers

Pip

[sacredzero]

My biggest moan about squad movements is the fact that horses always move faster or slower than foot men. This means it is difficult to get them all to hit at the same time. Linking squads so they move together would be good, or just a way to slow horses to walking pace. Even putting horses on slow advance and men on fast means the horses are slower than the men. More formations aren't really need i don't think, although being able to merge 2 (or more) groups into one formation would be good (aka long lines of infantry)

[venividivici]

My biggest moan about squad movements is the fact that horses always move faster or slower than foot men.

Very good thing to raise as this is one of the things that has bugged me most also. Using the Envelop or Outflank commands the cavalry seem to automatically go onto a slow advance by which time my infantry have often engaged the front line of the enemy and need help from a side/rear attack on the engaged enemy units. I often have to waste order points bringing the cav in early to support the infantry. We need something like an Advance Together or Keep Pace with Infantry order so that we can initially move them up in line then route the cav round the sides/rear.

[fatetriarrii]

Well, I have only played the demo, but in my experience, more formations would be a little redundent. BUT, the ability to turn the formations in the set-up screen would be helpfull. And as for flanking with cavalry, I just order them to charge down a series of waypoints.

[venividivici]

I have often used the waypoint option to give the cav more direction, but I find if they pass close to an enemy unit I am trying to bypass, usually because the enemy unit has turned toward them at some distance away, they will break off from my waypoint course and engage the nearest enemy. Getting the cav to do what you actually want is a nightmare, but then I suppose even the ancient commanders had this trouble

[spedius01]

Ave venividivici, sum1wun, pip, sacredzero and fatetriarrii,

Thanx for your input guys, it's most appreciated.

It would appear I've stirred up a hornet's nest, some very opposite points of view!

A lot depends on what you expect from a game and what you would like to see, if it were possible, improved upon. In my humble opinion some additional formations could be beneficial to the game. Intitially troops always face North if Roman and South if the enemy. Agreed, during the battle they do change their aspects if faced with hostility from another direction. What if you wanted to try some revolutionary new tactic, would the game permit this? Didn't someone once say something like "Experimentation is the mother of all invention"? That's what this game is all about, trying out new ideas!

Vale

M. Spedius Corbulo