evaders & assualts

[pugsville]

rules page 30
'if a unit retiring or evading from an assault is contacted by the enemy it automatically drops a cohesion level , regardless of facing and retires an additional 4 mu retaining it's original facing"

do the assaulters stop at this first contact with evaders? or do they move further if they have movement remaining? can they contact evaders again? do they ever actually fight evaders?

do targets beyond the initial evaders get charge responses? form square? counter charge or evade?

do irregular lc or skirmishers contact non normal targets revealed? (they charge a target in rear or skirmishers who evade/route away leaving a normally forbidden target (foot chargers skirmishers who evade revealing cavalry etc)) do they charge this revealed target or stop?

[pugsville]

furthermore do evaders automatically face the direction they evade in?

DO they drop an additional level for being contacted in flank /rear ? (they drop one if caught while evading but is there an additional for being contacted in the rear? are they really contacted as no combat results?)

[deadtorius]

Hope fully I remember some of this correctly. You declare charge, and if they can your target makes an evade move. If you can contact the evaders you move to contact and end your move there. If you can't contact your initial target you may instead target a new unit within 2 Mu of your original charge path. This new target makes any evades or cohesion tests as if it was the original target. The new target has the normal charge restrictions applied to it.
If your initial target evades beyond your charge range and you do not or can not contact a new target you make a full charge move towards your original target and stop there.
So no you don't get to fight evaders but you force their cohesion down and drive them further back.

Evaders end facing the direction of the evade. If you catch them in the rear I don't think they get a second drop.

[hazelbark]

furthermore do evaders automatically face the direction they evade in?

No it is per the normal retire rules as instructed in 1st sentence of Evade rules p31. which takes you to the last paragraph of p 63.

DO they drop an additional level for being contacted in flank /rear ? (they drop one if caught while evading but is there an additional for being contacted in the rear? are they really contacted as no combat results?)

I think this is governed by p33. However I could it see it being unclear. I believe the 1st bullet is the operative question of where was the unit before it evaded/retired. So if you had a flank charge before the evade/retire then you still do. If not you don't.

[hazelbark]

rules page 30
'if a unit retiring or evading from an assault is contacted by the enemy it automatically drops a cohesion level , regardless of facing and retires an additional 4 mu retaining it's original facing"

do the assaulters stop at this first contact with evaders? or do they move further if they have movement remaining? can they contact evaders again? do they ever actually fight evaders?

Good question. I don't think it is explicit. TERRY? I could see my answer being wrong, but I believe the answers are: yes stop at contact; No they don't keep moving; therefore no; no that it is represented by the loss of level and 4 MU shuffle. The problem here of course is skirmishing infantry can hold up cavalry I would have expected to ride them down.

do targets beyond the initial evaders get charge responses? form square? counter charge or evade?

p 31 right column, 1st line end sentence beginning "if a new..."
YES
Note remaining sentences discuss pursuit move. This is an assault move so ignore those.

do irregular lc or skirmishers contact non normal targets revealed? (they charge a target in rear or skirmishers who evade/route away leaving a normally forbidden target (foot chargers skirmishers who evade revealing cavalry etc)) do they charge this revealed target or stop?

They would normally stop as they cannot charge targets they cannot charge. If they could charge with a CMT and have the CP then they can try.

[hazelbark]

Bump for Terry

[terrys]

An evading unit retires using the centre column of the 'outcome moves' table nad face in the direction moved if their move is at least equal to thier normal move distance.
If the enemy would still contact them, they drop a level of cohesion and retire a further 4mu. If the enemy still contacts them, they turn and fight them in this position.

The problem here of course is skirmishing infantry can hold up cavalry I would have expected to ride them down.

Well they've already moved somewhere between 7 and 12 inches, and will fight the cavlary at least disordered. They would then be hitting on 5's with the cavalry on 3's
I don't think that 'holding up'' cavalry is much of a risk.

They would normally stop as they cannot charge targets they cannot charge. If they could charge with a CMT and have the CP then they can try.

At the moment the rule states "if this new target can be reached as part of a normal assault move ....."
as above, In order to reach the target, the LH would need to pass a CMT....which they can try to do.
Currently they will stop 1Mu away from the enemy (which is not entirely satisfactory).

[hazelbark]

The problem here of course is skirmishing infantry can hold up cavalry I would have expected to ride them down.

Well they've already moved somewhere between 7 and 12 inches, and will fight the cavlary at least disordered. They would then be hitting on 5's with the cavalry on 3's
I don't think that 'holding up'' cavalry is much of a risk.

I was refering to "if they could not fight them if they catch them a 2nd time and do not fight." Yes this way as you write is clear the cav should be fine.

[pugsville]

Just to be clear, if the chargers catch teh evaders after the additional 4 mu to evade they fight

Is there ANY additional cohesion loss for being caught?
Do they lose an Additional cohesion loss if caught facing the wrong way?

[terrys]

Is there ANY additional cohesion loss for being caught?
Do they lose an Additional cohesion loss if caught facing the wrong way?

I don't think it's possible for them to get caught facing the wrong way.
The rule says that for the 2nd 4MU retire they retain their original facing.
The only way they can be facing backwards is if they retired 6MU during the initial evade - which means that with the extra 4MU they would have moved 10MU in total, which would take them out of range of even light cavalry.

[pugsville]

hmm I think I can theoretically construct an example.

Light Infantry evade 6MU (thus face the away at the end of the evade?) from light cavalry starting 2 MU away, then get caught drop a level and evade a further 4MU but are stopped by terrain, enemies, edge of the board, friends they cant get halfway through. They are caught by light cavalry , they fight dropping a further level? WIth the modifier for being hit in rear.

Brings me to the case a unit evades but stops short of some terrain feature, they are caught, drop a level but are unable to evade further (say due ti impassable terrain or board edge) they fight as normal (though disadvantage by being in skirmish formation)

[terrys]

Light Infantry evade 6MU (thus face the away at the end of the evade?) from light cavalry starting 2 MU away, then get caught drop a level and evade a further 4MU but are stopped by terrain, enemies, edge of the board, friends they cant get halfway through. They are caught by light cavalry , they fight dropping a further level? WIth the modifier for being hit in rear.

To count as contacting a flank or rear a unit must start its charge from a flank or rear position (various bullet points on page 33).
Therefore, unless the skirmishers were facing away from the chargers before they started moving, it does not qualify as a flank or rear charge.
The only way an evading unit can drop 2 levels of cohesion is if the above conditions were fulfilled, AND the skirmishers were facing away from the enemy at the start of the charge.
If your left your skirmishers in that position then you deserve to drop 2 levels.