Grand Campaign Unit Revisions - Update for GC42-43West

[4kEY]

Escape from Stalingrad: All these little Soviet tanks, now recon units with excellent spotting, seem to make the Red Air Force that much more effective. DV Turn 16. I had originally intended to go straight for the impassable section of the Donets in the southwest area of the map, but I got sidetracked quite a few times.

Forgot to enter reform units last scenario. I thought I did during deployment..maybe it needs to be done once the first turn begins. A couple great units gone for good.

I've seriously considered removing the modded direct fire modes for flak (not including the 88), but I think I will try changing the movement to 0 for towed, and 1 for the half-track/flakpanzers. Should the initiative in direct fire mode be the same as the initiative in flak mode? It seems like it's too much.

FW 190 feels like a really powerful aircraft, even at 150/200 experience. Sturmhaubitze has proven extremely useful against soft targets.

Tatsinkaya: It’s more difficult now to form a solid defense against both ground and air attacks. Before, I would gather 4 pieces around an AA and I was good. Now, I NEED artillery support to keep from getting smashed by armor, but this means HAVING to use fighter cover – which leaves them open to highly effective SPAAG. Before, my overstrength Panzers were pretty much omnipotent. This doesn't seem to be the case here.

This scenario was tough. I opted to remain on the defense and it paid off twice. The second and third wave would have hurt a whole lot more than they did. MV Turn 22.

[deducter]

Updated to v1.91 new version with many changes:

1. 7.5 cm FK 16 nA range increased to 3, cost increased slightly to compensate.
2. Various adjustments of German artillery costs, most notably that towed rocket launchers, Grille, Wespe, and Hummel costs are reduced.
3. German SPAAG costs significantly reduced.
4. 3.7 cm FlaK and 12.8 cm FlaK AA slightly reduced
5. Bofors 40 mm AA attack increased.
6. Standardization of the IN and ground attack values of all AA for all nations. Mostly cosmetic in nature and not likely to impact gameplay significantly.
7. Standardization of the effects of Schurzen. In general the effect is + 2 CD, although the Hetzer has a weaker Schurzen and hence only + 1 CD.
8. In general Schurzen is harmonized with unit graphics where possible. The exception is the Panzer IIIM.
9. Panzer IVG and Panzer IVH costs increased in 1943, but unadjusted for 1944-1945.
10. Panzer IIIM GD lowered to 13. Nevertheless, an experienced crew in 1943 can still perform well against T-34s due to its high INI and decent HA.
11. Panzer IIIN CD increased to 6 in 1942 and 8 in 1943. This tank is now highly resistant to infantry attacks in close terrain.
12. StuG IIIG, JagdPanzer IV, and Hetzer GD increased by 1 due to their low profile.
13. StuG IIIG and JagdPanther are given spotting = 2 to faciliate their roles as tank killers.
14. StuG IIIG IN + 1 to 7. This means that on the defense against tanks in clear terrain, it will benefit fully from experience. Cost increased slightly to compensate.
15. Hetzer cost significantly reduced. This unit is now truly a diposable tank destroyer.
16. Marder series HA increased but GD lowered.
17. Cost adjustment of various German tank destroyers.
18. German soft recon units GD increased in 1943.
19. All combat engineers have + 2 CD compared with basic infantry. These units are meant to be true urban warfare specialists. In particular, starting in 1943 combat engineers garrisoning many of the AI-held VH are incredibly difficult to root out.
20. Minor adjustments to Soviet infantry.
21. StuG IV HA reduced in ART mode.
22. Nashorn defense boost in 1944-1945 removed. This unit relies on its high IN and HA to survive. It is very vulnerable to air attacks. Note that this unit is mostly useful on the Eastern Front, since the Western Allies have a more significant air presence.
23. P-51 and P-47 AA increased, P-47 SA and HA increased.
24. Soviet late war fighters improved slightly. La-7 now has the highest AA, while the Yak-3 and Yak-9U have the highest IN and AD. All three models are extremely dangerous and durable.
25. Many late war Soviet fighters GD improved. They are harder to shoot down with FlaK now, so targetting Soviet bombers to force them to withdraw might be a better use of FlaK.
26. German fighters AD boost in 1944 removed.
27. German fighter costs in late war slightly adjusted.
28. Russian TAC made much more vulnerable to FlaK.
29. Nopurchase flag added to Churchill tanks.

I've temporarily removed the manual since it was out of date and my revision is taking a very long time.

[Uhu]

Deducter,

I made the modifications for the Stalingrad scenarios to have a historical presence of the aux units.
Instead of Hungarian and Italian units the player have now Romanian units which where fighting in the Stalingrad area. I don't know how far this effects scn balance but I don't think too much. Briefings, efx, equipment files were modified and icons for Romanian units added. Are you interested to add this modifications to your mod? Than I can send you.

[deducter]

Deducter,

I made the modifications for the Stalingrad scenarios to have a historical presence of the aux units.
Instead of Hungarian and Italian units the player have now Romanian units which where fighting in the Stalingrad area. I don't know how far this effects scn balance but I don't think too much. Briefings, efx, equipment files were modified and icons for Romanian units added. Are you interested to add this modifications to your mod? Than I can send you.

I don't intend to include anything like this for this mod, at least for now. You can release it on your own if you'd like. One day though, I might be interested in doing some revisions for the entire Grand Campaign.

[Uhu]

Deducter,

I made the modifications for the Stalingrad scenarios to have a historical presence of the aux units.
Instead of Hungarian and Italian units the player have now Romanian units which where fighting in the Stalingrad area. I don't know how far this effects scn balance but I don't think too much. Briefings, efx, equipment files were modified and icons for Romanian units added. Are you interested to add this modifications to your mod? Than I can send you.

I don't intend to include anything like this for this mod, at least for now. You can release it on your own if you'd like. One day though, I might be interested in doing some revisions for the entire Grand Campaign.

OK, if anybody is interested here is the download for this mod (putting Romanian units instead of Italian/Hungarian units in the Stalingrad '42 scenarios to be more historical):
http://rapidshare.com/files/1387682582/GC42.ZIP
Install with JSGME just after the Deducter's mod.

[borsook79]

1.91 link doesn't work for me, doesn't gamersfront block some countries? Could anyone upload it somewhere else please?

[bebro]

"some countries" - that's quite an understatement...

[borsook79]

"some countries" - that's quite an understatement...

well, anyway there are so many places that work without such limits, not to mention dropbox, ubuntu one etc... so does anyone have it and could share it?

[orlinos]

"some countries" - that's quite an understatement...

well, anyway there are so many places that work without such limits, not to mention dropbox, ubuntu one etc... so does anyone have it and could share it?

There is another link on the Matrix Forum:
http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3159181

[borsook79]

"some countries" - that's quite an understatement...

well, anyway there are so many places that work without such limits, not to mention dropbox, ubuntu one etc... so does anyone have it and could share it?

There is another link on the Matrix Forum:
http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3159181

thanks!

[deducter]

I didn't realize there were issues with gamefront for some players, I'll add a link to the matrix forum post.

[orlinos]

Updated to v1.91 new version with many changes:

1. 7.5 cm FK 16 nA range increased to 3, cost increased slightly to compensate.

Why the change? I understand the historical reasons (I guess the same as with the Russian equivalent?) but it will change the gameplay quite a bit, leaving only mobile artillery with range smaller than 3. Is it to make it more useful and so used more often?

2. Various adjustments of German artillery costs, most notably that towed rocket launchers, Grille, Wespe, and Hummel costs are reduced.

Again, why? Although I do not protest, I always have trouble when saving money to buy the first Wurfrahmen unit.

11. Panzer IIIN CD increased to 6 in 1942 and 8 in 1943. This tank is now highly resistant to infantry attacks in close terrain.

I hope it won’t make this tank too useful during the later defense scenarios (when the Russians can heavily wound even the best of infantry with repeated artillery attacks – they won’t be able to do the same suppression to Panzer IIIN).

12. StuG IIIG, JagdPanzer IV, and Hetzer GD increased by 1 due to their low profile.
[…]14. StuG IIIG IN + 1 to 7. This means that on the defense against tanks in clear terrain, it will benefit fully from experience. Cost increased slightly to compensate.

Go, go, little StuG’s!

16. Marder series HA increased but GD lowered.

I guess it will make them a kind of an early Nashorn? Capable of dishing high damage but very fragile?

19. All combat engineers have + 2 CD compared with basic infantry. These units are meant to be true urban warfare specialists. In particular, starting in 1943 combat engineers garrisoning many of the AI-held VH are incredibly difficult to root out.

Interesting. It might also make them more deadly in the early war, when I generally had problems with Pioniers earning experience too slowly. (Because they got damaged heavily when fighting non-suppressed enemies, and earned very little experience when fighting fully-suppressed ones). More often I preferred to use Grenadiers, except for the most heavily entrenched enemies.

22. Nashorn defense boost in 1944-1945 removed. This unit relies on its high IN and HA to survive. It is very vulnerable to air attacks. Note that this unit is mostly useful on the Eastern Front, since the Western Allies have a more significant air presence.

I hope the lowered Ground Defense won’t make it too susceptible to infantry and artillery. I never use it to fight infantry directly, obviously, but Nashorn usually is punished in bloody revenge by Russian infantry immediately after it kills a tank. I move it out of the way, but that takes at least a turn.

(Obviously, I also always protect with high-strength, high-SA mobile artillery; it doesn’t need anti-tank protection).

25. Many late war Soviet fighters GD improved. They are harder to shoot down with FlaK now, so targetting Soviet bombers to force them to withdraw might be a better use of FlaK.
26. German fighters AD boost in 1944 removed.

Ouch. Air war is going to be even worse…

28. Russian TAC made much more vulnerable to FlaK.

…but these damn Sturmovik will pay for it.

I've temporarily removed the manual since it was out of date and my revision is taking a very long time.

Can’t wait to read it!

[monkspider]

I don't think I agree with the Nashhorn change. It was already very vulnerable to various attacks but I took one with me to the nearly the end of 1945 on my last play through and I thought it was pretty well balanced with the improved defense. It was vulnerable but still useful due to it's reasonable cost.

[deducter]

Hmm, I did not expect that players would not like the Nashorn changes. I always use the Nashorn in a reserve role rather than a frontline role. Once I weakened the Soviet air force and determined the Soviet force composition, I'll send the Nashorn into a sector where there's no infantry to deal with tanks. And if I have to send it into battle near infantry, I always back it up with a StuH 42 to protect it. I guess it's because of the way I employ it so that it rarely ever takes damage.



Admittedly mine does have a +3D hero, which surely helps quite a bit, but I played through most of 1944 with the Nashorn at 8 GD and 8 AD and I was never in danger of losing the unit. That's because I rarely allowed the AI to attack the unit in the first place.

I suppose I could give back the defense boost back in the next iteration...

Historically the 7.5 cm artillery had a slightly better range than the 10.5 cm artillery. So I have no problem with giving it a range of 3, so this unit might see use for quite some time. However, its firepower is severely lacking by 1943 (historically it was lacking even at the start of the war).

Wurfrahmen is meant as a "prestige" unit, like the Tiger Tank, Me 262, etc. It's a very, very powerful weapon, but it has its drawbacks, and you'd be better off resource-wise to use other artillery. The towed rocket artillery are actually quite good if employed correctly. The final version, even if not overstrength can usually knock 4-5 points off a Russian Guards 43.

[orlinos]

Finished Minsk in ’44. What a grinder. The attached screenshot presents most of my forces at the end of the scenario. The Panther in the North used to have 14 strength (and would almost never lose more than 1-2 points, since it’s my “super-unit”).



Still, it should be happy, it’s southern brother was reduced to one. (A stupid mistake, I left it understrength and close to 2 crappy AT units). The brother of the visible Tiger got reduced to 4 and decided to have a drink in the city. I do not know how I managed to kill the IS tanks, I just kept pounding at them, using all available mass attacks, air bombardment etc. Wish they were stupid enough to ride into a forest.

I didn’t manage to take the final town in the North (so I shouldn’t have triggered these tanks…) and I let the Russians spam tons of units in the town in the South. So only an MV, like most of the scenarios in ’44, but a bit too bloody. I’m afraid of Vilna a lot.

The latest mod changes will work starting from Vilna, so I’ll report on them. I hope my beloved Nashorn will still be alive and kicking.

EDIT: Lately, I’ve seen people giving advice on how to get through Spoils of War on vanilla – using lots of artillery, numerous tanks, Sturmpanzers etc. It got me thinking, how would I go through it, without the mod changes – meaning no experience boosts for infantry, no special recon units etc.?

I loaded up an old save from Warsaw, temporarily removed the mod – and played the scenario. Since originally, during the mod playthrough, I forgot to buy a 38(t) tank (it just didn’t seem that necessary, with Panzer II doing well enough), I decided to do the same this time – I left 2 Pz I’s at home for now, took a Panzer II, lots of infantry and utilized auxilliary Panzerjagers to the max.

A piece of cake. I saw Russian fighters dying in one turn and not really doing any damage, my infantry throwing poor Soviet tanks left and right, KV tank getting whooped etc. It reminded me how much I learned since my first baby steps.

[4kEY]

'43 East has been awesome. MV at Orel. This time I had to retreat from an retake the southern railstations. DV at Ponyri on final turn. That one really felt like Kursk. I'm playing on Rommel, started with around 43,000 prestige. Now I have about 26,000. I think I'm developing a fear response to armored counterattacks.

The army Panzer IIIN has more soft attack than the SS version. Is it supposed to be the other way around?

Edit: Green replacements are definitely a viable option - not always, but often enough to make a difference.

[monkspider]

Hey Deducter,

I had a suggestion come to mind. What do you think about making the Ta-152 part of the FW-190 family? It comes late enough that it isn't really worthwhile taking the experience penalty to update and historically it was based on the FW-190.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Focke-Wulf ... evelopment

[deducter]

'43 East has been awesome. MV at Orel. This time I had to retreat from an retake the southern railstations. DV at Ponyri on final turn. That one really felt like Kursk. I'm playing on Rommel, started with around 43,000 prestige. Now I have about 26,000. I think I'm developing a fear response to armored counterattacks.

The army Panzer IIIN has more soft attack than the SS version. Is it supposed to be the other way around?

Edit: Green replacements are definitely a viable option - not always, but often enough to make a difference.

There were several smaller changes I made, including upping the SA of the Panzer IIIN to 10, the SE version should have 11. If this is not the case, it's a mistake that I'll go check and correct it.

Hey Deducter,

I had a suggestion come to mind. What do you think about making the Ta-152 part of the FW-190 family? It comes late enough that it isn't really worthwhile taking the experience penalty to update and historically it was based on the FW-190.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Focke-Wulf ... evelopment

I'm aware of this, but my inclination is not to make useful the weapons that were barely deployed. The upgrade is substantial, so you'll most certainly do so in time for Berlin. If more players like this, then I might change my mind.

[monkspider]

I guess my thinking on it during my first playthrough was that it becomes available around the same time as the ME-262 (actually, it might become available even after the ME-262, I can't remember for sure). My thinking is that I would be better either sticking with my current units and their experience or, if I was going to upgrade them, to upgrade them to the ME-262. Of course, prestige in this period of the war is extremely tight so if I am going to do an upgrade a unit, it has to be extremely worthwhile.

I do understand and respect your decision to limit the availability of historically scarce units however. One possibility would be to reduce it's improvement over the FW-190 Dora (maybe something like higher attack but slightly less defense and less ammo/fuel than the Dora?) and then give it the "Sturmpanzer" treatment where it is only available for one or two scenarios. This might give it a more viable niche, gameplay-wise.

[4kEY]

How about renaming the Brummbar to Sturmpanzer 43, or Stupa? I guess Brummbar was an Allied name, like calling the Soviet LL M4 a Sherman.