French Campaign Misery

[tonyUK]

Playing as Colonel with DLC content, Mostly DV's up to France, then
I struggle. On Sedan no matter where try and attack there are simply too
many enemy units. Worse still later on I capture French general and around
a dozen French units appear out of nowhere and I fail. Where do they get all
the Prestige from I cannot imagine.

I am upgrading my units wenever possible, but my prestige is always low
and Limited number of slots cpmpared to the enemy that always has double
the amount of units. As fast as I kill them more reappear.

They must be something I am missing as the best I get in France is MV
though I did get a DV with the Belgium Forts. Is there a strategy guide
compatible with the DLC's?.

[Vaughn]

Some scenarios are harder than others to get DVs on. It has been many months since I played that scenario, but I remember I liked it.

I don't remember the objectives to get for a DV, but I say as long as your core losses are reasonable, take the MV and move on. It is a long war, and there are plenty of opportunities for DVs later.

I seem to remember that few people were happy with the instant spawning of so many French troops. The idea is to get the dude, have your core units clear a path for him to the evacuation zones, use a fighting withdraw and get him there fast before you take tons of losses.

[fliegenderstaub]

I have played France as Colonel (Oberst) a few times.

It is possible - and not that difficult - to achieve a DV in Sedan. The problem is the french armor and the mass attack from the south. Force the armor into rough terrain, if possible. Attack them with Bombers. I prefer strategic bombers for they reduce enemys ammo. A unit out of ammo can't attack! Position your infantry on rough terrain if possible and back your lines with artillery. As always artillery is most important. I usually have 25% of my core artillery. One or two "AchtAcht" 8,8 cm Flak might come in handy...

There are some good "Panzer Corps" videos on youtube. Deducter for example, who uses his own - even more difficult - mod, has recorded some scenarios. Sedan is this one: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XnKWfJvSea0

After capturing the french officers in another scenario the trouble begins indeed. But that looks worse than it is. Protect your flanks. As far as I remember you don't need a lot of units. I usually battle the British, but had the french once or twice. If things go worse, remember where the enemies appear and restart the scenario.

Could you post your core? Maybe there are some points to improve...

Hope this will help you a bit.

[shawkhan]

The Fench units do not spawn until you capture the general.
Lay out your defenses at bridge crossings and other choke points before you capture that crucial city.
Then escort the general back and withdraw your defenses as you go.
I think it only takes 3-4 turns to get him to the capture zone to win.

[tonyUK]

I notice from the Sedan video he does not reinforce his units a lot, which I tend to do
with standard replacements during the game. Maybe I should only do this at next game start
as these then cost nothing, and then use elite to overstrength them. Using normal replacements
during the turn is watering down my experience. Good idea or not?

[orlinos]

Playing as Colonel with DLC content, Mostly DV's up to France, then
I struggle. On Sedan no matter where try and attack there are simply too
many enemy units. Worse still later on I capture French general and around
a dozen French units appear out of nowhere and I fail. Where do they get all
the Prestige from I cannot imagine.[...]

In Sedan, I usually try attacking from many directions. A Pioniere unit kills the fortification two the north of the city (but doesn't go near the city itself, until I eliminate the artillery). Fortifications have high spotting and I prefer to keep the AI blind to my actions.

When I defeat and capture the city, it triggers a large armor counterattack. It’s better to go on defense for some time. If you haven’t disbanded your AT unit, you might put it (or a Panzer IIIF or Panzerjäger) to help defend the city. If the AI tank tries to penetrate your defenses, bombard it with artillery or strategic bomber and push into the city and kill it with infantry. Or keep enemy tanks with place (they won’t like attacking your infantry in the city and AT will deal huge damage on defense) and bombard them to hell with Stukas.



At the same time, I usually defeat the south part of the map and get the captured Somua tank in Margut.



I cross the rivers using ferry docks - with tanks, mobile artillery and then infantry. I try to ferry as many as I can and land at the same time (tanks first). If all AI tanks are already fighting your infantry and AT at Sedan, they won’t be able to get back quickly and I will have enough time to capture the city and run to the last two objectives.

(Image are mock-ups, so sorry for bad quality).

I notice from the Sedan video he does not reinforce his units a lot, which I tend to do
with standard replacements during the game. Maybe I should only do this at next game start
as these then cost nothing, and then use elite to overstrength them. Using normal replacements
during the turn is watering down my experience. Good idea or not?

It is generally a good idea not to overuse normal replacements (unless you really need the unit in full health during the scenario). I also learned the hard way that it's important to decide which of your units are going to be super-elites - use their potential to its maximum by using elite replacements and overstrength - and which should develop slower or even be treated as fodder. That way you won't have to spend too much prestige on all units.

For example - on my latest playthrough I had great luck and got Initiative heroes on my Mountaneers and Grenadiers. I always keep overstrenght at maximum, since they can defeat anything in their way and even survive in close terrain with no artillery backup. Other infantry - I do not treat so well. I also treat well my AT units, because they are cheaper than tanks.

Panzerjäger is great when defending from the onslaught of bigger tanks - just keep a fighter over it, to defend it from air attacks. Also, Stukas, Stukas and Stukas. And some more Stukas along with strategic bombers to deplete fuel and ammo of the tanks.

[robman]

In general, in the DLC offensive campaigns, there comes at least one point in each scenario where it becomes imperative to go over to the defensive in the face of a massive counterattack. Sometimes this is just on a part of the front, sometimes across all of it. The capture-the-general scenario is nevertheless unusual. In that case, you really have to decide whether to play for a decisive or a marginal victory, because the strategies are very different. If playing for a decisive in that particular scenario, victory hexes are largely irrelevant.

[davedwmullins]

Any advice for getting a DV playing Stonne?

[robman]

Any advice for getting a DV playing Stonne?

Don't rush your way south. Be prepared for a massive counterattack. Keep your forward units close enough to one another so that they can easily fall back and mutually support one another, backed by artillery. When the counterattack comes, stay on the defensive until it begins to taper off, then go on the offensive again.

[brettz123]

Usually issues with DVs comes down to non-optimal CORE choices. You may want to post your CORE and let people critique it.

Sedan is pretty simple if you take 2 Pz-IVds and ferry them across the river from the north. This lets them destroy the two artillery pieces behind the city which makes it a lot easier to take out. At this point all you need to do is defend for a couple of turns with artillery behind your tanks and use that plus air power to destroy the counter attack.

[captainjack]

I had some problems with these French ones at first. Now I have some idea what to do with different troops, my recent experience has been better. The comments on knowing when to defend are sound - I have almost wiped out the entire French counter attacking force through a well placed defence backed by lots of artillery and a bit of luck. This meant I had plenty of time left to attack the remaining (and now poorly defended) objectives. For Sedan, working down to Margut for the Somau and crossing at the ports has mostly worked well for me. However, the first time I tried it I didn't send enough forces and they got wiped out, so I was left in a bit of a hole. I have mostly played at Colonel and been successful enough to have a go on General. As the AI appears to be more attacking minded in General this probably makes alternating attack and defence even more worthwhile.

[brettz123]

The big difference I have noticed with the Field Marshall is that the AI is more aggressive.

[tonyUK]

I could not breakthrough the Dunkirk defences, Arras they had too many tanks, and Lille was supposed
to be French Reservists on low morale did not turn out that way. In fact the only way I could get
a minor victory was to use the prestige cheat. My main problem is contantly having to resupply
or reinforce units,and running out of prestige.That and of course the French quantities are double my numbers available, so I must be doing something wrong. Maybe I should only reinforce at start of new scenario with elites.

[dragos]

Reinforce with elite replacements only between scenarios to save prestige. During scenario use regular or do not use replacements if you don't want to lose experience for some units.

Have plenty of artillery, at least two or three for each axis of attack. For 1940 campaign you should have at least 6 artillery to be deployed in each scenario. Advance slowly and try to have the forward units backed by artillery in case they are counterattacked. Also pair artillery so they can protect each other in case you fail to provide screening and they get under attack.

You are not supposed to breach Dunkirk defenses. It's possible but could be a waste of prestige to cover the losses in doing so. It's enough to occupy the surrounding towns.

[brettz123]

I could not breakthrough the Dunkirk defences, Arras they had too many tanks, and Lille was supposed
to be French Reservists on low morale did not turn out that way. In fact the only way I could get
a minor victory was to use the prestige cheat. My main problem is contantly having to resupply
or reinforce units,and running out of prestige.That and of course the French quantities are double my numbers available, so I must be doing something wrong. Maybe I should only reinforce at start of new scenario with elites.

In 1939 and 1940 I have 5 15 cm towed artillery, 1 captured 105mm Polish artillery piece, and 2 15 cm SiG self-propelled guns. You should be aiming to finish 1939 DLC with at least 3000 - 4000 prestige. If you cannot do that I would suggest lowering the difficulty until you are more comfortable with the game. In 1940 I already have 4 Me-109s, 4 Ju-87 Stuka, and 2 Me-110s.

You may want to post your CORE as that tends to be the issue people have. Artillery and airpower will minimize your losses.

I disagree with the post above only in that by 1940 you should have enough prestige to reinforce your units with elite reinforcements during scenarios.

[tonyUK]

I could not breakthrough the Dunkirk defences, Arras they had too many tanks, and Lille was supposed
to be French Reservists on low morale did not turn out that way. In fact the only way I could get
a minor victory was to use the prestige cheat. My main problem is contantly having to resupply
or reinforce units,and running out of prestige.That and of course the French quantities are double my numbers available, so I must be doing something wrong. Maybe I should only reinforce at start of new scenario with elites.

In 1939 and 1940 I have 5 15 cm towed artillery, 1 captured 105mm Polish artillery piece, and 2 15 cm SiG self-propelled guns. You should be aiming to finish 1939 DLC with at least 3000 - 4000 prestige. If you cannot do that I would suggest lowering the difficulty until you are more comfortable with the game. In 1940 I already have 4 Me-109s, 4 Ju-87 Stuka, and 2 Me-110s.

You may want to post your CORE as that tends to be the issue people have. Artillery and airpower will minimize your losses.

I disagree with the post above only in that by 1940 you should have enough prestige to reinforce your units with elite reinforcements during scenarios.

How do I upload file, I get a message saying the extension is not allowed.

[brettz123]

Not sure but you can just type out what you have:

For instance this is what I have on my latest playthrough at Reims:

Infantry
1 Fallschirmjaeger with halftrack
2 Pioniere with halftrack
1 Gebirgsjaeger with halftrack
1 SE Gebirgsjaeger with halftrack
1 SE Grenadier with halftrack


Armor
5 Pz-IVd
1 Captured Somusa S-35
1 Captured Char B1-bis
1 Captured Matilda II

Anti-Tank
1 Panzerjaeger

Anti-Aircraft
1 88mm towed by Sdkfz 7

Artillery
5 15cm towed by halftracks
1 Captured 105mm Polish towed by a truck
2 SiG 33 self propelled artillery

Fighters
4 Me-109e

Tactical Bombers
4 Ju-87b Stuka
2 Me-110

Strategic Bombers
2

This gives me 36 units (unless my math is wrong) and I beleive I could deploy 24 or 25 units at Reims so I have some flexibility here but counting the free SE unit deployment I still have to leave 8 units behind. I do this for a couple of reasons the first of which is flexibility is good and I like to have my entire CORE for the rest of the war purchased by the end of DLC 1940. So I am going to eventually have:

6 Infantry
17 tanks
6 towed artillery
5 self propelled (these will end up being 3 wurfrahmen and 2 StuG IIIb)
3 anti-tank units
1 anti-aircraft unit
6 fighters
6 tactical bombers (4 stuka and 2 Me-110s)
2 strategic bombers

So lets look at why I take what I take and I am going to focus on a couple of specific units here that I think are important to have and may be overlooked by new players.

Infantry - this is important in the early DLCs leading into DLC 1943 where they start to become less effecient but still useable. Everyone has their own preferences and mine is Pioniere and Gebirgsjaeger. Grenadiers and Fallschirmjeager are also very good. Fallschirmjeagers I tend to not like so much just because of the low ammo count and an inability to airdrop a 75mm cannon with them. I don't use air drops very much so it helps explain why I don't usually take more Fallschirmjaegers. Thoug it is a very effective strategy.

Tanks - the game is called Panzer Corps for a reason! Tanks are a necessity. I only buy Pz-IVs because it is the most effective use of prestige to upgrade. The Panzer III is a prestige dead end that I would not suggest. There are 2 exceptions to this rule are the Pz-IIIn and the Pz-II flamm. Neither is particularly effective BUT they are very good at specific things. The Pz-IIIn has a high close defense (4 I think) and is good for fighting in close terrain like Stalingrad (hint hint). The soft attack is good so the Pz-IIIn is pretty good at taking out infantry. The Pz-II flamm is also just brutal when it comes to attacking any kind of soft target. It also has the added benefit of gaining experience REALLY fast. There are a couple of other units I will highlight later on that also seem to gain experience faster than other units.

Artillery - This is one of your best force multipliers. I tend to stick with 15cm and not go higher. This really comes down to taste and you might want to consider going from 15cm to 17cm as the war goes on because they do more damage / suppression to some of the Russian heavy tanks. I love my self-propelled wurfrahmen they just brutalize soft targets and if you get any Range +1 heroes they are really going to be useful. The one unit I want to highlight here is the StuG IIIb which I feel outperforms its statistics. It is also a unit that gains experience fast. The benefit here is that it is highly armored and can be used to directly support armor and even take it to early Russian Tanks.

Anti-Tank - I use 3 of these starting with the one I start with and then buying 2 more PanzerJaegers during the 40 DLC. I find them fairly poor until you get access to the StuGs. Not a huge fan of the Marders either BUT these come into their own when you get access to the Elefant. I would suggest using 1 or 2 every once in a while to try and get at least 300 experience on all 3 by the time you upgrade them to Elefants. Big difference in performance between an rookie Elefant and even a 3 star one.

Anti-Aircraft - I only ever use a single 88mm throughout all the DLC. I find them a little hard to use and mostly unneccessary if you have a large enough air force. The upside is that during the early war it is about the only thing aside from Stukas that can put a complete pounding on the heavier allied tanks. If you can get a Movement +1 hero you will like this unit even more but that is up to randomness (or you reloading until you get one). The other benefit is obviously that it is dual purpose and if you ever get a Spitfire into range you will appreciate having one on your side. The big downsides are the limited ability to move and attack (though this can be mitigated through proper planning it can never be truly overcome) and the high cost of replacements.

Fighters - These are some of your best friends. I like having 6 of these guys purchased by the end of DLC 40 and this is the core of my air force. When you eventually get the Fw-190a you will even be able to use them reliably to bomb enemy units (strafing technically I suppose). But lets talk about why you need a large and good air force. This game is all about prestige management in the end and destroying the enemy air power stops him from strafing and bombing your tanks. And to be honest I am sure we have all had a fighter or bomber knock 6 points off of a tank. Well those 6 points are going to cost you 100+ prestige to reinforce during the scenario and probably around 70-80 to do inbetween scenarios. Do what you can to neutralize this (it also saves you a turn of having to reinforce your unit too).

Tactical Bombers - These are great up until the end of 1943. The Stuka reigns supreme as the king of damage in this game. Nothing causes as much damage as my Stukas. And as a benefit the Stukas can be upgraded to Fw-190s later in the game. So by the time the Russian airforce gets to a point that they can really cause damage to your tactical bombers you change them over to defacto fighters! For me though the Me-110 series is the unsung great unit of Panzer Corps. It bombs, it can take on early war fighters, and it also gains experience faster than almost any other unit in the game (this is probably because every turn it can do something!). Get two of them and you will not regret it. About the only thing it is not good at is attacking infantry.

[robman]

I'll add one more:

Strategic bombers - Veteran players differ on their usefulness against ground targets, but we can all agree on one thing: They are the supreme ship-killers of the game. (The only exceptions are submarines, which can only be attacked by tac bombers and destroyers.) Always bring at least one to any scenario in which you expect to encounter naval targets, two if you expect to encounter a great many of them.

[brettz123]

I'll add one more:

Strategic bombers - Veteran players differ on their usefulness against ground targets, but we can all agree on one thing: They are the supreme ship-killers of the game. (The only exceptions are submarines, which can only be attacked by tac bombers and destroyers.) Always bring at least one to any scenario in which you expect to encounter naval targets, two if you expect to encounter a great many of them.

Thanks I knew I forgot something!

Let me give my take on strtegic bombers.

Strategic Bombers - situationally very useful but I do not take one normally unless I am expecting ships or fortifications. I want to say that I take them for sure in the following scenarios:

Modlin
Last Norway Campaign
Crete
Sevestopol

I think that is it actually. I don't find them all that useful during normal scenarios just because other units can essentially do the same thing and I prefer to put damage on units as compared to suppression. I have two in my CORE just because I never disband them after Norway (which in my opinion along with Crete are the only 2 scenarios I consider them essential for). I usually upgrade them along the He path but again they just aren't my thing. I would rather take another tank, artillery piece, or a Stuka.

The only thing I would particularly disagree with in the above post is that I think you should always take 2 of them when you are expecting lots of naval presence (ie Norway and Crete).

The real cool thing about strat bombers is the ability to remove ammo from the target which can be useful. Unfortunately, I find that by the time this is particularly useful (against IS-1 and IS-2 tanks) the Russian air force is strong enough to make it dangerous to use these, even when escorted.

[tonyUK]

Well straight away I see the major difference here is the number of units you have. Usually my maximum is
around 20. How did you get all those extra slots? From DV's maybe? No wonder I am struggling!