almost little things punches me hard in the stomache

[lordzimoa]

MythBusters

That would be cool, but we should find a real Nebelwerfer, life ammo and a shooting range.

[ivanov]

Another thing that I've already thought is why I never hear, in the modern Katyushas launches, the noise of the howls during the launch?

This is how the modern "Katyusha" - BM-21 sounds like:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WoBYgyQq ... re=related

Pretty bad ass if you ask me, but I'd say it's rather a hiss than a howl I don't think that the WWII rocket launchers were any different.

[VPaulus]

Still it can also be dependent in some weather conditions, air pressure, etc ... I don't know.
I'm playing the part of the two sides. I'm no specialist at all in this matters.
There might be some German documentation, or some personal accounts made by German artillery soldiers...

[ivanov]

I'd personally would probably support the thesis ,that there was a disctinct sound generated of the Katyushas or Nebelwerfers generated upon the launch ( hiss ) and a different sound of the rockets approaching the target ( "howl" ). The Allied or German soldiers that talked about the "howling", were at the receiving end and could only hear the sound of the closing rockets. Not the sound of the rockets being launched.

[deducter]

I'm just speculating, but I suspect the exact sound heard would depend on the angle the listener is relative to the incoming rocket, due to the Doppler effect.

A person standing directly in front of a rocket would hear a higher pitch than a person standing to its side.

So there might not be an "exact" sound after all.

[airbornemongo101]

So there might not be an "exact" sound after all.

Of course there is an exact sound concerning rockets....the "OH SH#T" !!!!,when you realize you're on the recieving end

[VPaulus]

Of course there is an exact sound concerning rockets....the "OH SH#T" !!!!,when you realize you're on the recieving end

It doesn't need to be a rocket. The British in WW1 had nicknamed a German high velocity shell as "Silent Susan".
"With a Silent Susan, you did not have to worry: you would be dead before you heard her"

[Chris10]

That would be cool, but we should find a real Nebelwerfer, life ammo and a shooting range.

that most definately not gonna happen but the fact that german landsers called the Nebelwerfers "Howling Cows" is quite a thing and they surely were not listening on incoming but on launching missiles.
Iam not 100% positive about my memorys but I think I recall my Grandad (3rd Fallschirm-Division fighting in France and Hürtgenwald Forest) told me when I was a teeny and asking all these silly questions that the Werfers were howling like crazy and if I ever thought this might get some importance I would have especially checked back with him about this issue but unfortunately he passed away in March2011...

As a side point I ask myself why you ask non german sources...for german equipment I would ask german army historians from the Bundeswehr Museum or one of the Tank Museums around the country...these guys know their stuff and no questions remains unanswered

EDIT: I will contact various german military specialistis including the Wehrmacht Museum to shed some final light on this..maybe even get a sound example who knows

[VPaulus]

maybe even get a sound example who knows

That would be... wunderbar

[4kEY]

Any new info, chris10

[Zhivago]

That would be cool, but we should find a real Nebelwerfer, life ammo and a shooting range.

that most definately not gonna happen but the fact that german landsers called the Nebelwerfers "Howling Cows" is quite a thing and they surely were not listening on incoming but on launching missiles.
Iam not 100% positive about my memorys but I think I recall my Grandad (3rd Fallschirm-Division fighting in France and Hürtgenwald Forest) told me when I was a teeny and asking all these silly questions that the Werfers were howling like crazy and if I ever thought this might get some importance I would have especially checked back with him about this issue but unfortunately he passed away in March2011...

As a side point I ask myself why you ask non german sources...for german equipment I would ask german army historians from the Bundeswehr Museum or one of the Tank Museums around the country...these guys know their stuff and no questions remains unanswered

EDIT: I will contact various german military specialistis including the Wehrmacht Museum to shed some final light on this..maybe even get a sound example who knows

Read this entire forum subject regarding my complaint about how it is nearly impossible to define "historical accuracy" in Panzer Corps.

[Chris10]

Any new info, chris10

oh...yeajh..almost forgtot about it...
got an answer from Panzermuseum Germany..
There are no existing Nebelwerfers with original ammunition and since over 20 years no WWII Wehrmacht artillery piece bigger than 7,5cm has been fired on german territory.
Regarding the sounds of the nebelwerfers in the german newsreels they are to be considered genuine as the teams doin the filming had recording teams with them which recorded the battle sounds (Info from the German Newsreel Archive)
In the later editing for the Weekly Cinema Show only Music and Voice was dubbed over for the final version...
Dubbing of single sounds was very very difficult as it was carried out with magnetic audio tape
I add a picture of the mixing room..only voice and music tapes are used


Those claiming these sounds have been dubbed over back then and are a hoax have no proof whatsoever for their claim while on the other hand in uncounted original untouched german newsreels you can hear Werfers with their specific howling long before the Katyushas were encountered on the Eastern Front...In the Norway Campaign for example Werfers were fired from Destroyers and they made an unbelivable screamy howling...

Saying these sounds are not original is like what sometimes very religious people say when confronted with the fact that they cant proof that god exists..They might answer: "Yeah but you cant proof that he doesnt exist either" This is called the "Argument of Ignorance"..same applys here

So...for me the case is settled and the results are clear...Werfers just as Katyushas have a very similar sound..with the little exception that some Werfers could fireing some sort of grenades (not rockets) and they indeed did not howl but that was not the point...

[VPaulus]

Well I'll not enter in any kind of polemics, but I've already changed the sounds for the Nebelwerfer a couple of months ago and used as based sound some of those newsreels.
At least now they sound better and more menacing.

[Chris10]

Well I'll not enter in any kind of polemics, but I've already changed the sounds for the Nebelwerfer a couple of months ago and used as based sound some of those newsreels.
At least now they sound better and more menacing.

And you did an awesome job on it my friend ..I love it...and the sound is genuine cause when its in Newsreels about Norway its long before the German Army first encountered the Katyushas > 14 July 1941 the first Katyusha Battery arrived east of Orsha to occupy defensive positions

[sIg3b]

... because if you give the AI nothing but KV-85s and JS-1s, then the player will have no choice but to use all Tigers/Panthers.

This is precisely the problem. Using all Tigers\Panthers should not even be a choice. Not remotely. First, you should never be able to afford that. Second, it shouldn´t be a good idea, even if you could afford it. Tanks were not the be all/end all in World War 2 (or at any other time in history). I would assume people interested in games like this are reading Keegan?!