Artillery rear support and 4º rank pike POA

[Rekila]

Two different problems for our last game

First the artillery support question. A BG of 4 bases of medium artillery behind 6 FF (4 in front 2 in one side) is supported by 2 BG of spears. A Swiss keil is about to charge the artillery laterally (trough the FF) On the precedent shooting phase the BG lost 1 Gun base (the one at the corner) and now one of the spear BGs have only one file in contact with the artillery rearguard and there is a gap between one file of the spear BG and the FF. Does the Spear BG still count as s defending the entire front of the FF? Or can the enemy BG pass through the corner of the FF without fighting.
About the 4º rank POA two questions from the same combat. A Swiss BG of 8 pike and 2 Hw bases charge an Italian BG of also 8pike and 2 HW on the front corner (only one file in combat) In Impact the Italians lost a base (pike). So in melee one of the files have 3 pike bases in front and a HW base in the rear for 4 ranks . Does the Italian BG still count the POA for 4 ranks of pike? Second case: The combat spreads and now the Swiss are in melee with the Italian pike (still with 9 bases) and a Sword BG. The Italian overlap on both sides . In the left with one file of the swords in the right with one base of HW from the Pike BG. The Swiss have now 3 files 2 of pike and 1 of HW. They have lost 2 pike bases so only 6 remain, can this be placed as 4/2 gaining the 4º rank POA for a file as least, or must be placed regularly 3/3.

[daveallen]

Two different problems for our last game

First the artillery support question. A BG of 4 bases of medium artillery behind 6 FF (4 in front 2 in one side) is supported by 2 BG of spears. A Swiss keil is about to charge the artillery laterally (trough the FF) On the precedent shooting phase the BG lost 1 Gun base (the one at the corner) and now one of the spear BGs have only one file in contact with the artillery rearguard and there is a gap between one file of the spear BG and the FF. Does the Spear BG still count as s defending the entire front of the FF? Or can the enemy BG pass through the corner of the FF without fighting.

Troops supporting Artillery are considered to actually have their front ranks level with the front of the artillery BG (Artillery bases vastly overstate the real depth).

So if a bg is supporting Art and has extra bases extending the flank those bases are lined up level with the front of the Art bg.

In the circumstance you describe they would be 'inside' the FFs defending them.

About the 4º rank POA two questions from the same combat. A Swiss BG of 8 pike and 2 Hw bases charge an Italian BG of also 8pike and 2 HW on the front corner (only one file in combat) In Impact the Italians lost a base (pike). So in melee one of the files have 3 pike bases in front and a HW base in the rear for 4 ranks . Does the Italian BG still count the POA for 4 ranks of pike? .

Yes, providing there are at least two ranks of Pike in a file (including the front one) then HW or Swd count as Pike for POA.

Second case: The combat spreads and now the Swiss are in melee with the Italian pike (still with 9 bases) and a Sword BG. The Italian overlap on both sides . In the left with one file of the swords in the right with one base of HW from the Pike BG. The Swiss have now 3 files 2 of pike and 1 of HW. They have lost 2 pike bases so only 6 remain, can this be placed as 4/2 gaining the 4º rank POA for a file as least, or must be placed regularly 3/3.

The formation rules say that each troop type in a non-homogenous bg can only have one rank shorter than the others, the rear one.

So if your Swiss are initially 4/4/2 (P/P/HW) and lose two P they must become 3/3/2, but if they'd lost one P and one HW they could be 4/3/1 or 3/4/1

Dave

[Rekila]

Thanks Dave

[grahambriggs]

[The formation rules say that each troop type in a non-homogenous bg can only have one rank shorter than the others, the rear one.

So if your Swiss are initially 4/4/2 (P/P/HW) and lose two P they must become 3/3/2, but if they'd lost one P and one HW they could be 4/3/1 or 3/4/1

Dave

The troop type is determined foot. So all the bases are of the same troop type. So the normal formation rules don't allow a 4/4/2. But:

The formation rules say that you need even(ish) ranks unless in a special formation. Kiel is a special formation of troops with pike/HW/Sw capabilities. Kiel must have two files four deep each of which must have the front rank and one other armed with pike. So as long as that's the case a 16 base Kiel could be 4/4/1/1/1/1/1/1/1/1. But:

The errata says "If it started the battle able to adopt keil formation, but as a result of base losses now has fewer than eight heavy foot or determined foot bases, the only formation changes permitted are to form or leave square, or reduce or expand frontage so that the heavy foot or determined foot are no more than one or two bases wide.”. So an ex-Kiel in a 2/2/2/1 like your Swiss could contract by two bases to 2 wide. But:

You're in combat and every base is in the front two raks (not sure how you got there). Would need to check the rule but i think that means you're stuck in that formation until the combat ends.

[Rekila]

The Swiss keil was overlapped so first the 2 nom committed bases in the rear (HW) move to check the overlap, the BG was now 4/4/2. First one and then a second base of pike were lost. As now they are 4/3/2, we doubt about what pike base must be removed.

[grahambriggs]

TA front rank Pike is removed. You must then replace that with one of the bases that are not in the front rank and shuffle the rest up. You are no longer a Kiel so you need to end up as 3/3/2 to satisfy the normal formation rules.