FORTRESS EUROPA improved (no Diplomaticus)

[supermax]

Beware of Soviet Paras. Bucharest does not have any Garrison at all.

Bad weather so no para possible now. I get a reinforcement next turn (Jan 1st 1944) in the capital. All good.

True, but don't forget to reinforce it quickly. In February the weather can be fair and a 3 Step MECH in Bucharest will not survive a combined TAC and Para attack.

Cheers Zechi

True. Next turn is january, so shall be ok i hope

[supermax]

[supermax]

Well the outlook isnt good for the Axis... Eastern front breaking up everywhere, western front barely holding. Only chance here is to concentrate all available forces in Germany and Italy and of course FRance and resist to the last man. Also a great counter-attack is planned in the east to break the back of the 1944 soviet offensive. Our LVL 9 fighters should also be useful. We need to produce Inmfantry now!

[supermax]

[rkr1958]

Anyone else having trouble seeing Max's images? I'm seeing a message that "This image exceeds bandwidth ..."

[Cybvep]

They worked several hours ago. Now they aren't working.

[supermax]

Things will be back up to normal soon. Ive done many aar and exceeded my bandwith limit...

Takin care of it now, should be back to normal soon. I cant cut you on the most interesting part of the game where i retreat, retreat, retreat and probably will be defeated can I ???

[supermax]

Finally some people commenting (at least) on my AAR again!

[Cybvep]

TBH in the name of balance, I would be glad if you lost this game or won a minor victory. Don't take this personally, I'm just hoping that Fortress Europa isn't the ultimate Axis strategy.

[supermax]

TBH in the name of balance, I would be glad if you lost this game or won a minor victory. Don't take this personally, I'm just hoping that Fortress Europa isn't the ultimate Axis strategy.

Well i think yo will ge your wish

I expanded to much oil in my russian campaign in 1942 and my europe conquest, and now i am paying for it. I believe i will maybee be able to keep paris, rome and berlin if i can play this right.

London will fall easily, since its not about putting troops there but moving them...

[joerock22]

I don't think there is an "ultimate strategy" in GS. If supermax cannot win easily with Fortress Europe without sweating it out, then nobody can.

People have been trying to come up with ultimate strategies since the very beginning of GS, but nobody has yet. The game still comes down to player skill in most cases, and who plays the better game. Yes, you can beat someone with an innovative new strategy that he's never seen before (see Morris v. Joe), but opponents will be much better prepared for it the next game and it won't work as well.

The GS designers have, in my opinion, done an excellent job of making enough adjustments to combat attempted ultimate strategies while not doing too much. There were some strategies in vanilla CEAW that came very close to ultimate strategies (Russian armour blob, etc.). These have been addressed, and game balance has improved because of it.

[Peter Stauffenberg]

TBH in the name of balance, I would be glad if you lost this game or won a minor victory. Don't take this personally, I'm just hoping that Fortress Europa isn't the ultimate Axis strategy.

I think it's hard to make any such conclusions from this game alone. Remember that Supermax is one of the very best GS players we have. So he would probably win regardless of strategy and side.

It's only if OTHER player repeat his strategy and also win with it we can make the conclusion that the Fortress Europa might be the ultimate strategy for the Axis. Try this strategy against e. g. Joerock as the Allies. If you can stop even him then the strategy has merit.

I think it's more correct that Fortress Europa is a very promising strategy for the Axis. If you're good enough then it gives you a fair chance to win the game.

I believe every strategy has a life span until another player finds a way to beat it. Not long ago we felt that Morris had found the ultimate Axis strategy. Supermax showed that this strategy was flawed and Morris is now refining his strategy.

So there will always be room for improvement in strategy. That means replayability of the game is high. In GS v2.0 I think most Axis players felt they started with a handicap and Barbarossa rarely gave amazing results. In GS v2.1 the Axis are more lethal and the Allied player really has to play well to survive 1941 and 1942. I think that makes the game more fun for both sides.

I think a completely balanced game is impossible to make. Even chess with only 32 pieces isn't completely balanced. White has a slight advantage in the beginning. So let's be satisfied if the game balance is so well that both sides HOPE they can win the game before starting.

[Crazygunner1]

If you can do a nice counterattack in the north on the russian front, you can probably destroy the most of the northern russian army. That will delay them somewhat...think you got a good chance to last until 45...But a major victory will be most challanging.

Just make sure you rail out those troops in the south, you could sure use them

[Cybvep]

I'm not saying that it already is the ultimate Axis strategy, but I think it has good potential to become one if Supermax makes some adjustments. By "ultimate Axis strategy" I mean a strategy which will allow you win the game in all or almost all cases where the skill of both opponents is comparable. Obviously a noob will never win with Morris, Supermax or Joe Rock.

Fortress Europa strategies are so boring and unrealistic in CEAW (because of the way the game is designed, with 1941 Barbarossa being the typical scenario) that I always root for the Allies even when I'm forced to use such strategies because of my poor performance during Fall Gelb, for example.

I would gladly see another AAR with a refined version of Supermax's Fortress Europa employed against Morris or Joe Rock.

[supermax]

If you can do a nice counterattack in the north on the russian front, you can probably destroy the most of the northern russian army. That will delay them somewhat...think you got a good chance to last until 45...But a major victory will be most challanging.

Just make sure you rail out those troops in the south, you could sure use them

Thats the general idea yes...

[supermax]

I dont think this strategy is ultimate, but i said it has the potential to be a strategy where you can actually win a major victory with the axis.

In this cade i dont think i will be able to pull it off. I would have done it with 100 more oil in 1942-1943 when i stopped the landing in england and started to damage the allied fleet with my superior air power. But then i had to stay on the defense because of oil.

If i had had oil, i would have utterly destroyed the allied fleet by moving mine north and bombing the shit out of it with my superior numbers and tech.

S next time i do this, i will simply forego of any barbarossa offensive operations, thus saving 450+ oil, and then this strategy will be very hard to beat.

[supermax]

[rkr1958]

Max,

Thanks for this AAR. I find it very entertaining to follow. Interesting that while I suspect you will likely win that this game is going down to the wire; the same as the game between Joe and Morris. Though that's the only similarity between the two. The axis strategies employed are polar opposites. Personally, I think it's more about the skill of player (e.g., you, Joe, Morris & Diplomaticus) than the particular strategy employed (as long as the strategy is sound). I also think that these two games going down to the wire is pretty good evidence that we've got the balance in GS about as good as we're going to get it.

[Crazygunner1]

Max, make sure you dont let the Russians take Balkans to quick, if you are serious about keeping Italy in the war? They will have an easy backdoor towards Italy and it might be hard to defend against. Or do you intend to let Italy go and place german units in key positions?

[supermax]

Max, make sure you dont let the Russians take Balkans to quick, if you are serious about keeping Italy in the war? They will have an easy backdoor towards Italy and it might be hard to defend against. Or do you intend to let Italy go and place german units in key positions?

Good question. I havent ansswered this one before, but it will be hard to block all angle i just dont have the troops. I certainly want to rail german troops to Italy, and maybee organize a line of defense in the north to block the allies long enough...