Manstein
Moderators: Slitherine Core, Panzer Corps Moderators, Panzer Corps Design
Manstein
I've decided to start a playthrough of the DLC campaign on Manstein difficulty, having played through without much difficulty on Rommel. For those that have done so, what general strategy should I be adopting in terms of DV-vs-force preservation. I mostly got DVs on Rommel but should I be giving up on that idea and going reaaaally slowly to cut down on the number of huge units I have to face at once? Do you use the extra prestige to overstrength units every mission?
Re: Manstein
Manstein is pretty much all I play, and I would say it changes the game play more than any other difficulty.
Even when you use the correct counter unit, say an 88 in ATG mode against a Polish/French/British tank, you still might take some casualties simply because of their overstrength. 10 strength of 88s knock out 9 strength of tanks, leaving 6 to still return fire.
Three most important things you need are high firepower units, initiative, and support units.
High firepower + mass attack high initiative + support units to soften a target up is the only way to avoid taking casualties when you fight units with 50% more base strength. And when 14 strength units become 19 strength units, you really need every advantage you can get.
For prestige, you have to use regular replacements for everything at all times. Elite is simply too expensive to buy over and over because you are going to be taking a lot of damage to your units, especially front line fighting units such as infantry and tanks. Save elite reinforcement and overstrength for units that stay out of direct line of fire: your artillery and air support units. Only when you have a huge stockpile of prestige reserved should you start beefing up your armor and infantry.
Because you are constantly using mass attack, you can't really spread your forces out very thin. For example in Prohkorovka from DLC 1943, there are 3 separate deployment areas. Deploying forces into each area is a recipe for disaster. I totally ignored the top left deploy zone, put a token defensive force of 5-6 units in the bottom right to hold the river VH, and dumped the other 45 units all together into one massive force in the bottom left deployment area. That force then proceeded to smash their way through the enemy center and then attacking the side objectives from the flanks.
Sometimes you have to settle for minor victories. Especially in Spoils of War, Tatsinkaya, and other high difficulty scenarios.
Good luck!
Even when you use the correct counter unit, say an 88 in ATG mode against a Polish/French/British tank, you still might take some casualties simply because of their overstrength. 10 strength of 88s knock out 9 strength of tanks, leaving 6 to still return fire.
Three most important things you need are high firepower units, initiative, and support units.
High firepower + mass attack high initiative + support units to soften a target up is the only way to avoid taking casualties when you fight units with 50% more base strength. And when 14 strength units become 19 strength units, you really need every advantage you can get.
For prestige, you have to use regular replacements for everything at all times. Elite is simply too expensive to buy over and over because you are going to be taking a lot of damage to your units, especially front line fighting units such as infantry and tanks. Save elite reinforcement and overstrength for units that stay out of direct line of fire: your artillery and air support units. Only when you have a huge stockpile of prestige reserved should you start beefing up your armor and infantry.
Because you are constantly using mass attack, you can't really spread your forces out very thin. For example in Prohkorovka from DLC 1943, there are 3 separate deployment areas. Deploying forces into each area is a recipe for disaster. I totally ignored the top left deploy zone, put a token defensive force of 5-6 units in the bottom right to hold the river VH, and dumped the other 45 units all together into one massive force in the bottom left deployment area. That force then proceeded to smash their way through the enemy center and then attacking the side objectives from the flanks.
Sometimes you have to settle for minor victories. Especially in Spoils of War, Tatsinkaya, and other high difficulty scenarios.
Good luck!
Re: Manstein
Very good tips, especially the bit about regular replacements, thank you.
Re: Manstein
Oh, and forget about wiping the map clean of enemies, especially in the later DLCs.
This is a snapshot from the review battlefield phase of Kremenchug, from DLC 1943 East.
I just barely scraped together a Decisive Victory by planting my Panthers on the last few VH on the Soviet side of the Dnieper River on the last turn.
It's funny because I have 3 ME109s and 5 FW190s, and I still wasn't able to clear the skies in this scenario, as you can see from that one Soviet bomber still active. In fact, I actually lost 2 of my CORE FW190s during this scenario. Those elite Yak3s are serious business, heh.
This is a snapshot from the review battlefield phase of Kremenchug, from DLC 1943 East.
I just barely scraped together a Decisive Victory by planting my Panthers on the last few VH on the Soviet side of the Dnieper River on the last turn.
It's funny because I have 3 ME109s and 5 FW190s, and I still wasn't able to clear the skies in this scenario, as you can see from that one Soviet bomber still active. In fact, I actually lost 2 of my CORE FW190s during this scenario. Those elite Yak3s are serious business, heh.
Re: Manstein
And another thing about this difficulty, you really HAVE to accept that you WILL LOSE UNITS. If you try and preserve 100% of your core in every scenario, you will have to resort to cheats or frustrating levels of save/load exploiting. Better to just take the loss of units in stride, for sanity's sake. 
How I started DLC 1943 East, this is my TOTAL losses for all previous DLC, so DLC 39, 40, 41, and 42
How I ended DLC 1943 East
For this purpose, infantry, recon, and anti tank units are your best candidates for absorbing AI counter attacks. They are all cheap and easily replaceable, so its not a big deal if you lose 1 or 2 of these units EVERY TURN.
How I started DLC 1943 East, this is my TOTAL losses for all previous DLC, so DLC 39, 40, 41, and 42
How I ended DLC 1943 East
For this purpose, infantry, recon, and anti tank units are your best candidates for absorbing AI counter attacks. They are all cheap and easily replaceable, so its not a big deal if you lose 1 or 2 of these units EVERY TURN.
Re: Manstein
That's going to take some mental adjustment! I'm used to basically never losing anything but recon units. The one time I lost an elite FJ unit was horribly painful.
Re: Manstein
I agree with the vanilla game rules Manstein is the hardest. That's why Rommel needs to be changed to -75% prestige overall to make it comparable. 1943 will be just as difficult. Even losing one or two units per scenario become almost unsustainable at that level. So it'd be a very different type of difficulty from Manstein, which is appropriate.
Re: Manstein
Very true, but I find its a good primer for multiplayer. In MP play, if you are fighting an opponent of roughly equal skill, both sides are going to be taking heavy casualties, not too unlike the Manstein Campaign.AgentTBC wrote:That's going to take some mental adjustment! I'm used to basically never losing anything but recon units. The one time I lost an elite FJ unit was horribly painful.