Can we save the Bear, Richardsd vs Morris (no Morris please)

[gchristie]

The problems I experience as Axis are:

A) my opponents make me fight for most of my gains in russia in 1941
B) I burn a lot of oil in 41 destroying Russian high value forces, and though I make great gains in taking strategic cities and racking up Russian losses, by 1943 I'm under 200 oil and dropping.

I just can't seem to strike the right balance as Axis. Either I'm too conservative and get rolled by powerful allied forces, or I kill off lots of allied forces but am scraping the bottom of the oil barrel. Yes, I try to be frugal with oil, using rail, not bombing in mud/winter, etc. Standard six tanks, 8 - 10 mechs, 5 - 6 tacs, etc. so I don't go hog wild on oil consuming units.

That's my experience after playing for over a year.

Note: This is not a complaint, just saying I've still more to learn. I think Morris is shrewd to put all his armor and mechs in the southern Russian front so I will try that next time, because there is always a next time, curse you Sliterine and the BJR team

[Diplomaticus]

And seeing this size of German blob get to Stalingrad in 1941 is just a little silly since there is no way the German supply tether would have allowed this. Even a year later in 1942 they had trouble keeping a smaller force supplied at Stalingrad after stripping their rest of their units in Russia of motorized transport.

So my problem isn't "play balance." I'm sure really creative players can always devise extreme strategies to achieve some outcome.

Well, since CEAW and all other wargames like it are very much about letting the historically-minded play the "what if" game, I really wonder about this whole supply limit reasoning. Sure, *historically* in RL you describe the supply problem accurately. But WHAT IF...

1) ...the Germans had put a super-high priority on logistics in Russia. This would have to include gathering much better intelligence so they wouldn't be surprised by things like the problems with distances between rail supply depots.

2) ... the Axis powers collaborated to use the Black Sea to supplement rail supply. With forward planning couldn't they build (or transport) u-boats for action in the Black Sea? With complete air superiority, surely they could protect the shipping.

3) ... they developed the mechanized equivalent of the u-boat 'milch cows'--a more advanced vehicle for getting critical supplies to the front.

4) Etc.

All of this is highly speculative, it's true, but the belligerents in WWII did come up with some pretty amazing stuff (Manhattan Project, jet fighters, V-1 & V-2's). I just think we shouldn't be too quick to leap to conclusions about what they could/couldn't have done, with the right application of effort.

[Cybvep]

The Germans actually used u-boats in the Black Sea. They were transported overland...

The logistical system is what differentiates arcade games from semi-historical/historical/simulator games. Logistics is the cornerstone of warfare. Any war plan which doesn't give much thought to it cannot be seriously considered. CEAW logistics is abstract and simplistic and it would be great if this was improved in 2.2/3.0.

[richardsd]

The Germans actually used u-boats in the Black Sea. They were transported overland...

The logistical system is what differentiates arcade games from semi-historical/historical/simulator games. Logistics is the cornerstone of warfare. Any war plan which doesn't give much thought to it cannot be seriously considered. CEAW logistics is abstract and simplistic and it would be great if this was improved in 2.2/3.0.

all true, but minute management of logistics is very boring to a large section of the gaming community - its a balance, CEAW has a large component of logistics built into it, but its focus is more on the miltary strategy

[Cybvep]

Logistical system can be mostly automatic, with only high-level decisions being manually made by the players. This is especially true in a grand strategy game.

[richardsd]

here we go for round two!

Fall of France was 27 June and here are the casualties as I have been 'fighting' in France trying to inflict Air and 'oil' losses on the Germans



I have only actually lost I MECH (not two - a small bug) and yes the German's have lost one too!

oh, it now says 3 - I don't even have that many!

I wonder if it has something to do with the evacuated units - some GAR's have been evacuated

[Plaid]

It shows 3 steps/ 0 units by the way

[richardsd]

It shows 3 steps/ 0 units by the way

yeah, but onlt lost 1!

[richardsd]

It shows 3 steps/ 0 units by the way

yeah, but onlt lost 1!

too much wine, but still where did iIlose those ghost MECH steps~!

[Plaid]

Maybe in transport?

[richardsd]

Maybe in transport?

good thought - but no, he didn't hit any of my transports

also looks like he might be keen to defend Norway now that a couple of peolpe have gone that route, I did have a sub in place that chipped the three steps off his MECH, very minor victory



we will see later

[richardsd]

so things are following the normal route, Norway and Yugoslavia fall. Italian's bug out of NA.

only two things of note:

1. a CV in Portsmouth did 3 steps of damage to a BB in port accross the way (1-0 was prediction) which has sent the BB packing - I continually nibble at Axis ships to drain a few PP's and a fraction of oil

2. Russian scientists (for the second game in a row) are just AWFUL! - I don't think you could get a worse result so far

we have to make some decisions about our Barbarossa defence, so that will likely be in next post

[richardsd]

so we are at the dawn of Barbarossa and we are going to stay with our string defence

I will post a pic after he attacks

elsewhere we continue to play 'mess with the Kriegsmarine'

[richardsd]

we catch a break and get mud in the second April turn and Russian scientists finally do something, not much but something at least!

we finish off the DD and start our bombing campaign




we haven't seen a UBoat for a while, I wonder if they are off Norway waiting for an invasion

[richardsd]

ok Barbarossa





it may be my imagination but it seems weaker - maybe the 1 lvl anti tank and aslightly better defence
also of note is the amphibious landing!

our string defence plan means we were in a reasonable position to deal with this



we mostly run in the North



but we consider defence of Lennigrad

in Europe more air sweep and bombing

[richardsd]

just after pics this turn

bombing starting to take effect



in Russia we make a few mistakes (like getting Lennigrad wrong) and we change our strategy a little as we have a chance to get more of the army out, so we will trade territory to keep the units

[richardsd]

late June and the Axis role on





and we find two subs - waiting for the Russian convoy



in retaliation we continue air sweeps over Europe



in Russia its more of the same, but we will give more ground in the South this time - although I am having second thoughts, but its too late now

[rkr1958]

The last screen cap appears to show the 2 German units in the Caucasus in supply. Did you just kill their supply ship? Never mind ... I see it at 1-step in an earlier cap so the answer is; yes, you just killed off their supply source. You'll be able to starve the infantry corps; but not the airborne unit. Did Morris land that airborne unit via seaborne invasion? If so, what a novel idea since it will always have a minimum supply of 1.

[richardsd]

The last screen cap appears to show the 2 German units in the Caucasus in supply. Did you just kill their supply ship? Never mind ... I see it at 1-step in an earlier cap so the answer is; yes, you just killed off their supply source. You'll be able to starve the infantry corps; but not the airborne unit. Did Morris land that airborne unit via seaborne invasion? If so, what a novel idea since it will always have a minimum supply of 1.

yes, seaborne = quite a good idea as you say

[Plaid]

I think feature of airborne always have 1 supply is a little odd by its nature.
They can survive (and get reinforcements) for years with no visible supply source.
Not like it affects gameplay, but on what it supposed to be based?