Due to some discussions here I want to take a look how a as good as possible optimised core will do in comparisson to my earlier beta 2 try. I expect the core to be better, the main question is how much.
Kharov
FM - normal RNG (which acted up a fair bit again)
Starting prestige 7k
End prestige 4.3k with 3.4k after reinforcements.
On a scale of 1 to 5 with 1 being very easy and 5 being very hard Kharkov is a 4 IMO (without considering the prestige gain).
Belgorod
FM - starting to build up the core
Sold some units I dont deem very usefull: SE Grenadiere, Marder IID, SdKfz 232 and one Wehrmacht Infantrie, giving me 4.5k prestige
Upgraded the 2 15cm to 17cm, Ju 87B to D, Bf 109F to Fw 190A, SE Pz IIIM/Pz IIIJ1/T34-41 to Tiger I, Pz IVF/2 to G, Wehrmacht Infantrie to Fallschirmjäger, StuG IIIf/8 to G, in addition I bought another Me 410A, 1 Wurfrahmen and 1 SdKfz 7/2 leaving me with 2 prestige.
End prestige 0.3k with 26 left after selling the T34 and full elite reinforcements for all units except a 1 star Me 410A - 10 strength there. Looks like it will be selective reinforcements again.
On a scale of 1 to 5 with 1 being very easy and 5 being very hard Belgorod is a 2 IMO (without considering the prestige gain).
beta 2 - optimised pre-build core
Moderators: Slitherine Core, The Lordz, Panzer Corps Moderators, Panzer Corps Design
Re: beta 2 - optimised pre-build core
Orel
FM
Had to reload once to get a SE tank and give myself another 38 prestige to upgrade it to a Pz IIIM (as in my last game).
Bought another Ju 87D and 1 Wurfrahmen, not a single prestige left after reinforcements.
Left the poor Italians to their own devices and they were utterly crushed
DV at 16/16
Starting prestige = 0, ending prestige = 1.8k - 5.7k after elite reinforcements (tad less than during my earlier game - since I retook most Italian cities this time, too, actually closer to a 0.6k difference - most likely using RNG is the cause since I have to allocate more units to ensure kills) - selective reinforcements again since I need lots of upgrades here
On a scale of 1 to 5 with 1 being very easy and 5 being very hard Orel is a 3 IMO (without considering the prestige gain).
FM
Had to reload once to get a SE tank and give myself another 38 prestige to upgrade it to a Pz IIIM (as in my last game).
Bought another Ju 87D and 1 Wurfrahmen, not a single prestige left after reinforcements.
Left the poor Italians to their own devices and they were utterly crushed
DV at 16/16
Starting prestige = 0, ending prestige = 1.8k - 5.7k after elite reinforcements (tad less than during my earlier game - since I retook most Italian cities this time, too, actually closer to a 0.6k difference - most likely using RNG is the cause since I have to allocate more units to ensure kills) - selective reinforcements again since I need lots of upgrades here
On a scale of 1 to 5 with 1 being very easy and 5 being very hard Orel is a 3 IMO (without considering the prestige gain).
Re: beta 2 - optimised pre-build core
Yakovlevo
FM
Upgraded both SE non-Tigers to Panther D, KV-1C to Tiger I, Pz IIIN +1 movement to Tiger I, all 4 Pz IVG to IVH, Marder IIIH to Elefant, 21cm Nebelwerfer to 30cm, StuG IIIB to Hummel, 2 Bf 109G to Fw 190A, 2 Ju 87D to G, Bf 110G to ME 410A and bought a He 177A leaving me with 1 prestige.
Using 1 FJ, 2 Pioniere, 1 Pz IIIN, 4 Pz IVH, 7 Tiger I, 2 Panther D, 1 Elefant, 2 StuG IIIG, 3 17cm, 3 Wurfrahmen, 1 Hummel, 1 StuH 42, 1 SU-122, 1 8.8cm Flak, 1 SdKfZ 7/2, 5 Fw 190A, 2 Ju 87D, 2 Ju 87G, 2 Me 410A and 1 He 177A for this one - all but 1 Wehrmacht Infantrie and 1 recon car are deployed.
Destroyed all defenders at turn 16, DV at 20/20.
Starting prestige = 0, end prestige 0.7k. Full elite reinforcements would need 4k, so I have to be very selective with repairs this time.
On a scale of 1 to 5 with 1 being very easy and 5 being very hard Yakovlevo is a 3 IMO (without considering the prestige gain).
FM
Upgraded both SE non-Tigers to Panther D, KV-1C to Tiger I, Pz IIIN +1 movement to Tiger I, all 4 Pz IVG to IVH, Marder IIIH to Elefant, 21cm Nebelwerfer to 30cm, StuG IIIB to Hummel, 2 Bf 109G to Fw 190A, 2 Ju 87D to G, Bf 110G to ME 410A and bought a He 177A leaving me with 1 prestige.
Using 1 FJ, 2 Pioniere, 1 Pz IIIN, 4 Pz IVH, 7 Tiger I, 2 Panther D, 1 Elefant, 2 StuG IIIG, 3 17cm, 3 Wurfrahmen, 1 Hummel, 1 StuH 42, 1 SU-122, 1 8.8cm Flak, 1 SdKfZ 7/2, 5 Fw 190A, 2 Ju 87D, 2 Ju 87G, 2 Me 410A and 1 He 177A for this one - all but 1 Wehrmacht Infantrie and 1 recon car are deployed.
Destroyed all defenders at turn 16, DV at 20/20.
Starting prestige = 0, end prestige 0.7k. Full elite reinforcements would need 4k, so I have to be very selective with repairs this time.
On a scale of 1 to 5 with 1 being very easy and 5 being very hard Yakovlevo is a 3 IMO (without considering the prestige gain).
Re: beta 2 - optimised pre-build core
Oboyan
FM
Seems like I got very lucky with SE units last time, needed 3 reloads to get a SE tank - Panther D which will be downgraded to Pz IIIM.
Had to leave 2 units unrepaired and some Panzer are not at full overstrength, will try to be fairly carefull here and preserve prestige - 25 prestige left.
As much as the RNG gods hated me during the last turn 1 they seem to love me now, lots of destroyed units which only should have been down to 1-2STR.
Bridged the Psel to the north of Pavlovka at turn 15 this time while in the east the counterattackers around Bobryshevo were nearly destroyed, but time is running out (did take fairly low damage due to moving carefully, but I will have to hurry a bit now).
Only at turn 19 I have finally managed to get units next to all 3 victory locations, I think I took about the same or even more damage in the last 2 turns than in the 17 before. Most likely settling for a MV might be a choice, but on the other hand the KV-85s and kills/prestige to be gained from Kursk Armory should make it worth trying to get a DV.
In the end I had even 4 attacks/units left, but as usual for me I failed to take Dolzhenkovo.
Starting prestige 25, ending prestige 2k. Full elite reinforcements (including the 2 still unrepaired units and full overstrength even for the units that started lower) would cost 4.8k.
Despite fielding a bunch of Tiger/Panther and having good fighters this is still a hard scenario.
On a scale of 1 to 5 with 1 being very easy and 5 being very hard Oboyan is a 4 IMO (but not very far from a 5).
FM
Seems like I got very lucky with SE units last time, needed 3 reloads to get a SE tank - Panther D which will be downgraded to Pz IIIM.
Had to leave 2 units unrepaired and some Panzer are not at full overstrength, will try to be fairly carefull here and preserve prestige - 25 prestige left.
As much as the RNG gods hated me during the last turn 1 they seem to love me now, lots of destroyed units which only should have been down to 1-2STR.
Bridged the Psel to the north of Pavlovka at turn 15 this time while in the east the counterattackers around Bobryshevo were nearly destroyed, but time is running out (did take fairly low damage due to moving carefully, but I will have to hurry a bit now).
Only at turn 19 I have finally managed to get units next to all 3 victory locations, I think I took about the same or even more damage in the last 2 turns than in the 17 before. Most likely settling for a MV might be a choice, but on the other hand the KV-85s and kills/prestige to be gained from Kursk Armory should make it worth trying to get a DV.
In the end I had even 4 attacks/units left, but as usual for me I failed to take Dolzhenkovo.
Starting prestige 25, ending prestige 2k. Full elite reinforcements (including the 2 still unrepaired units and full overstrength even for the units that started lower) would cost 4.8k.
Despite fielding a bunch of Tiger/Panther and having good fighters this is still a hard scenario.
On a scale of 1 to 5 with 1 being very easy and 5 being very hard Oboyan is a 4 IMO (but not very far from a 5).
Re: beta 2 - optimised pre-build core
Sounds like this campaign is still shaping up very well. Experienced played on FM having a tough but not impossible time, able to keep your prestige in a comfortable margin, not too high and not too low.
You have enough prestige that you aren't crippled, but no where near enough to fully elite and upgrade everything.
You have enough prestige that you aren't crippled, but no where near enough to fully elite and upgrade everything.
Re: beta 2 - optimised pre-build core
Prohkorovka will be the real test I think, but overall despite using a lot of heavy units the balance is still ok, IMO Kursk Armory South was a bit too easy for a core like this.
Kursk Armory South
FM
Sold the Sherman and bought 1 Hummel, 1 Ju87G and upgraded the SE Pz IIIM to a Panther D and a Pz IVH to a Tiger leaving some units unrepaired - 9 prestige left.
Crossed the Seym at turn 8, both at Kursk and Polevaya.
At turn 14 all defenders except 2 damaged tanks in the NE corner were destroyed and I opened up Budanovka and Bolshoye Zhirovo for respawn.
DV at 16/16.
Starting prestige = 9, end prestige 1.6k - full elite reinforcements would take 3.7k (again including the previously damaged/understrength units).
On a scale of 1 to 5 with 1 being very easy and 5 being very hard Kursk Armory South is a 2 (not too far away from a 1) IMO (without considering the prestige gain).
Kursk Armory South
FM
Sold the Sherman and bought 1 Hummel, 1 Ju87G and upgraded the SE Pz IIIM to a Panther D and a Pz IVH to a Tiger leaving some units unrepaired - 9 prestige left.
Crossed the Seym at turn 8, both at Kursk and Polevaya.
At turn 14 all defenders except 2 damaged tanks in the NE corner were destroyed and I opened up Budanovka and Bolshoye Zhirovo for respawn.
DV at 16/16.
Starting prestige = 9, end prestige 1.6k - full elite reinforcements would take 3.7k (again including the previously damaged/understrength units).
On a scale of 1 to 5 with 1 being very easy and 5 being very hard Kursk Armory South is a 2 (not too far away from a 1) IMO (without considering the prestige gain).
Re: beta 2 - optimised pre-build core
Prohkorovka
FM
Instead of a SE tank I got a SE Grenadier, but after a couple of reloads I ended up with a Pz IIIJ/1 which is changed to a Pz IIIN.
Sold both KV-85 and bought a Me 410A and another 2 Hummel instead. Upgraded the SE Pz IIIN to a Panther D and a Pz IVH to a Tiger leaving me with 2 prestige.
Using 3 groups again.
NW: Fallschirmjäger, 2 Pioniere - Pz IIIN, Tiger I - 2 17cm, StuH 42, 2 Wurfrahmen - 2 Fw 190A, 2 Ju 87D, 1 Me 410A
SW: 6 Tiger I, 3 Panther D - Elefant - 8,8cm, SdKfz 7/2 - 2 Hummel - 2 Fw 190A, Ju 87G, Me 410A
SE: 2 Tiger I, Panther D, Pz IVH - 2 StuG IIIG - 2 Hummel, 2 SU-122, Wurfrahmen, 17cm, 30cm Nebelwerfer - Fw 190A, 2 Ju87G, Me 410A, He 177A
Kept my distance from the easternmost airfield this time, but took Berezovka at turn 12, 5th Guards attacked there immediately so I assume that this is a trigger for them.
By turn 16 Prohkorovka has been cleared of defenders and I opened it up for respawn, only the NE airfield was left in Soviet hands and about 10 units were still around.
DV at 22/22.
Starting prestige = 2, end prestige = 4.7k - full elite reinforcements would cost 4.8k leaving me with 3.9k after elite reinforcements.
It seems like this might have been the breaking point for a core like this, basically just the prestige gained during the scenario was enough for full elite repairs and there are defensive scenarios coming. With the prestige I have I would easily be able to turn my 3 remaining "normal" tanks into Tigers and the 2 StuG IIIG into Elefants. But if I even would like to use at least 1 infantry besides all the aircraft, artillery, Tiger/Panther and the Elefant I don't even need to upgrade any unit.
On a scale of 1 to 5 with 1 being very easy and 5 being very hard Prohkorovka is a 2 IMO (without considering the prestige gain). It seems unlikely that it will get up to 4 or 5 from now on.
FM
Instead of a SE tank I got a SE Grenadier, but after a couple of reloads I ended up with a Pz IIIJ/1 which is changed to a Pz IIIN.
Sold both KV-85 and bought a Me 410A and another 2 Hummel instead. Upgraded the SE Pz IIIN to a Panther D and a Pz IVH to a Tiger leaving me with 2 prestige.
Using 3 groups again.
NW: Fallschirmjäger, 2 Pioniere - Pz IIIN, Tiger I - 2 17cm, StuH 42, 2 Wurfrahmen - 2 Fw 190A, 2 Ju 87D, 1 Me 410A
SW: 6 Tiger I, 3 Panther D - Elefant - 8,8cm, SdKfz 7/2 - 2 Hummel - 2 Fw 190A, Ju 87G, Me 410A
SE: 2 Tiger I, Panther D, Pz IVH - 2 StuG IIIG - 2 Hummel, 2 SU-122, Wurfrahmen, 17cm, 30cm Nebelwerfer - Fw 190A, 2 Ju87G, Me 410A, He 177A
Kept my distance from the easternmost airfield this time, but took Berezovka at turn 12, 5th Guards attacked there immediately so I assume that this is a trigger for them.
By turn 16 Prohkorovka has been cleared of defenders and I opened it up for respawn, only the NE airfield was left in Soviet hands and about 10 units were still around.
DV at 22/22.
Starting prestige = 2, end prestige = 4.7k - full elite reinforcements would cost 4.8k leaving me with 3.9k after elite reinforcements.
It seems like this might have been the breaking point for a core like this, basically just the prestige gained during the scenario was enough for full elite repairs and there are defensive scenarios coming. With the prestige I have I would easily be able to turn my 3 remaining "normal" tanks into Tigers and the 2 StuG IIIG into Elefants. But if I even would like to use at least 1 infantry besides all the aircraft, artillery, Tiger/Panther and the Elefant I don't even need to upgrade any unit.
On a scale of 1 to 5 with 1 being very easy and 5 being very hard Prohkorovka is a 2 IMO (without considering the prestige gain). It seems unlikely that it will get up to 4 or 5 from now on.
Re: beta 2 - optimised pre-build core
Dnipropetrovsk
FM
Potential DV at 6/18 with the frontline to the east of Maivka-Dnipropetrovsk-Stari Kodaky-Zaporozhye.
I think I did not notice this before, but at turn 10 7 KV-1C spawned from Oleksandrivka. 2 more and 2 BA-10 spawned on the next turn in addition to 3 fighters and 2 fighter-bomber at German controlled Maivka.
At turn 12 every Soviet unit has been destroyed and I opened Zaporozhye for respawn - just 1 AT and 2 BA-10.
DV at 18/18.
Starting prestige = 3.9k, end prestige 6.7k - repairs should be fairly light - 2k for full elite reinforcements.
By selling the captured T34 prestige would be at 7.1k for the next sceanrio. While the next one will be harder again I already have 4k more prestige than I had on the non-optimised core beta 2 run.
On a scale of 1 to 5 with 1 being very easy and 5 being very hard Dnipropetrovsk is a 2 IMO (without considering the prestige gain).
I think I will have to start to think about getting into MP now, anyone willing to PBEM a MP noob?
FM
Potential DV at 6/18 with the frontline to the east of Maivka-Dnipropetrovsk-Stari Kodaky-Zaporozhye.
I think I did not notice this before, but at turn 10 7 KV-1C spawned from Oleksandrivka. 2 more and 2 BA-10 spawned on the next turn in addition to 3 fighters and 2 fighter-bomber at German controlled Maivka.
At turn 12 every Soviet unit has been destroyed and I opened Zaporozhye for respawn - just 1 AT and 2 BA-10.
DV at 18/18.
Starting prestige = 3.9k, end prestige 6.7k - repairs should be fairly light - 2k for full elite reinforcements.
By selling the captured T34 prestige would be at 7.1k for the next sceanrio. While the next one will be harder again I already have 4k more prestige than I had on the non-optimised core beta 2 run.
On a scale of 1 to 5 with 1 being very easy and 5 being very hard Dnipropetrovsk is a 2 IMO (without considering the prestige gain).
I think I will have to start to think about getting into MP now, anyone willing to PBEM a MP noob?
Re: beta 2 - optimised pre-build core
MP is very fun. I suspect you would beat most opponents charonjr, but if you want a challenge, I'd be game.
Re: beta 2 - optimised pre-build core
I am up for it, nothing is better for learning than losing
From a couple of other games I am very aware that playing a human will be a completely different ballgame. Any fairly small map which is suited for a first shot?
From a couple of other games I am very aware that playing a human will be a completely different ballgame. Any fairly small map which is suited for a first shot?