Hello, here are the requested comments after the first rules reading.
1- General impressions
- Generally speaking the text is very clear and easily accessible. Diagrams and index will make it even better.
- Movement grouped in “classes of movement” (advance, charge, etc…) is a great idea. Movement is very intuitive and feels realistic.
- Combat tables seem cumbersome at first glance but after a few combats they are easily used and even memorized. Combat feels realistic too.
- Impact phase before movement phase seems counter-intuitive, especially for a beginner. Maybe an explanation of why is it so would help understand it.
- I don´t know yet if having detailed rules in appendixes instead of where the main rule is explained has advantages. The “core rules” may be easier to comprehend, especially for a beginner, but the complete rules are in two different places that you have to read separately.
- It would be a good idea to show different basic deployments of some armies to help beginners understand how different armies fight and how battle groups support each other and are designed and used to perform different tasks. I find deployment the most difficult part to learn for a beginner and the rules should help them to make the game more accessible to the general public.
All in all, a superb job.
2- Questions about the rules
- Page 18: Are expansions and contractions always two bases maximum? Shouldn´t it depend of the troop type? Example: Light Horse (or all skirmishers) could expand or contract up to 4 bases.
- Page 22: Second white bullet. Does it mean that the interpenetrated BG is “sandwiched” between the bases of the interpenetrating BG, some bases ahead of them and some bases on their back? Shouldn´t the interpenetrated BG become disordered too? What would happen if at that moment the interpenetrating BG is attacked? Or charged by the side or rear?
- Page 41: “A base cannot be shot at if it is in a position to fight as a 1st or 2nd rank…” Does it mean that 3rd and 4th rank pikemen can be shot at while the pikes are in close combat? If so, which ranks count to sum the number of bases the pike BG has to determine the 1HP3B ratio?
- Page 50: In Impact phase, Offensive Spearmen that charge Defensive Spearmen are 0 net POAS. Defensive Spearmen that charge Defensive Spearmen are 0 net POAS too. So in this case Offensive Spearmen have no advantages over Defensive Spearmen. Is this right?
- Page 62: Is a commander who is WITH A BG, trying to rally it, considered in “line of command” in each and every case? If so, 6th black bullet under “bolstering and rallying procedure” seems superfluous.
- Page 66: a fragmented BG “can make a simple move to retire away…” Does it means it can walk backwards, like mounted troops breaking off?
- Page 67: Are the +1 and +2 bonuses on the death roll accumulative? If a BG of artillery, elephants or battle wagons suffer shooting hits or win the combat, does it have a +3 bonus to the death roll?
Thank you very much.
Javier.
First read impressions and some rules questions
Moderators: philqw78, terrys, hammy, Slitherine Core, Field of Glory Moderators, Field of Glory Design
Thanks for the comments Javier - glad you like them..............
We find this unecessary as light troops tend to be in smaller BGs than heavy foot. So in rpactice they expand much more quicly wit hthe same limit. Typical Bg of LH 4-6, Typical spear BG 8 - 12.- Page 18: Are expansions and contractions always two bases maximum? Shouldn´t it depend of the troop type? Example: Light Horse (or all skirmishers) could expand or contract up to 4 bases.
It in a fair bit ot trouble for sure as its hit in the rear.- Page 22: Second white bullet. Does it mean that the interpenetrated BG is “sandwiched” between the bases of the interpenetrating BG, some bases ahead of them and some bases on their back? Shouldn´t the interpenetrated BG become disordered too? What would happen if at that moment the interpenetrating BG is attacked? Or charged by the side or rear?
Yes you can shoot at deep formations if you can get line of site - so protect the flansk fo the pike. Still the front 3 ranks for calculating the hit levels. Note the shooting effect is separate - it does not add to the combat result except for opportnity fire in IMPACT. So it isn't easy to get a pike block to test - 3 or 4 hits needed usually. But it can be done if you get round the flanks. My indians did it once and saves their palls from certain death.- Page 41: “A base cannot be shot at if it is in a position to fight as a 1st or 2nd rank…” Does it mean that 3rd and 4th rank pikemen can be shot at while the pikes are in close combat? If so, which ranks count to sum the number of bases the pike BG has to determine the 1HP3B ratio?
Defensive spearmen who charge offensive speaermen are therefore..............with sevearl consequences in a head to head between a defensive chinese and a hoplite- Page 50: In Impact phase, Offensive Spearmen that charge Defensive Spearmen are 0 net POAS. Defensive Spearmen that charge Defensive Spearmen are 0 net POAS too. So in this case Offensive Spearmen have no advantages over Defensive Spearmen. Is this right?
Except for ally troops - allied genreal required; and allied generals who cannot affect non-allied troops or troops of another ally- Page 62: Is a commander who is WITH A BG, trying to rally it, considered in “line of command” in each and every case? If so, 6th black bullet under “bolstering and rallying procedure” seems superfluous.
Only if this is a simple move........so LH can. Drilled foot could turn around. Undrilled HF are in trouble- Page 66: a fragmented BG “can make a simple move to retire away…” Does it means it can walk backwards, like mounted troops breaking off?
Yes indeed. So 4 hits minimum needed to knock off an elephant with shooting - but what a mess when it happens.- Page 67: Are the +1 and +2 bonuses on the death roll accumulative? If a BG of artillery, elephants or battle wagons suffer shooting hits or win the combat, does it have a +3 bonus to the death roll?
Thank you for your answers, Shall. They have cleared my doubts save for this one:
"- Page 22: Second white bullet. Does it mean that the interpenetrated BG is “sandwiched” between the bases of the interpenetrating BG, some bases ahead of them and some bases on their back? Shouldn´t the interpenetrated BG become disordered too? What would happen if at that moment the interpenetrating BG is attacked? Or charged by the side or rear?
It in a fair bit ot trouble for sure as its hit in the rear. "
Lets imagine a BG of 8 Spearmen in two rows of 4. They interpenetrate another BG but don´t have enough movement allowance so, if I understand well the rule, the first row of 4 bases is placed ahead of the interpenetrated BG, and the second row stays in the rear of the interpenetrated BG. The Spearmen BG is divided, with the interpenetrated BG standing between the two rows of Spearmen. If that is correct, what happens if...
1- An enemy shoots at them? Do you count 4 bases or 8 for the 1HP3B ratio?
2- An enemy charges them from the front? They are disordered and (I suppose) fight as a single row BG of 4 bases. Are there any other negative effects?
3- An enemy charges then on the side or rear? Apart from the -- net POAS, how does the BG conform, fight, etc?
"- Page 22: Second white bullet. Does it mean that the interpenetrated BG is “sandwiched” between the bases of the interpenetrating BG, some bases ahead of them and some bases on their back? Shouldn´t the interpenetrated BG become disordered too? What would happen if at that moment the interpenetrating BG is attacked? Or charged by the side or rear?
It in a fair bit ot trouble for sure as its hit in the rear. "
Lets imagine a BG of 8 Spearmen in two rows of 4. They interpenetrate another BG but don´t have enough movement allowance so, if I understand well the rule, the first row of 4 bases is placed ahead of the interpenetrated BG, and the second row stays in the rear of the interpenetrated BG. The Spearmen BG is divided, with the interpenetrated BG standing between the two rows of Spearmen. If that is correct, what happens if...
1- An enemy shoots at them? Do you count 4 bases or 8 for the 1HP3B ratio?
2- An enemy charges them from the front? They are disordered and (I suppose) fight as a single row BG of 4 bases. Are there any other negative effects?
3- An enemy charges then on the side or rear? Apart from the -- net POAS, how does the BG conform, fight, etc?
Le
1. They still count the 8 bases as their first two ranks
2. They fight with 1 rank turned but can never get the 2nd rank into combat as they can't make them contiguous - basically its doomed.
3. It confroms as best it can which in thsi case - due ot other friends in the way would mean just the flank one would fight unformed - bascuially its doomed.
So its the line that say troops conform if there is physically room to do so which would fix this one
Si
An interesting one, and if I am honest not one I have seen yet, but my interp of existing rules without any rewording would be:ts imagine a BG of 8 Spearmen in two rows of 4. They interpenetrate another BG but don´t have enough movement allowance so, if I understand well the rule, the first row of 4 bases is placed ahead of the interpenetrated BG, and the second row stays in the rear of the interpenetrated BG. The Spearmen BG is divided, with the interpenetrated BG standing between the two rows of Spearmen. If that is correct, what happens if...
1- An enemy shoots at them? Do you count 4 bases or 8 for the 1HP3B ratio?
2- An enemy charges them from the front? They are disordered and (I suppose) fight as a single row BG of 4 bases. Are there any other negative effects?
3- An enemy charges then on the side or rear? Apart from the -- net POAS, how does the BG conform, fight, etc?
1. They still count the 8 bases as their first two ranks
2. They fight with 1 rank turned but can never get the 2nd rank into combat as they can't make them contiguous - basically its doomed.
3. It confroms as best it can which in thsi case - due ot other friends in the way would mean just the flank one would fight unformed - bascuially its doomed.
So its the line that say troops conform if there is physically room to do so which would fix this one
Si