Christmas Quiz 3

philqw78 · Post by **philqw78** » Wed Dec 07, 2011 11:17 am

A is a LH BG
B and C are Knights
Red are Knights
Red declares a charge on A, A is going to evade when it gets to that point in the turn sequence, what can B and C do?

Bonus question

Does Red roll a VMD?

grahambriggs · Post by **grahambriggs** » Wed Dec 07, 2011 12:25 pm

Assume C is facing down the page.

C has a choice. It could do nothing. C can also intercept up to 4MU, as long as it crosses the path of the charge (i.e. must go further forward than the front edge of A).

B can do nothing. Red is not attempting to charge through B's ZOI. It is attempting to charge the front of A.

If C has intercepted, it is in the charge path and so counts as being charged, despite not being an origianl target of the charge. Therefore all red's targets have not evaded, so no need for a VMD, it just is moved into contact with C.

If C has done nothing, then all targets of the charge (the LH) have evaded. So red rolls a VMD. if he rolls up he could hit C. B still can't intercept, as we're at a leter step in the sequence of play.

philqw78 · Post by **philqw78** » Wed Dec 07, 2011 12:29 pm

Miles away

peterrjohnston · Post by **peterrjohnston** » Wed Dec 07, 2011 12:35 pm

As

Red are Kingihts

they are obviously highly evolved knights of the Order of Santa Claus, dressed in traditional manly, martial and totally, like, powerful red. So B and C, dressed in the ruddockian nancy-boy green of the Order of Santas Little Helpers, will sit there quivering in fear as the Santa Clauses thunder towards them. Also that dodgy glass of unpasteurized milk someone left out on the table last night, which they really should not have drunk, will have given them dysentery. Frankly it couldn't be worse, so with the Santa Clauses about to charge down their dribbling chimneys, they will both rout in total and abject fear before contact, throwing 12 on the VMD and fleeing off table. That's the last time Santas Little Helpers will steal the milk for sure.

The Light Reindeers will also rout in sympathy, led by some guy called Rudolf.

philqw78 · Post by **philqw78** » Wed Dec 07, 2011 12:43 pm

peterrjohnston wrote:As
Red are Kingihts

That was the Monty Python spelling. Now corrected. But your answer was as close as Grahams

bbotus · Post by **bbotus** » Wed Dec 07, 2011 12:48 pm

Ooh! Good question.

My answer is:
The original charge path will contact A and Red's right hand base will step forward also contacting C. Therefore, C is an object of the charge and cannot intercept. C must stand to receive the charge. It is hard to tell from the diagram but I think Red's right base with the step forward will be in front of B therefore Red's charge path as originally laid out will enter B's zone of interception, B may either stand or intercept. Red does not get to roll a VMD since all charge targets have not evaded. At the end of the move, B and C will be side by side facing Red with a gap of less than a base depth. If I've misread the diagram and Red and B are directly facing each other, then B could not make legal contact and would not be allowed to intercept.

Not a very satisfactory resolution.

What I'd like to say but is not my answer:
Since A is evading, Red does get to roll a VMD and will contact C only if it rolls up; B does not get to intercept since A will evade and therefore Red does not get to step forward with the charge and will not enter B's zone of interception with the charge move; C still does not get to intercept since it would have been contacted with a step forward had A not evaded.

peterrjohnston · Post by **peterrjohnston** » Wed Dec 07, 2011 12:50 pm

Serious answer:

At the point in the game sequence red charge, the LH haven't evaded (they could test to stand). It's hard to tell from your diagram, but if C is contactable by red stepping forward the right hand base from the "theoretical" line of contact with the LH, C is also a "legal" charge target, so cannot intercept. No VMD as per usual if not all targets evade.

If the LH now evade, red charges full move, and I think steps-forward into C with the right-hand base(odd!).

B could also possibly intercept this, I think you intend this from your diagram (in which case more bases from red would step forward).

Santas Little Helpers will now rout as per my previous answer

peterrjohnston · Post by **peterrjohnston** » Wed Dec 07, 2011 12:51 pm

PS If C isn't contactable by stepping forward, proceed as per Graham's answer.

philqw78 · Post by **philqw78** » Wed Dec 07, 2011 12:53 pm

The front of C is less than 30mm, a base depth , further than the front of A from red.

bbotus · Post by **bbotus** » Wed Dec 07, 2011 12:57 pm

If the LH now evade, red charges full move, and I think steps-forward into C with the right-hand base(odd!).

You would allow a step forward even if there is no contact with a unit at the end of the normal charge distance? Page 54 says the step forward happens after legal contact is made if it will get more bases into contact.

peterrjohnston · Post by **peterrjohnston** » Wed Dec 07, 2011 12:58 pm

philqw78 wrote:The front of C is less than 30mm, a base depth , further than the front of A from red.

Does B have the intercept (in which case it would block red's contact with C)?

philqw78 · Post by **philqw78** » Wed Dec 07, 2011 1:01 pm

peterrjohnston wrote:Does B have the intercept (in which case it would block red's contact with C)?

It is in a position to move directly forward past the front of C

peterrjohnston · Post by **peterrjohnston** » Wed Dec 07, 2011 1:07 pm

bbotus wrote:
If the LH now evade, red charges full move, and I think steps-forward into C with the right-hand base(odd!).
You would allow a step forward even if there is no contact with a unit at the end of the normal charge distance? Page 54 says the step forward happens after legal contact is made if it will get more bases into contact.

Ah yes, good point, thought it was odd. For the purposes of determining targets, as we don't know if the LH will evade, C is a legal target when the charge declaration is made.

So C can't intercept, LH now evades, red has no VMD as not all of their (original, I would read it) charge targets evaded.

I don't think it's very satisfactory though.

grahambriggs · Post by **grahambriggs** » Wed Dec 07, 2011 2:02 pm

peterrjohnston wrote:Serious answer:

At the point in the game sequence red charge, the LH haven't evaded (they could test to stand). It's hard to tell from your diagram, but if C is contactable by red stepping forward the right hand base from the "theoretical" line of contact with the LH, C is also a "legal" charge target, so cannot intercept. No VMD as per usual if not all targets evade.

If the LH now evade, red charges full move, and I think steps-forward into C with the right-hand base(odd!).

B could also possibly intercept this, I think you intend this from your diagram (in which case more bases from red would step forward).

Santas Little Helpers will now rout as per my previous answer

You can't step forward unless there has been a legal contact. Which there isn't if the LH evade.

A picky person would suggest even if the LH stand to take the charge there is no steps forward:

"To step forward after initial contact, slide any files of your battle group not yet in contact straight forward until the front base makes contact with enemy bases, subject to the following conditions:
 No bases can be stepped forward more than 2MUs from the original line of contact.
 Every stepped forward front rank base must end in contact with an enemy."

It kind of depends what you mean by "any". If you mean 'all of them that aren't in contact with the enemy' you could argue that no step forward occurs here. As the centre two bases hit no-one, which breaks the second bullet.

grahambriggs · Post by **grahambriggs** » Wed Dec 07, 2011 2:15 pm

philqw78 wrote:The front of C is less than 30mm, a base depth , further than the front of A from red.

Crikey, your basing of the reds is rubbish. Oh, and I take it you meant the LH are actually at 4MU and not the 4MU plus GT that you've drawn?

If C's in step forward range and that puts the stepping forward base in front of B's ZOI then:

C is frozen being the subject of a charge.

B intercepts if they want, up to 4MU.

Red charge targets don't all evade, so no VMD. Hence all the knights get close but no impact.

bahdahbum · Post by **bahdahbum** » Wed Dec 07, 2011 2:39 pm

I will agree with that answer . It seems odd , a charge without contact . I just need to chack if you may countercharge without having a chance to make contact .

zoltan · Post by **zoltan** » Wed Dec 07, 2011 7:00 pm

B is not allowed to intercept because. It starts over 4 MUs away from red knights. If LH evade red knights VMD and may crash into A. If course if red knights declared a wheel towards LH they would miss A.

philqw78 · Post by **philqw78** » Wed Dec 07, 2011 8:19 pm

grahambriggs wrote:
philqw78 wrote:The front of C is less than 30mm, a base depth , further than the front of A from red.
Crikey, your basing of the reds is rubbish. Oh, and I take it you meant the LH are actually at 4MU and not the 4MU plus GT that you've drawn?

If they were further than 4 MU there would be no charge Graham.
As for other diagramatical misinterpretation on your part:
Any gnats todge distance must be due to table creep as the LH shot the Knights with bow in their turn.
The knights may still be on WRG 6th edition or Airfix bases.

philqw78 · Post by **philqw78** » Wed Dec 07, 2011 8:21 pm

grahambriggs wrote: You can't step forward unless there has been a legal contact. Which there isn't if the LH evade.

A picky person would suggest even if the LH stand to take the charge there is no steps forward:

"To step forward after initial contact, slide any files of your battle group not yet in contact straight forward until the front base makes contact with enemy bases, subject to the following conditions:
 No bases can be stepped forward more than 2MUs from the original line of contact.
 Every stepped forward front rank base must end in contact with an enemy."

It kind of depends what you mean by "any". If you mean 'all of them that aren't in contact with the enemy' you could argue that no step forward occurs here. As the centre two bases hit no-one, which breaks the second bullet.

Only those bases that make contact by step forwards may move forwards. So the centre does not need to move, in fact cannot, just the right hand base, which will make contact and slide less than two and still be in contact with its BG.

philqw78 · Post by **philqw78** » Wed Dec 07, 2011 8:29 pm

So the answer is:

C must stand still as it is a target of reds charge due to compulsory step forward of reds right hand base.
B may opt to intercept because the line of contact due to the step forward allows its 4MU to cross the charge path.
A now evades
Red does not roll a VMD as not all its targets have evaded, C stood. But it does not contact anyone either as it now cannot reach either C or B.