Being a recent recruit to the game, I am confused over what dice I should have during the impact phase with a mixed battle line consisting of 3 battle groups.
I have 2 groups as 4*2 side by side with a row of 8 Bow behind them, ie
11112222
11112222
33333333
Groups 1 and 2 are MF, group 3 is MF Bow.
If I am charged do I receive 3 dice per file or only 2? also as a line, under rerolls it would suggest that a Commander would allow all units to reroll, is this the case?
Many thanks for your opinions.
Andrew
Groups, Lines and Support
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philqw78
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When a general is declared as fighting with a Battle Group that BG gets re-rolls. He could also be killed, but only because of hits on the BG he is fighting with.
Bow dice can only be added to impact if the front rank of the Battle group including the bow is contacted. 1 dice for each file with a bow base in a second or third rank.
In effect battle lines move together, they do not fight together. (Though they may overlap enemy fighting a BG adjacent to them)
So in your example you stget 2 dice per base in contact at impact.
Bow dice can only be added to impact if the front rank of the Battle group including the bow is contacted. 1 dice for each file with a bow base in a second or third rank.
In effect battle lines move together, they do not fight together. (Though they may overlap enemy fighting a BG adjacent to them)
So in your example you stget 2 dice per base in contact at impact.
phil
putting the arg into argumentative, except for the lists I check where there is no argument!
putting the arg into argumentative, except for the lists I check where there is no argument!
To clarify a bit...
Aside from a special case (scythed chariots) you always get two dice in impact for each front rank base contacted.
You may or may not get extra dice due to the presence of bow within the same BG - but in the example as stated the bow are a separate BG so do not contribute any dice.
(though depending on quality ratings of the various BGs involved the bowmen may help with any cohesion tests by adding +1 for rear support to the BGs doing the fighting, which can be a life saver)
(If you do have bow integral to the BGs doing the fighting, you still may not get extra dice - it depends on whether the chargers are foot or mounted, and whether the integral bow are MF or LF.)
So anyway yes as Phil says 2 dice per bases contacted at impact in this case.
Aside from a special case (scythed chariots) you always get two dice in impact for each front rank base contacted.
You may or may not get extra dice due to the presence of bow within the same BG - but in the example as stated the bow are a separate BG so do not contribute any dice.
(though depending on quality ratings of the various BGs involved the bowmen may help with any cohesion tests by adding +1 for rear support to the BGs doing the fighting, which can be a life saver)
(If you do have bow integral to the BGs doing the fighting, you still may not get extra dice - it depends on whether the chargers are foot or mounted, and whether the integral bow are MF or LF.)
So anyway yes as Phil says 2 dice per bases contacted at impact in this case.
MF Bow do have uses such as protecting a flank from LH, but in general they are not worth taking and are often a liability. Could you take them as LF instead ?Bushi wrote:So in other words, I'd be better off saving the 48 points for the bow and buying another Troop Commander? It's cheaper and I'd have greater tactical use out of him.
Andrew
I disagree. Rear support is very useful - whether it is more useful than another BG undetaking an independent task depends on circumstances and what your plan is.
MF bow can be very useful for providing rear support - okay they don't get to shoot so you can argue it's a waste of points them having bow. But OTOH they are often unprotected, whereas most MF are protected at least, in which case you are not paying for armour which will have no bearing on the game. And they are a bit nippir than HF, so can be redirected in an emergency.
But note if you want the ultimate in cost-effective rear support you wouldn't want 8 bases of your bows. 6 would be better, 4 better still (if your list allows it). You can have them in column behind the join line between the two front BGs and both will get rear support.
I don't have the lists to hand, so I'm not sure how relevant the above is for your particular case...
MF bow can be very useful for providing rear support - okay they don't get to shoot so you can argue it's a waste of points them having bow. But OTOH they are often unprotected, whereas most MF are protected at least, in which case you are not paying for armour which will have no bearing on the game. And they are a bit nippir than HF, so can be redirected in an emergency.
But note if you want the ultimate in cost-effective rear support you wouldn't want 8 bases of your bows. 6 would be better, 4 better still (if your list allows it). You can have them in column behind the join line between the two front BGs and both will get rear support.
I don't have the lists to hand, so I'm not sure how relevant the above is for your particular case...
More food for thought....
The army in question is the Heian Japanese. (Now, it is not the most user friendy I know, but it fits in nicely with my DBM Early Samurai as it's all the same bases.)
Because of the absence of suitable terrain, I have had to think carefully about protecting my army from rout by the preponderance of Impact Foot/ Lancers who, lets face it, rather wipe the floor with MF. As was highlighted in the other thread about chosing terrain, the possibility of me actually benefiting from a large piece of rough going is few and far between.
Since I have the rare option of actually taking FF I was using it to the fullest extent allowing me to put my camp and 4 BG of Bushi within it, space prevents me from a column of four, nor does my army list allow it. This only leaves me with the option of an additional TP, or I could bump up an outflanking Cav group by 2 bases I suppose.
The army in question is the Heian Japanese. (Now, it is not the most user friendy I know, but it fits in nicely with my DBM Early Samurai as it's all the same bases.)
Because of the absence of suitable terrain, I have had to think carefully about protecting my army from rout by the preponderance of Impact Foot/ Lancers who, lets face it, rather wipe the floor with MF. As was highlighted in the other thread about chosing terrain, the possibility of me actually benefiting from a large piece of rough going is few and far between.
Since I have the rare option of actually taking FF I was using it to the fullest extent allowing me to put my camp and 4 BG of Bushi within it, space prevents me from a column of four, nor does my army list allow it. This only leaves me with the option of an additional TP, or I could bump up an outflanking Cav group by 2 bases I suppose.