What kind of units for each unit class do you tend to use?

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gokkel
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What kind of units for each unit class do you tend to use?

Post by gokkel »

Hello, this is my first post here :)

I have won finally my first campaign on Colonel and made my own unit choices. I plan to start some time a new campaign on General or Field Marshal level and thinking now what I can do better in comparison to my Colonel campaign (which was quite close in many scenarios to achieve my aims and which really left me starved on prestige in the last missions in America). Especially evaluating what kind of units I used were doing well and which not so well, and I would like to hear your opinions.

When I played my campaign my aim was obviously to win, and so I would be always in the offense. Therefore I put much focus on having very mobile units.

So for infantry I used exclusively the standard Wehrmacht infantry, since they have 3 movement instead of 2 and they are rather cheap, plus one Gebirgsjäger squad which you get at start and which I thought would help me in the mountains, but I found I barely could use that advantage in my campaign anyway. However, I felt that the mobility advantage was pretty much eaten up in those scenarios where the enemies were heavily fortificated, and Rugged Defence messages ruined the day for me more than once. I read here most people tend to use mainly pioneers since they ignore fortifications, some people also use Grenadiers which have more damage and higher initiative than infantry. Also the cheapness factor seemed more like a liability, since weak units also tend to need more reinforcements than strong ones.

For artillery I exclusively used self-propelled ones. Early in the campaign that felt like the right choice, since while they are more expensive than the towed ones, their attack stats are on par, and you have to also calculate in the costs of transports (esp. Sdkfz 250 is quite expensive) for towed artillery. The ability to move and shoot seemed invaluable in comparison to towed ones which first have to be brought in position first and can then fire only on the next move again. However, as the campaign progressed, even the latest SiG 38(t) or Hummel artillery have still the same attack stats as the Sturmpanzer in Poland, while the towed ones get considerably stronger! Wurfrahmen are a bit of an exception, however their range is smaller, so I gave those only to my artillery units with +1 Range heroes (which were only 2 in the end). I am thinking now to use next time either only towed artillery or a mix of towed and self-propelled artillery. Probably also biting the bullet and dealing rather with the lower range of rocket artillery in comparison to standard one, at least for the self-propelled ones.

For tanks I did the same thinking and upgraded in America all my Tanks to Panther tanks besides those with +1 Movement heroes, which I upgraded to Tiger II tanks (also only 2). However I found several of my Panthers in America being obliterated by the enemy tanks, while my Tiger II could take much more damage. Since I was lacking prestige (in the last turns I could only afford green reinforcements even for my elite troops) I replaced some losses with Jagdpanthers, but I totally forgot that anti-tank units suffer a malus when used in attack so they didn't do as well as expected, although I could still finish my campaign in the last turn!

Another observation I made is that people here seem to rely much more on Tanks than I did. My army was much more infantry, artillery and air heavy, and I used Tanks primarily as Tank destroyer units (with little help of my few Tactical Bombers) and only in second role to support my infantry in dealing with artillery etc., so until America I only used Panzer III instead of Panzer IV tanks. Those Panzer III tanks didn't do terribly against infantry, artillery and Flak either, but when looking back and comparing to my later Panther and Tiger tanks I believe life would have been much easier if instead of getting so much infantry I would have got some more Panzer IV tanks additionally. In America my balance shifted more towards tanks though since I lost a lot of infantry squads to American tanks and I noticed that replacing them with new infantry squads doesn't make any sense anymore.

For air units, I noticed that figher bombers are quite decent at start but become totally useless as the game progresses, while the cheap Stukas were able to destroy some of the smaller American tanks from full strength in a single attack! I had two Dornier Pfeil fighter bombers in America, but they were neither able to deal with enemy air units or ground targets. Even the strongest fighters "Schwalbe", while being quite strong, do take also just as heavy losses from the enemy fighters, so anything less than that seems quite uninteresting when gaining air superiority. Strategic Bombers were always useful, I bought two Heinkel bombers already in Poland and upgraded later to the new Heinkel model; in the end I had 4 of them.

I didn't use Anti-Air units because they seemed pretty useless to me and fighters did the job just fine.


So in short summary, my army in my Colonel campaign looked like this:

Infantry: mostly Wehrmacht + starting Gebirgsjäger, at end one Brückenpionier
Artillery: mostly Sturmpanzer later upgraded to SiG 38(t), few Wurfrahmen (+range heroes) and StuH 42
Tanks: only few at start and all Panzer III, later more and upgraded to Panther and few Tiger II (+movement heroes)
Anti-Tank: bought only at end a few Jagdpanther because of lack of Prestige
Fighter: always newest models, at end I had 8 Schwalbe fighters
Tac Bombers: 1-2 Stukas and starting BF110, at end also two Dornier Pfeil fighter bombers which I was very unhappy with
Strategic Bombers: bought already 2 Heinkel bombers in Poland, at end I had 4 of the newest Heinkel bombers
evan748
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Post by evan748 »

Hello, welcome...

I almost always divide my force into two separate task groups. Sometimes i make a fast group and a slow(er) group and sometimes two identical groups.

I also almost always have 2 x Panzer IIIs and a Panzer IV as the heart of each group backed up by 2-3 Inf, at least 2 Arty and perhaps an AA.

My Air Force too I divide in two and try to assign one air group to each ground group. My Air structure is usually something like 2-3 fighters, 1 TAC and one Strat per group.

I keep trying new things but thats typical of how it looks.


Mainly I just Tailor my core around those two groups of 3 tanks depending what i want to try. later in the game when you get Panthers I will add a 4th armor unit to each group. If i want to stay fast a jagdpanther or a +movement Tiger/TigerII. If I'm using a slow force i might make that force into TigerIIs and/or a + movement maus. If i get defenseive maps thats out the window and just have to buy tigerIIs usually followed by losing interest and restarting lol (not cause its too hard just that its a huge slug match).

My arty I try to mix up though my favorites are the towed howitzers and wurframens. Rail guns are actually fairly handy too as they can move so far allowing you to move back after you run out of ammo to reload with out needing to defend it. and the 4 range lets you free up space at the front (sometimes can get tight). make sure to study the rail lines though before deploying lol.

Inf I usually go mainly normal wermacht with grenadiers as the heavy hitter. But now i know about pioneers ignoring entrenchment i will prolly take one of those in each group over the grenadiers.





- Evan -
Fimconte
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Post by Fimconte »

On Infantry:
I actually tend to have 1-2 Brückenpioniere and 2 Fallschirmjäger units.
There's quite a few maps where you can abuse Brückenpioniere to encircle the enemy and wipe out his Artillery/AA units from behind, allowing you achieve DV's much more easily.

Same goes for the Fallschirmjägers.
'Their ability to insert deep into the enemy rear allows you to stop the AI from building up huge fortifications at those last two DV's.
They don't even need to destroy the defending infantry if it's too deeply entrenched.
You can have them sit on the Airfield and deny the AI from buying troops around that city.

The reason Pioneers and Grenadiers are so effective in campaign is that what the AI does not see, it does not attack when it has something else to chew on.
Also since the AI likes to bulk up their defences and let them sit and entrench themselves you really want the ignore entrenchment ability of the Pioneers.

A standard assault of a city for me goes something like this:

Turn 1:
Scout with Tanks from the flanks.
*Strategic Bombardment on primary target if no AA in range.
Attacks of opportunity if no potential casualties will be taken by the tanks on suppressed targets.
Move in Pioneers/Grenadiers mounted in trucks 2 hexes away from the target (ie out of their spotting range).
Move towed Artillery behind the Pioneers/Grenadiers.

Turn 2:
If possible assault enemy AA/Artillery with tanks.
Move Pioneers/Grenadiers 2 hexes close to the enemy.
Move Artillery 1(*2 if with a hero) and suppress enemy (*AA)/artillery/primary target.
*Strategic Bombardment if AA is suppressed.
Attack with Infantry.


On Artillery:
The problem with most self-propelled artillery is that they have very low ammunition values, so you'll be reloading them more often and thus missing out on a turn per one offensive compared to one turn per two offensives (in most cases) for towed artillery.

Also as I mentioned above, the turn lost from setting up towed artillery isn't a issue since you need to move your infantry along anyway, and you'll lose a turn even with towed artillery (although they can support tanks I guess, but that's also using precious ammunition).

The exception to this rule being the +1 range Wurfrahmen 40, since it's very high SA value makes up for the low ammunition count.


On AT:
Actually the malus is only -3 initiative, which is not that important since Allied armour has almost universally a initiative 10, with the M26 @11.
This means JagdPanthers are still +1 initative vs Shermans, JagdTigers at +3.

You should also whenever possible take advantage of mass-attack, which would increase the initiative difference even more.

However I think the problem was that the American tank crews were veteran (2-3 stars if I'm not mistaken), while your JagdPanthers were fresh green troops.
This meant that the initiative balance tipped over to the American side, as 1 star gives a bonus 1 initiative (or 10% whichever is lower).

So had your AT crews been experienced, things might've turned out differently.


On the Luftwaffe:
Fighters:
Veteran Me262's, while impressive, are still threatened by a mass attack from Pacific Theatre veteran pilots,
especially if they are equipped with the P51H/P47N.
And on the East Coast, the radar towers provide a considerable initiative Bonus to friendly Air assets.

Tactical Bombers:
I usually disband the BF110 in Norway, you can use that prestige to buy something much more useful, like 2 Ju87's.
Late War I tend to use the Ju87D (if used at all) in a SA role against enemy Artillery, since it often doesn't put much of a dent on late-war Armour.

The problem with the Fighter-Bombers is that they offer a poor hybrid of a Fighter and a Tactical Bomber, failing to do either job properly.
And their high cost reflects in their reinforcement costs as well, as using Elite Reinforcements on Ju87's is considerably cheaper than using them on a Bf110.

Strategic Bombers:
He 177's are the Bomb.
_Flin_
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Post by _Flin_ »

Hi Gokkel,

welcome.

First, it is hard to always use "the best" units, due to prestige reasons. I just yesterday started a new campaign (i play only Field Marshal, after 15 years of PG everything else seemed inappropriate), because I oversaw an important detail: You can disband units in the deployment screen and get back the money for them. This is extremely important, since you can much easier get the "best" units. My campaign got stuck around Kursk and obliterated at the Russian counterattack, on the second go I had a hard time at Sealion, so back to Norway with the new information.

So, with the ability to disband untis and get back the money, it is possible to massively increse the power of. your army. And this influences the combination of weapons hevily, therefore I hope you excuse this rather lengthy sidenote.

When it comes to deciding the exact composition of my armies, I consider the following points: Raw power, versatility in the army over versatility in units, strategic need and upgradability. And cost, of course. After Poland, it is reasonable to disband all Panzer I and II to get Panzer III. They are the best at that time and will be upgradable until 1943, when they will be upgraded or scrapped to get Tigers or Panthers. The next unit to disband is the BF110. While it pains to lose quite some experience, the Stuka is so much better as a weapon vs. ground units. and thats what tacticals are for. With level bombers I just get the best: Ju88. later evtl. a heinckel. Buy if you can't afford the upgrade, although with planes the upgrade decision is harder.

When it comes to artillery I try to mix. Self propelled are wonderful, but they do not upgrade and lack ammo. And, as you have noticed, there is quite some entreching going on. Considering the rugged defense, btw, you just dont attack into entrenched units. If they are entrenched,use Engineers or Paratroopers. Try to get entrenchment down to about 2, and even then try to suppress them so that only 2-4 units fire back. Sometimes desperate measures are necessary, but usually the time advantage is less than the cost in potential unit loss on the counter attack, prestige loss and time loss for reinforcement. These entrenchment situations are where the towed artillery excels. With good positioning it is possible to shoot almost every round. Drive it there, shoot next round, wait til the troops take the city and then move it towards its next target. The upgrade costs are minimal, up to 1945, so not using them is an expensive decision. Nevertheless the advantage to move and shoot and being a hard target makes me favor about half of my artillery being selfpropelled.

About infantry after i switched to a real keyboard.
_Flin_
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Post by _Flin_ »

With Infantry it is really not too hard. Pioneers are obviously the best. Whenever you have Pioneers, you will notice that their kills and experience gains are just way higher than anyone elses. Start early to disband infantry units and get pioneers instead. They will easily make up the experience loss and are well worth the few additional prestige. Since you usually move around with 2-3 army groups, it is sensible to have a pioneer in every one of them, so 2-3 pioneers are ok to have.

The next infantry unit I always have is a bridge engineer. There are so many occurrences when one of these nets you 2-3 turns, or more. Whether it is Low Countries, France, Sealion, Greece, Barbarossa, Stalingrad, Kursk, there is seldomly not that one river that you like to cross to attack a city's defences from the back or just bypass a heavily guarded bridge.

Then I love my paratroopers. I try to have 2 whenever possible, since they can singlehandedly take key objectives far away. And if not, they at least divert ressources and reinforcements from the front. Land them in forests or hills, out of sight from the enemy, then move one forward to scout and the other next to or into the city. Then off to the next airport and repeat.

So if you have 2 Paras, 3 Pioneers, 1 Bridge Engineer, there really isn't that much left, ist there? I like to keep the Gebirgsjäger mountain infantry from Poland, since they have no real disadvantage and the hill-movement is really good every time you can use it. And if you can't, they are as fast as a normal infantry. The rest I usually fill up with grenadiers, since the movement is usually not that much of an issue, they travel in cars ;-). Plus, they have decent hard attack as well, an defend well.

The hardest part in troop composition for me is if and when to upgrade to the FW190a. And which infantry transport to use, since the expensive one really gets to you with reinforments. For these I haven't found any answers, but probably a middle way is wise.
Fimconte
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Post by Fimconte »

_Flin_ wrote:With Infantry it is really not too hard. Pioneers are obviously the best. Whenever you have Pioneers, you will notice that their kills and experience gains are just way higher than anyone elses. Start early to disband infantry units and get pioneers instead. They will easily make up the experience loss and are well worth the few additional prestige. Since you usually move around with 2-3 army groups, it is sensible to have a pioneer in every one of them, so 2-3 pioneers are ok to have.
Why use Grenadiers at all then, the 1 initiative can be useful, but in most cases you do not attack unsuppressed troops.
With 43' upgrade, the Grenadiers do gain a extra +1 HA, so there's that to consider I suppose.
_Flin_ wrote: The hardest part in troop composition for me is if and when to upgrade to the FW190a. And which infantry transport to use, since the expensive one really gets to you with reinforments. For these I haven't found any answers, but probably a middle way is wise.
If playing a offensive campaign (for ex. longest path to the US), in my mind the Fw190a can be side-stepped as it becomes available in Kursk, where the available Soviet air assets are still easily disposed of with the BF109G.
Same goes for Moscow 43. You don't need the Fw190a to deal with the Yak-9D, especially if your BF10Gs are piloted by veterans.
Cue East Coast and the upgrade into Me 262s.

However in a Defensive campaign you have more pressing need for the Fw190, as the American P47s, British Spitefires (VB/IX) and the Tempest Mk.Vs can put a serious hurt on the BF109G from as early as Italy.
gokkel
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Post by gokkel »

Thanks for the answers so far, I feared my opening post would have been too long to be read :D

I split my ground forces usually also in up to 4 more or less independent attacking groups. Sometimes they may fight in start or end a bit together depending on the map, but they are usually meant to be independent. So at start my main attacking groups were usually consisting of 2 or 3 infantry squads, 1 tank (rarely 2) and 1-2 artillery units, tanks sometimes helped out in other attacking groups to double an enemy tank. My air units with their high mobility were flexible and went where they were needed, didn't assign them strictly into seperate groups. In USA I obviously had some more tanks then and sometimes a bit more artillery and due to losses a few less infantry units.

My campaign that I finished was rather short I have to add (I took the Rush to Moscow so I missed Kiev, Stalingrad etc.). So maybe I lacked a bit experience on my units when I was in USA (1940 -> 1945 is a huge jump).

I think for my next campaign, after what I also read here, I will disband some of my infantry and my BF110 in Norway and get some Pioneers and Stukas instead, and I will try out the towed artillery. Also will use more tanks (after all the game is called Panzer Corps :D) and take the longer way in the campaign (though, when I start on Field Marshal I am not sure I will be even able to reach the ultimate victory yet!). I don't know yet though how to set up my tank composition, if I should keep relying on Panthers or use more Tiger II tanks, although they feel very slow to me.

Btw since you say the Grenadier 43 has higher heavy attack than Pioneers, is that even relevant at that stage? I found it doesn't make much sense to attack (or defend against) tanks with infantry later on anyway. Maybe when you can put them in close cover, but I found I rarely had that opportunity when in the offensive. But I can imagine that the game is very different on those scenarios where you find yourself in the defence...
Fimconte
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Post by Fimconte »

gokkel wrote:Thanks for the answers so far, I feared my opening post would have been too long to be read :D

I split my ground forces usually also in up to 4 more or less independent attacking groups. Sometimes they may fight in start or end a bit together depending on the map, but they are usually meant to be independent. So at start my main attacking groups were usually consisting of 2 or 3 infantry squads, 1 tank (rarely 2) and 1-2 artillery units, tanks sometimes helped out in other attacking groups to double an enemy tank. My air units with their high mobility were flexible and went were they were needed, didn't assign them strictly into seperate groups. In USA I obviously had some more tanks then and sometimes a bit more artillery and due to losses a few less infantry units.
Yes, compartmentalizing your troops into task forces is a good way to keep your offensives on point.

Personally I tend to use a 1:2:1.5 mix of Pioneers:Tanks:Artillery by the middle of the war (ie. Barbarossa).
gokkel wrote: My campaign that I finished was rather short I have to add (I took the Rush to Moscow so I missed Kiev, Stalingrad etc.). So maybe I lacked a bit experience on my units when I was in USA (1940 -> 1945 is a huge jump).
If you won Sea Lion 40, then yes, it was a exceptionally short campaign.
gokkel wrote: I think for my next campaign, after what I also read here, I will disband some of my infantry and my BF110 in Norway and get some Pioneers and Stukas instead, and I will try out the towed artillery. Also will use more tanks (after all the game is called Panzer Corps :D) and take the longer way in the campaign (though, when I start on Field Marshal I am not sure I will be even able to reach the ultimate victory yet!). I don't know yet though how to set up my tank composition, if I should keep relying on Panthers or use more Tiger II tanks, although they feel very slow to me.
Remember in Norway you get access to the SdKfz 251.
Disbanding a unit with trucks, also disbands the trucks, refunding the 50 prestige as well.

I also recommend saving some prestige to buy PzIVDs in the Low Countries,
they have slightly more utility than the PzIIIs since majority of your opponents is comprised of Soft Targets.
gokkel wrote: Btw since you say the Grenadier 43 has higher heavy attack than Pioneers, is that even relevant at that stage? I found it doesn't make much sense to attack (or defend against) tanks with infantry later on anyway. Maybe when you can put them in close cover, but I found I rarely had that opportunity when in the offensive. But I can imagine that the game is very different on those scenarios where you find yourself in the defence...
In most cases no, at least personally I use exclusively Pioneers (with Brückenpionieres/Fallschirmsjägers as specialists for certain maps).

However a tank attacking entrenched infantry on close terrain (hills, woods, cities) will take considerable damage in most cases.
Also infantry can relatively safely attack tanks that foolishly stumble into close terrain.
And anyway there are situations where you need to use Infantry to attack tanks sometimes (ex. a IS-2 that retreated with 1 strength, only unit in range is that Pioneer/Grenadier), so it's good to have some HA capability.

And personally I take cities with infantry, since doing so with tanks can often result in a counter-attack that results in one dead Tiger.


P.S.
Don't reinforce units unless you absolutely must, if you can continue the push and finish the map without reinforcing that 3 strength Pioneer unit you will save a ton of prestige since regular reinforcements are free on the deployment screen and elite ones only cost 50% less than when on-map.

Early in the war, don't shrug away from using regular reinforcements for troops that take excessive damage either, because of the way experience works.
Green troops earn experience much faster than 3 star veterans.

Code: Select all

Exp growth in percentage of raw experience earned.
ExpGrowRate0	100
ExpGrowRate1	50
ExpGrowRate2	25
ExpGrowRate3	12
ExpGrowRate4	6
ExpGrowRate5	3
_Flin_
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Post by _Flin_ »

gokkel wrote:Sometimes they may fight in start or end a bit together depending on the map, but they are usually meant to be independent. So at start my main attacking groups were usually consisting of 2 or 3 infantry squads, 1 tank (rarely 2) and 1-2 artillery units, tanks sometimes helped out in other attacking groups to double an enemy tank.
This is - in my opinion - a wrong composition. Too much infantry. So with 2.5 inf, 1.5 tank and 1.5 art you end up with 22 ground units at Kursk, assuming you go for 6 planes. This means you have 10 infantry, 6 tanks and 6 artillery, plus elite units. Since you have to split that in two, you end up with 3 tanks in north and south, or with 4 in the south and 2 in the north. This will not be enough, as I figured out the hard way (had a recon and 2 AAs as well, instead of infantry). The artillery sounds right, but you really want 2 panzers more.

@Fimconte: Thank you for the tips! The only reason not to use pioneers is their price and reinforcement costs. I'll try to use Pioneers only in my current campaign, though.
Fimconte
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Post by Fimconte »

_Flin_ wrote: @Fimconte: Thank you for the tips! The only reason not to use pioneers is their price and reinforcement costs. I'll try to use Pioneers only in my current campaign, though.
While that might be a issue early in the war, the 43 Grenadiers are only 6 prestige cheaper than 43 Pioneers.
And until 3 stars I tend to use (free) regular reinforcements unless it makes the unit fall below the 100/200 mark.
gokkel
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Post by gokkel »

@Flin: Yes, I noticed over the course of my campaign that I had too much infantry ^^ As I said, until Moscow it somehow worked out, but when I landed in America I got in trouble a few times, and I won in the first East Coast scenario only a marginal win on the last turn (you can tell I was pretty shocked when I suddenly saw the huge blob of enemy tanks while I still had my lots of infantry and relatively few tank units; had to replace several dead units, and those new ones were then many inexperienced ones).

edit: Actually looked now in my old save file from deployment phase in Moscow. I had 8 infantry units (7 Wehrmacht + 1 Gebirgsjäger), 5 tanks (3 Panzer III + 2x SE Panzer III), 1 Recon, 6 artillery (5x Sturmpanzer, 1 Wurfrahmen), 6x BF 109, 2x Ju 87, 1x BF 110, 2x Heinkel 111H2.

In the last America scenario (before deployment and buying new core units) I had 7 infantry units (5x Wehrmacht + 1 Gebirgsjäger + 1 Brückenpionier), 9 tanks (5x Panther, 2x SE Panther, 2x Tiger II), 1 Recon, 2x Jagdpanther, 7x artillery (1x Wurfrahmen, 2x StuH 42, 3x sIG 38(t), 1x 280mm K5 artillery), 8 Schwalbe Fighters, 3 Stukas, 4 Heinkel 177A Bombers.
Last edited by gokkel on Fri Oct 28, 2011 9:54 am, edited 1 time in total.
_Flin_
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Post by _Flin_ »

gokkel wrote:As I said, until Moscow it somehow worked out, but when I landed in America I got in trouble a few times, and I won in the first East Coast scenario only a marginal win on the last turn (you can tell I was pretty shocked when I suddenly saw the huge blob of enemy tanks while I still had my lots of infantry and relatively few tank units;
I paid for it in the Moscow scenario, when I desperately needed those tanks in the southern sector to fight both infantry and tanks. Cost me the decisive victory. Too many tanks, however, aren't good either. Especially when I think about Low Countries and France, where those early tanks are often more of a liability than an asset, and Sea Lion 40, where there are exactly three british tanks on the whole map and most other units are entrenched or in cities.
had to replace several dead units, and those new ones were then many inexperienced ones).
Which explains your prestige problems :-)
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Post by rezaf »

In stock PzC, experience is barely worth it, though.
When I started playing PzC, I always was short on prestige, because I tried to reinforce everything with elite reinforcements, because I was used to Panzer General's VERY useful additional stars. In PzC, experience has a much lower impact. I'm experimenting with modified settings in my modding efforts for that reason.
Anyway, low XP units are not that much of a problem, in my experience.
Though the starting XP setting for new units you can make in the editor should affect newly purchased campaign units, imo.

As for troop composition ... currently I employ a good deal of INF, at least half as much ART, a couple of tanks and - as soon as possible - 4 fighters. I usually keep the tac bombers around for a bit, but imo, they are barely worth the hassle. No recon units, no AT, no AA, no Strat Bombers - at least not in my core army.
As for Inf, I tend to stick to Wehrmacht Inf these days - though they get (far too) worthless late in the war, being much too easily lost to attacks from one of the monster tanks.
And for Art, I tend to use the latest towed variant which has decent ammo supplies ... I think it's the sFH18(?).
Tanks, finally ... I love the Panther when it becomes available, but usually have two or three tigers and maybe even a Maus on hand. But - I know I'm pretty much alone with that opinion - I feel the late game units, especially tanks - are MASSIVELY overpriced.
_____
rezaf
evan748
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Post by evan748 »

gokkel wrote:I don't know yet though how to set up my tank composition, if I should keep relying on Panthers or use more Tiger II tanks, although they feel very slow to me.
If you manage to stay on the offensive maps you can get away with mostly/all panthers reinforced with jagdpanthers but you will need them to be experienced(including the jagdpanthers) and you need to take care, they are quite fragile... eg: use air/arty to soften up the heavier enemy tanks. If you get a +movement bonus on a tank it makes sense to make that tank a TigerII or even a TigerI(as a rich mans panzerIII-N).

It also can work to take one group as your heavy group and one as light. if one group has 3 TigerIIs then you can cater to there slow speed by also giving them slow Arty(Sigs) or just follow the railway(with your rail guns) while your ligh tpanther/jagdpanther group takes less defended targets.

Panthers to survive also will need to know ahead of time where the enemy heavies are not stumble onto them so a recon is pretty impotant.

If you get Moscow then you dont have to deal with the *really* heavy armor scenarios. The U.S ones tend to give you more options as they mix up tank destroyers with some heavy shermans and most often only one or mabye two pershings(the only really nasty american tank). This is why recon is important. Those american tank destroyers have big attack but not much armor so if you get your whole group of panthers just out of sight you can take out most of his weaker units in one hit.

To be safe though it is probably best to have at least a couple TigerIIs in your force but on the offense its certainly not 100% necassary.
Fimconte
Sergeant - 7.5 cm FK 16 nA
Sergeant - 7.5 cm FK 16 nA
Posts: 204
Joined: Fri Aug 12, 2011 11:12 am

Post by Fimconte »

I don't think I've ever used Panthers since it's very rare I don't have +1 move heroes on my tanks.
MartyWard
Master Sergeant - Bf 109E
Master Sergeant - Bf 109E
Posts: 492
Joined: Mon Aug 15, 2011 3:46 pm

Post by MartyWard »

I'm just about to start the USA West Coast in my current play through on Colonel level. Going from memory I think I have 4 infantry, 3 grenadiers, 1 mountain, 1 bridge, 1 pioneer, 10 tiger II's, 3 Panthers, 3 Jadgpanthers, 1 SE Panther, 2 SE Tiger II's, 2 x towed art, 1 SiG, 1 Wolfram, 6 ME 262, 2 FW190G, 2 ME110G and 3 HE 177. I think I could have an additional 2 units but I don't have a ton of prestiege so I'm not getting them.
In past playthrough's I usually end up with something similiar.
impar
Master Sergeant - Bf 109E
Master Sergeant - Bf 109E
Posts: 496
Joined: Sun Jul 24, 2011 8:53 am
Location: Portugal

Post by impar »

rezaf wrote:And for Art, I tend to use the latest towed variant which has decent ammo supplies ... I think it's the sFH18(?).
Consider the upgraded towed artillery units.
Ammo isnt such a big disadvantage considering the extra power.

Something I wrote on another thread:
impar wrote:A 25 series with 15cm with 7 ammo first, then 21cm with 5 ammo and finally a self propeled 3-range with 4 ammo (X are shots, O are resupply):
XXXXXXXOXXXXXXXOXXXXXXXOX - 3 resupllies
XXXXXOXXXXXOXXXXXOXXXXXOX - 4 resupllies
XXXXOXXXXOXXXXOXXXXOXXXXO - 5 resupllies

Both the 15cm and self-propelled (except Wespe) have 12 Soft Attack, 21cm has 18 Soft Attack.
Even factoring the reduced rate of fire stat, 18 SA is still more powerful than the 12 SA, and only one extra turn is missed resupplying compared to 15cm.
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