Not sure if this has been covered before, but I have a question about the factors for slingers against armoured troops.
The factor against armoured foot is a "-". As I understand it, sling shot will have a concussive effect sufficient to dibilitate as well the effect on unarmoured troops.
I'm not suggesting that slings should be a "+" against armoured troops, but would a "No effect" be more accurate?
I freely admit my research into this is limited (mainly connected with conquest of latin America by Spain) but would welcome comments/views by others.
Gary
Slingers
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eldiablito
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slings are good, but not THAT good
Hello,
So I too love mesoamerica, both pre and during the fatal, Columbian Exchange. So, if you read Bernal Diaz De Castillo's account of his battles against the Aztecs and Tlaxcallans, the sling stones were very effective against unarmoured Spaniards, but a simple shield made them nearly invulnerable. Any exposed flesh was seriously endangered when the slingers and dart throwers began their volleys.
And you are also correct, it seems that a shot to the helmet would "disrupt" a single Spaniard quite easily. However, this game tries to (in some ways) simulate the historical accounts from a unit by unit perspective and not Spaniard by Spaniard. So, when the Conquistadores stayed together, they were very calm under the enemy volleys and were able to cut their way through hordes of native warriors (I personally doubt the exact numbers which Bernal counts in the thousands and tens of thousands).
If you want to recreate his memoir, then yes, the slings should have a - POA against armour.
So I too love mesoamerica, both pre and during the fatal, Columbian Exchange. So, if you read Bernal Diaz De Castillo's account of his battles against the Aztecs and Tlaxcallans, the sling stones were very effective against unarmoured Spaniards, but a simple shield made them nearly invulnerable. Any exposed flesh was seriously endangered when the slingers and dart throwers began their volleys.
And you are also correct, it seems that a shot to the helmet would "disrupt" a single Spaniard quite easily. However, this game tries to (in some ways) simulate the historical accounts from a unit by unit perspective and not Spaniard by Spaniard. So, when the Conquistadores stayed together, they were very calm under the enemy volleys and were able to cut their way through hordes of native warriors (I personally doubt the exact numbers which Bernal counts in the thousands and tens of thousands).
If you want to recreate his memoir, then yes, the slings should have a - POA against armour.
Have to confess that I don't agree. Spaniards in Mesoamerica were generally subjected to very heavy missile fire of different missile types depending on which people they were facing. They quickly adopted cotton armour, both for man and horse as a response to the high missile usage but were generally won ; when they didn't, they were dead. Whilst the number of allies were generally downplayed, they were initailly heavily outnumbered . I believe that the factors are correct. Contemporary (ish) accounts are easily available and are a must if you are serious about learning information about your army. Bernal Diaz is the man!
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eldiablito
- Administrative Corporal - SdKfz 251/1
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- Joined: Sun Mar 30, 2008 10:40 pm
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Hello Kadeshuk,
I don't see how we disagree. I did not mention the volume of missile fire, although I freely admit to only referring to Bernal Diaz's biased accounts. As far as the armor is concerned, your mention of cotton armour does not contradict what wrote earlier. Finally, we both agree that the POAs seem appropriate for a Renaissance era simulation.
So, without trying to sound obtuse, I don't see any argument (except potentially over minor details).
I don't see how we disagree. I did not mention the volume of missile fire, although I freely admit to only referring to Bernal Diaz's biased accounts. As far as the armor is concerned, your mention of cotton armour does not contradict what wrote earlier. Finally, we both agree that the POAs seem appropriate for a Renaissance era simulation.
So, without trying to sound obtuse, I don't see any argument (except potentially over minor details).