MELLE BETWEEN MULTIPLE BATTLE GROUPS

[theboxroom]

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/8/fogquestion.jpg - (In case I have got this link right)

I am Very new to Fog and played my first game yesterday after a read through of the rules. I come from a background of DBA/DBM which may be the root cause of my confusion, anyway. . . .

I arrived at the above (slightly contrived to test my knowledge of the rules) situation and completely lost the plot.

My questions are, who fights who - and why? These were individual Battle Groups and not Battle Lines.
I made it that the two left-hand HF fought the Elephants, the other two were chosen not to fight.
The three right-hand HF fought 2 MF and had 2 LF as overlaps - but does that effect the POA's with being "lesser" troops?

I have trawled the rules and the internet, but the answer does not seem clear. Perhaps I have read too much!?

Many thanks in anticipation.

[ravenflight]

http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/8/fogquestion.jpg/

(I hope that I have got this link right)

I am Very new to Fog and played my first game yesterday after a read through of the rules. I come from a background of DBA/DBM which may be the root cause of my confusion, anyway. . . .

I arrived at the above (slightly contrived to test my knowledge of the rules) situation and completely lost the plot.

My questions are, who fights who - and why? These were individual Battle Groups and not Battle Lines.
I made it that the two left-hand HF fought the Elephants, the other two were chosen not to fight.
The three right-hand HF fought 2 MF and had 2 LF as overlaps - but does that effect the POA's with being "lesser" troops?

I have trawled the rules and the internet, but the answer does not seem clear. Perhaps I have read too much!?

Many thanks in anticipation.

You basically do the dice per 'base'.

it would be something like this:

2 bases of Elephants fighting 2 bases of HF
1 base of MF fighting 1 base of HF
2 bases of MF fighting 2 bases of HF
1 base of LF overlapping.

you work out the total 'given' and 'received' to work out who has to test.

So lets say this is what happens:

2 bases of Elephants fighting 2 bases of HF - Elephants give out 2 hits recieve 1
1 base of MF fighting 1 base of HF - both give each other 1 hit.
2 bases of MF fighting 2 bases of HF - HF give out 2 hits and recieve 1
1 base of LF overlapping. - LF give out 1 hit.

Well, the Elephants gave out 2 and received 1... so don't have to test
the MF gave out 2 hits, but received 4 - so have to test
the HF on the left gave out 2 hits but received 3 so have to test.
the other HF gave out 2 hits and received 1 so don't have to test.

Does that make sense?

[grahambriggs]

Agree with the principle Ravenflight but think you may have miscounted one on the files.

In essence hand to hand combat is done file by file. I'm assuming the diagram is shaded where necessary to represent different BGs. Also that this is the melee phase (impact phase is similar in broad scope but you don't count overlaps).

So, take each file in succession: the first on the left has one Hf base against on elephant base. Work out how many dice to throw (you'll find the HF get 1 and the elephant gets 2). Then use the Points of Advantage to work out what you need to score a hit. Then work your way down the line (keep a note of how many hits).

When you're done all five files, look at each BG on both sides. Any that have taken more hits than they gave out will need a cohesion test then a death roll. Any that have drawn or won do not take a cohesion test, but may need a death roll (there is a +2 on the roll for not losing and a +1 for being elephants so light casualties when winning are no problem).

After that's done, test to kill generals (only if they were fighting, and you took two casualites or more).

so in essence it's fight file by file. Then work out what battle groups are in danger of losing cohesion, then bases, then generals.

Written down like this it looks complicated. The Full turn Sequence (cunningly hidden a few pages from the back of the rule book) helps by telling you the order in which to do things. But the good news is that you do all the hand to hand combate using the same basic mechanism, in every game, so bear with it and you'll soon find it's second nature.

[ravenflight]

Agree with the principle Ravenflight but think you may have miscounted one on the files.

Yeah, I think you're right. I'm tired.

It's a fairly complex combat, and I'm not sure if the LF are a part of the BG with the HF, in which case things change etc etc...

[theboxroom]

Thanks guys. It is now perfectly clear. The second reply outlining a file by file resolution and subsequent totalling of hits give/received is the key for me. I think that with my background it is logical.

You have also saved my marriage. I omitted to say that I was playing my wife who has NEVER gamed before but liked the "pretty and colourful book" so gave it a try. She turned into a blood crazed monster, mercilessly slaughtered me and thinks my confusion over the rules was a ploy to claim a draw! And I thought that the menopause was bad!

[ravenflight]

Thanks guys. It is now perfectly clear. The second reply outlining a file by file resolution and subsequent totalling of hits give/received is the key for me. I think that with my background it is logical.

You have also saved my marriage. I omitted to say that I was playing my wife who has NEVER gamed before but liked the "pretty and colourful book" so gave it a try. She turned into a blood crazed monster, mercilessly slaughtered me and thinks my confusion over the rules was a ploy to claim a draw! And I thought that the menopause was bad!

No worries mate,

It was a complex combat, but realise that you will probably do lots of things wrong until you get the hang of it - it's a good set of rules.

I'd be interested in knowing how the formation got created.

Are the LF a part of the HF BG?

[elysiumsolutions@fsmail.n]

Just to explain why the previous posters are asking if the LF are part of the same BG as the HF.

If they are a seperate BG just the right hand file would fight (at POAs vs the MF). It would get one dice as LF lose one dice per two vs the MF.

If they are part of the same BG as the HF the LF in the 2nd rank of the 2nd file from the right also fights. It would use the POA of the front rank base and add an extra dice (as you lose one per two you don't have 2 so dont lose it).

As Graham said you work things out per file. However, once you get comfortable with the mechanics you often roll BG vs BG.

In your example (if the LF are part of the HF BG) you would have the following dice

4 Elephants (EL roll 2 dice per front rank base) vs 2 HF
3MF vs 6HF (effectively)
MF (no dice) vs 1 LF

Then determine the results per BG as Graham detailed.

Paul

[ravenflight]

More info (perhaps becoming info overload):

I use three different coloured dice. It's actually recommended in the rules. So, in this case (going by memory here as I can't see the diagram on my phone) i would have used one colour for the elephants, one colour for the MF fighting the HF that also fight the elephants, and a third colour for the rest of the MF. Roll them all together & re-roll any relevant rerolls and then worry about factors. A 5 or a 6 always hits, a 1 or a 2 always misses, so you only really have to worry about the 3's and 4's. You'll get quick at determining POA's so you'll rarely look at the sheet.

If the opponent does the same thing and you put the number of hits BEHIND the various files (or groups of files if they are the same POA and same BG) and you can quickly work out who won & lost for cohesion test purposes and also which generals are at risk of being beheaded (>2 hits on a BG they lead into battle from the front rank.

It becomes very intuitive very quickly.

Have fun

[theboxroom]

Regards the LF - as I said, it was my good lady wife's first wargame and despite all my pleas, she insisted that this is what she wanted to do. I became fine with it because it would be a good test of my understanding of the rules (failed).

The LF were not a part of the HF BG and I was curious as to what other effects they may have had on the BG if they were/were not. Both questions perfectly answered and they have been immensely useful in my further "studies" of the rules. I agree that they are an excellent set of rules.
Thanks chaps.