Bow*

[Luddite]

Hi all,

We've come late to the FoG party and i'm sure i'll have a couple of probably simple questions that i can't find explicitely in the rules.

I've tried the search here without success, and 3000 topics is a bit much to trawl through so apologies if these have been dealt with.

I'd appreciate it if you could give me page references to the rules for the answers so i can see where i've missed these things.

OK.


Bow* & Bow

What's the difference? Bow* seems to get half the shooting dice but i can't find anything in the rules explaining what the difference between these types of bows is.


All help with page ref's welcome!

Cheers
Ludd

[batesmotel]

The different weapon category descriptions are in one of the appendices. There are tables defining armor, weapons and terrain all together.

Basically Bow* are the same weapons as Bow but represent units where only some of the troops have bow or where the troops are not as skilled in using them as dedicated archers since the bow is not their primary weapon. Troops like Tagmatic Byzantic Lancers where some of the back ranks are equipped with bows or like Highlander impact foot where some back rank troops are equipped with bows are classed as Bow*. Besides not getting as many shooting dice as Bow, foot with Bow* also do not get support shooting from rear ranks in impact.

Chris

[BillMc]

And, Bow* do not have to pass a test to charge.

Bill

[marshalney2000]

Being picky but with the highlanders it was actually the front upper class rankers who had the bow while the rear ranks had at best a dirk or farm type implement.
John

[dave_r]

Being picky but with the highlanders it was actually the front upper class rankers who had the bow while the rear ranks had at best a dirk or farm type implement.
John

This was mainly so the better type of Highlander could get to the sheep first. Those behind just got seconds.

[grahambriggs]

Sorry don't have rules with me so references will be vague. In terms of rules differences the main ones are, Bow* is cheaper for mounted (see appendices of troop costs), shoots with less dice and can charge without a CMT.

It's really in the army list that you see the real difference. Troops with Bow* will usually have decent hand to hand fighting capabilities at both impact and melee. Troops with Bow tend to be less well equipped for hand to hand fighting. In essence, Bow* is hand to hand fighters who can shoot a bit, Bow is shooters who don't really want to fight hand to hand.

In games design terms it's there because giving Bow capability to troops who fight well at impact and melee creates a troop type that is too good.

Bow* isn't the greatest capability. The shooting is often ineffective, and the base cost is high (as you have already bought decent fighting capabilities, then have to pay extra for Bow*). It tends to be a bit of a poor compromise between fighting troops and shooting troops.

[peteratjet]

What puzzles me, a bit, is the distinction between Lance/Bow* equipped troops and mixed Bow/Lance battlegroups. You see this for example with Byzantines who at various dates can have BGs with Lance/Bow* and BGs which are mixed, front rank Lance, rear rank Bow.

The effect is almost exactly the same, either way you get two shooting dice in a 4-base BG with lance at impact, although a BG of Lance/Bow* are slightly more expensive. The only advantage they enjoy is that they still get a front rank of lance at impact even if they have suffered a base loss.

[elysiumsolutions@fsmail.n]

They are functionally much the same.
For a 4 element unit.
Both the Bow* and the bow get 2 dice when shooting in either 1 rank or two. However, when in a single rank the bow has only to get 2 bases in arc whereas the bow* needs all 4. The mixed unit is therefore slightly better at shooting.
As you say at impact the dual armed unit would be better if in one rank or after loses.

Paul

[david53]

They are functionally much the same.
For a 4 element unit.
Both the Bow* and the bow get 2 dice when shooting in either 1 rank or two. However, when in a single rank the bow has only to get 2 bases in arc whereas the bow* needs all 4. The mixed unit is therefore slightly better at shooting.
As you say at impact the dual armed unit would be better if in one rank or after loses.

Paul

Since its cavalry were talking about, I thought a four base unit of Bow* in two ranks got two dice and a unit of four base Bow in two ranks get three dice. It might be I'm not getting something here

[nikgaukroger]

They are functionally much the same.
For a 4 element unit.
Both the Bow* and the bow get 2 dice when shooting in either 1 rank or two. However, when in a single rank the bow has only to get 2 bases in arc whereas the bow* needs all 4. The mixed unit is therefore slightly better at shooting.
As you say at impact the dual armed unit would be better if in one rank or after loses.

Paul

Since its cavalry were talking about, I thought a four base unit of Bow* in two ranks got two dice and a unit of four base Bow in two ranks get three dice. It might be I'm not getting something here

I think they are making the comparison with the Byzantine Bgs that are half lancer, half bow rather than with ones that are all bow