Destroyed BGs and commanders

imanfasil · Post by **imanfasil** » Mon Jan 03, 2011 4:23 am

If a BG is destroyed (autobreaks, down to one base, or unable to rout) what happens to an attached commander?

Thanks for any help!
James

zeitoun · Post by **zeitoun** » Mon Jan 03, 2011 7:17 am

if he can join a friendly BG in his Mouvement range , he joined it , otherwise he disappeared.

nikgaukroger · Post by **nikgaukroger** » Mon Jan 03, 2011 9:04 am

Covered by rules on p49/50 - last bullet point under movement of commanders IIRC.

imanfasil · Post by **imanfasil** » Mon Jan 03, 2011 11:32 am

Thanks Nik.. that page mentions what happens if an enemy BG moves near a lone commander. I just didn't know if a destroyed BG left a commander alone or if it was assumed he was captured or killed with the unit as it vanished. It seemed logical to us that he would be destroyed and couldn't find a reference to it in the rules anywhere.

nikgaukroger · Post by **nikgaukroger** » Mon Jan 03, 2011 12:11 pm

imanfasil wrote:Thanks Nik.. that page mentions what happens if an enemy BG moves near a lone commander. I just didn't know if a destroyed BG left a commander alone or if it was assumed he was captured or killed with the unit as it vanished. It seemed logical to us that he would be destroyed and couldn't find a reference to it in the rules anywhere.

BG is removed, commander sits there looking like a lemon, and then those rules kick in - assuming I'm remembering correctly of course

zoltan · Post by **zoltan** » Mon Jan 03, 2011 7:12 pm

Fundamentally, Nik is not in error.

Melee Phase
1. BG with Commander attached breaks
2. BG attempts to make an initial rout move (Page 100)
3. BG meets obstruction preventing completion of its initial rout move
4. BG is destroyed at the end of the Melee Phase (Page 101) and removed from the table, leaving commander by himself

JAP Phase
1. Move commanders (Page 49, first bullet point under Movement of Commanders)

aventine · Post by **aventine** » Wed Jan 05, 2011 6:13 pm

Zoltan

Yes I follow that line but what if the routing BG does not meet an obstruction and is pursued during the JAP phase when the autobreak only occurs at the very end of the turn. I know that the general could move away before that but if there were no friends close by and he was hoping to out distance the pursuers, that leaves him on his own at the end of the turn and has no move to make sitting in front of pursuers?

Keith

zoltan · Post by **zoltan** » Wed Jan 05, 2011 6:44 pm

aventine wrote:Zoltan

Yes I follow that line but what if the routing BG does not meet an obstruction and is pursued during the JAP phase when the autobreak only occurs at the very end of the turn. I know that the general could move away before that but if there were no friends close by and he was hoping to out distance the pursuers, that leaves him on his own at the end of the turn and has no move to make sitting in front of pursuers?

Keith

Page 101, first bullet:
"A commander who is with a battle group at the moment it breaks must rout with it once. Until the joint action phase he cannot leave the battlegroup...."

So using your example:

Melee Phase
- make intitial rout move
- make intitial pursuit move
- remove router base (Im assuming in your example the pursuers catch the routers)

JAP Phase
- move commander away from routing BG (I can't see any rule that says the commander must move to a friendly BG, so u could move him into the open well away from the pursuers)
- make rout move
- make pursuit move
- remove destroyed BG

petedalby · Post by **petedalby** » Wed Jan 05, 2011 7:10 pm

(I can't see any rule that says the commander must move to a friendly BG, so u could move him into the open well away from the pursuers)

You are spot on - he is free to move where he likes in the JAP.

timmy1 · Post by **timmy1** » Wed Jan 05, 2011 8:47 pm

Pete, does your enclyclopedic (sp?) knowledge of this section of the rules indicate the frequency with which your battle groups rout with a commander attached? Just asking.

petedalby · Post by **petedalby** » Thu Jan 06, 2011 9:24 am

Pete, does your enclyclopedic (sp?) knowledge of this section of the rules indicate the frequency with which your battle groups rout with a commander attached? Just asking.

Not sure about the encyclopaedic knowledge (or spelling) Tim but I find the forum throws up some great questions and I always go back to the rules before I proffer an opinion - and of course I can always get it wrong - and regularly do. And of course this helps me when I do play - which looks like it will be extremely infrequently this year as you know.

A Commander only has to stay with a routing BG during the initial rout move - P101 - first bullet.