Sub vs sub combat GS

[Plaid]

Why in GS subs have sub attack value of 1, but can't attack subs? its...strange.

[rkr1958]

Why in GS subs have sub attack value of 1, but can't attack subs? its...strange.

Because there was only one known instance of a sub sinking another [submerged] sub in WW-II. That was the HMS Venturer which sunk U-864 on February 9, 1945. See: http://militaryhistory.about.com/od/wor ... rer864.htm

Attacks subs are post World War II.

[EDITED. Thanks to shawkhan for helping me correct the record]

[Plaid]

Well, but why subs have sub attack so?

[joerock22]

Well, but why subs have sub attack so?

I think that was just because in regular CEAW, subs sometimes ran into each other and they wanted a little damage to occur from combat. In GS, it's physically impossible for subs to run into other subs, since they just get sent to an adjacent hex if they try to travel to a hex occupied by another sub. As a result, changing the sub attack value to 0 just became unnecessary, and with the amount of things the developers had on their plates at the time, it was probably just an understandable oversight.

[shawkhan]

Not really accurate there rkr, about sub vs sub losses in WWII.
Some examples, ss226 Corvina, ss279 Snook, Spearfish, Thistle, Oxley sunk by its own side HMS Triton, Triad.
There are others, but there was definitely many more than one or a few. Many Italian subs, I believe were hunted by RN subs by doctrine.

[rkr1958]

Not really accurate there rkr, about sub vs sub losses in WWII.
Some examples, ss226 Corvina, ss279 Snook, Spearfish, Thistle, Oxley sunk by its own side HMS Triton, Triad.
There are others, but there was definitely many more than one or a few. Many Italian subs, I believe were hunted by RN subs by doctrine.

Reference: http://militaryhistory.about.com/od/wor ... rer864.htm

HMS Venturer's fight with U-864 is the only known, publicly acknowledged battle where one submerged submarine sank another.

US Corvina loss to I-176 was NOT confirmed.

Reference: http://www.subsowespac.org/world_war_ii ... _226.shtml

Japanese records report that I-176 fired three torpedoes at an enemy submarine south of Truk 16 November, claiming two hits which resulted in the explosion of the target. If this was Corvina she was the only American submarine to be sunk by a Japanese submarine in the entire war. Her loss with her crew of 82 was announced 14 March 1944.

Snook was loss to unknown causes.

Reference: http://www.oldsubsplace.com/USS%20Snook.htm

SNOOK was lost while conducting her ninth war patrol, in the South China Sea and Luzon Strait. On 8 April 1945, she reported her position to submarine TIGRONE (SS-419) and when she did not acknowledge messages sent from TIGRONE the next day, it was presumed that she had headed toward Luzon Strait. On 12 April, she was ordered to take lifeguard station in the vicinity of Sakeshima Gunto in support of British carrier air strikes. On 20 April, the commander of the British carrier task force reported that he had a plane down in SNOOK's assigned area, and that he could not contact the submarine by radio. SNOOK was ordered to search the area and to acknowledge the order. When she failed to make a transmission, submarine BANG (SS-385) was sent to make the search and rendezvous with SNOOK. Although BANG arrived and rescued the downed aviators, she saw nothing of the missing submarine; and, on 16 May, SNOOK was presumed lost, the victim of unknown causes.

HMS Spearfish was sunk by U34. She was running on the surface when sunk.

Reference: http://www.uboat.net/allies/merchants/ships/442.html

HAt 19.04 hours on 1 Aug, 1940, HMS Spearfish (N 69) (LtCdr J.H. Forbes, DSO, RN) was hit in the forepart by one torpedo from U-34 and sank immediately about 180 miles west-southwest of Stavanger. The U-boat was returning from its last patrol as a combat boat and only had one torpedo remaining, when they first spotted a periscope at 18.17 hours and dived. At 18.48 hours, the conning tower of the British submarine became visible and Rollmann fired the last torpedo over the bow. One minute after the hit, the Germans surfaced and approached the sinking position where they picked up the sole survivor Able Seaman William V. Pester (on his first patrol) and took him as prisoner to Wilhelmshaven. The commander, four officers and 36 ratings were lost.

HMS Thistle was sunk by U-4.

Reference: http://www.uboat.net/allies/warships/ship/3375.html

HMS Thistle (Lt.Cdr. Wilfrid Frederick Haselfoot, RN) was torpedoed and sunk on 10 April 1940 by the German submarine U-4 about 20 nautical miles west of Stavanger, Norway in position 59º00'N, 05º00'E. HMS Thistle had attacked U-4 the previous day but her torpedoes missed.

HMS Oxley was sunk the HMS Triton.

Reference: http://www.war-today.com/a-british-subm ... -submarine

O.K., we have one confirmed sinking of a submerged sub and three confirmed sinking of subs traveling on the water. I stand corrected and thanks to shawkhan for correcting the record. However; I think my general point still stands that submarines loss to other subs was a rare occurrence is WW-II and well below the scale of representation in CEAW - GS. 4 subs equate to less to 1-step in CEAW - GS.